In not wanting The Pope to visit uk at the taxpayers expense?

[Alouiseg]

Apparently The visit wil cost 12m pounds. That's 12 million pounds to be pinched from other budgets. For a man who has been responsible for covering up crimes against children.

My MP will receive an email today and I will make my abhorrence very clear.

Tricky one - he's a head of state with diplomatic representation so has to be received on the same basis as other country leaders I suppose.

I can't imagine why anyone wouldn't opt out of paying for the Monarchy TBH!

It is my major problem with the Conservatives, however, I have started to notice the sea of change and pray that one day the party will actually embrace the idea of a Republic! Traditional values does not need to involve Monarchs and subjects!

If he's coming as head of state then by all means treat him on the same basis - a trip to Chequers or dinner at Buckingham Palace maybe.

When was the last time we had to pay security costs for a foreign head of state to parade through the streets?

He is not doing that in his capacity as Head of Vatican State. He's doing that as a faith leader.

The last papal visit (john Paul) was not as Head of State so funded by the church,a decision has been taken to make this an official state visit so will now cost taxpayers.

If the new government is scrapping spending commitments entered into by the previous lot, then I wish they'd have the balls to do the same for this particular piece of totally unecessary expenditure. Surely it gives them the perfect out, without it being deemed a huge insult. Let the pope come if he wishes but not as a state visit funded by taxpayers.

If it's not as head of state but as a faith leader doesn't the church have to pay the bill? If it's a shead of state then the uk pays up. But as he's the pope the two roles can't be separated.

The Queen actually carried out over 375 official engagements last year. That's rather more than most heads of state. I'm puzzled that people think she doesn't work. Do you imagine that she visits cement factories and old people's homes, or entertains the likes of George W Bush for fun?

There are certainly others in that family who could be pruned with no loss to the country, but I don't think you'd get more for your money with from a President Tony Blair, for instance.

I think it's only head of state if you meet queenie but I could be wrong.

Heads of states can visit without it being a 'stste visit' though, in which case we don't have to pay, they do.

it's like did we invite you or did you invite yourself?

OP YANBU but it will be worthwhile to pay all that money and then see the pope being arrested for his crimes. There's a team of lawyers preparing the case against him, I'm "praying" to see it through! Let him come here I say!

But as he's the pope the two roles can't be separated.

sure they can. If he visits the Queen or PM fair enough (I suppose) that the taxpayer pays. If he's doing other stuff like parades then the church should pay.

StrictlyTory: The Queen's an old woman - have some respect.

See - ludicrous argument, isn't it??

I would rather he didn't visit at all based on his stance on sex abuse in the Catholic church. Dreadful dreadful man.

This article sums up my views more elonquently than I could write.

eloquently even..

That article sums it up well for me too MollieO.

particuarly this:
'Religion ? all religion, not just Catholicism ? is supposed to be good for the soul, but everything I?ve written about here pollutes mine. You can?t take lessons in morality from people who disgust you.'

I know it seems an appalling amount and the RC Church has been terrible in its recent history of covering up child abuse, unacceptable, unforgivable, terrible.

but

Many institutions failed children in this and other ways in recent history. Clearly paedophiles have targetted working with children forever.

There is more to the RC Church than just this issue.

And you have to remember the millions of Catholic tax payers who value the Pope, want him welcomed and have paid their taxes for many many years.

It's too simplistic to see it just in terms of money. God knows what we spend on Prince blardy Andrew, Edward, their wives, ex wives, golf trips, Prince Charles' security. I mean bodyguards for Eugenie and Beatrice. Do you think that's cheap?

The Pope means a lot to a lot of UK tax payers. And we spend a fortune on visits by many Heads of State. Some monstrous murdering good for nothing Bastardos among them!

5dollar are you being serious? I did not threaten her with violence! That is the difference, I hate having a monarchy but I don't think throwing eggs at old people is the best way to articulate that to the masses

I was disgusted by this on last night's news. Complete waste of tax payer's money.

queenceleste: your arguments boil down to 'two wrongs make a right'

YANBU and he's hardly a head of state, unless you count four square acres in Italy as a state.

If he wants to come and I do realise there are people who want him to, then he should pay for his own security and if he wants a police presence to get him through the B'ham traffic, then he should pay for it himself - or sell tickets and fund it that way.

He's nothing to do with the vast majority of people in the UK and so I can't see why we are wasting tax money on him.

And given his feeble handling of the whole ghastly child abuse business, I suspect there will be a fair number of people he'll need protecting from. It would be better if he stayed at home and put his catholic house in order.

The Pope is not really a proper head of state, though, is he?

He's head of a (large) church.

Agree.

I don't agree that my argument does.

The RC Church can't just disband and dismantle itself completely because if this truly terrible and awful part of its history. It needs to address it and make sure it doesn't happen again. In addition it has been at least paying at times substantial damages to victims. Not that that makes it better but it's at least something.

I am not a card carrying RC at all. But I know there are millions of devoted Catholics who have paid between them millions and millions of tax pounds who would argue that this is a fantastic way to spend a tiny portion of what they have contributed over the years.

One terrible bad thing does not destroy a whole institution with a two thousand year history.

We live in a democracy which reflects different beliefs and faiths. Why don't you ask the nation's Catholics what they think? Some of them will value this visit enormously. Their desire for it is not irrelevant!

This country spends 12 million a year on countless minority things! For some reason Christians don't deserve any of the pot. We are not a purely secular nation which means we have to reflect and support lots of different sometimes conflicting needs.

I'm actually a virtual Atheist but I do feel sad that we can't have some compassion and generosity for the Christians in our country and that includes the Catholics.

The Guardian today says that the National Secular Society maintains that the overall cost of the visit will be £100 million if you include security. Nuts.