to think that VAT on food might not be a bad thing?

[NotAfraidOfTheBudget]

It probably wont happen, I know, but if it did, would it really be so bad?

Lots of foods already incur standard rate VAT (all of them are processed and the sorts of things we should only have occasionally), now the govt has thought about applying a ~5% VAT on everything else.

AIBU to think that if food cost more, then we might start respecting it more? It has become a disposable commodity for a lot of people, who buy more than they need, throw away a lot, and buy into all the advertising/brand names/pester power, etc. Basic foodstuffs (ie non-processed, plain fruit, veg, meat, fish) is what sustains a race of people. Crisps, ready meals, fizzy drinks, biscuits and cakes should be considered the luxuries. If you are on a lower income, you probably wouldnt buy a foreign holiday, a brand new car, new dvds every week. So why should food luxuries be seen as an automatic right?

For a family on an 'average' (according to the govt) income, adding VAT to all foods will cost around £20 a week. And will bring in a huge revenue to set against our massive budget deficit. You at least then have the choice of cutting your food budget (fewer luxury foods) or accepting it and resign yourself to spending less on going out/booze/lottery/Sky TV/whatever.

Am I also BU in thinking (hoping) that more expensive food might just get people back into cooking real meals rather than relying on the salt-laden, transfat-saturated, convenience meals?

YABU

We are scraping by..just.

We aren't high earners so will have even less if the government scraps the tax credits.

I can't afford to buy crap food ie processed meals/freezer/microwave meals,it's all cooked from scratch.

We used to be able afford more organic and now I can only do this with a select few things ie chicken as a treat monthly,I allow for eggs and milk and that's it,we hardly eat any meat now.

We grow our own vegetables.

I'm at loss how we can save any more money

"Why is food VAT fairer than congestion charging in all towns and charging to use motorways? Or, indeed, charging for (at least some) non life-threatening surgical procedures?"

Personally, I feel like I wouldnt have a choice in having to pay those things. Our public transport system is inadequate and there are times when I have to use a motorway, I have no choice.

And on the medical side - procedures such as wart and mole removal, varicose vein surgery, sebacious cyst removal, laser treatment for birthmarks, all might become chargeable but all are things that really can affect quality of life, particularly for children. Again, I would feel like I had no choice about it.

vaircose veins aren't always removed for cosmetic reasons - they can have complications too.

I cant really afford a lot of meat. Our food budget for 4 is £20 a week (including toiletries and washing powder etc).

I do get a lot of waffles, chicken nuggets etc as they fill you up and are a bit of variation. My husband and I mainly eat that though and give the kids better stuff if we can afford it like tinned fruit. I can get a massive bag of chicken nuggets for a £1 from Iceland and they can last four meals between my husband and I so there is no way healthier food is cheaper than that.

Its cheaper to eat junk than it is to eat healthy. We are all only slim though as although we eat junk we can never afford to overeat or have snacks.

My usual food in a day is something like cereal for breakfast, then pasta for lunch with a small amount of cheese, then 2 waffles and a couple of nuggets for tea and a small handful of raisins.(that would come to less than about 60p a day to feed me.) I have a high mortgage and only have £40 a week disposable income to get all food, toiletries and emergencies so its pretty tight.

YABU - Yes, let's have people at the point of starvation so they respect food a bit more. Why don't we tax oxygen too?

yabvu.

you have to eat to live. therefore what you are suggesting is a tax on life.

those of us that have ethics and morals would be extremely uncomfortable about this.

Gina is right it is cheaper to eat junk than healthy food - taxing crisps / sweets / convenience food / chocolate etc may discourage consumption but it may just mean that people buy what they want and don't buy fruit / veg etc

you know I've never found it cheaper to eat junk than healthy food

when I've been low my motivation for cooking tends to disappear and I end up buying junk, and it costs me a bleeding fortune!

It's quite often looking at the amount I've spent on crap that jolts me back into meal planning and cooking properly again.

I don't buy processed crap but spend a lot as some of our boys arre on medically prescribed diets

I don'tve £20 a week tp spare, do many people? - it would mean us buying poorer quality meat etc and less availability of fruit etc for snacks, that simple.

I think VAT on junk food would be a great idea, crisps, chocolate, fizzy drinks etc. I certainly don't think it should be added to staples, just luxury food items and junk.

(we also have to use motorways- teh severn bridge being after all a M-Way and the only route between ehre and our extended family).

I have no oproblem with a VAT rise across existing VAT rateable items however. I already buy most clothes etc second hand anyway, it is an option.

"there are times when I have to use a motorway, I have no choice."

You always have a choice.

It is called A-roads. Or just getting up earlier and wating for a train.

Food is not a choice but a necessity.

Define luxury food?

Toccatanfudge A pack of 20 tesco sausages £1 a bag of potatoes £1 That will feed a family of three for two meals. That is a pound a meal.

What healthy meal can you feed a family of 3 on that is cheaper than a pound?

Sorry family of four.

I have no idea what it averages out at per meal as I buy sacks of potatoes, and meal plan so that "packs" of stuff lasts for several meal so stuff doesn't get wasted. I don't sit down and work it out "per meal" cost

I just know that recently my shopping bill has been MUCH higher on the weeks where I've been feeling like shite and bought crap, than when I've been feeling more human and planned.

This is the thing,I don't want to feed my children shite ie.value pigs arse and sawdust sausages.

We go without meat if needs be.

20 sausages last a family of 4 for 2 meals?????

YABU in my opinion. Food is a necessity, not choice - you can budget to decide whether to buy many other goods new (ie with VAT) or get them from eBay/sales time. But if you are already stretched with food budget, what corners do you cut then? We don't spend 'extra' on lottery, SKY TV, going out/babysitter... I think our 'luxury' is broadband, and occasional meals out which we can and will choose to cut. I already cook from fresh or frozen (in case of fish, too expensive fresh), use meat rarely, make use of slow cooker and freezer, so not sure what more I can save other than buying low quality meat which I'm reluctant to do. If we have to pay £20 per week more, plus lose out on child tax credits (we are on threshold of joint income currently being quoted and won't get the 'free nursery hours' because of the way our council works) I'm not sure how we will cut corners. Other than either not eating meat (and DS won't eat pulses, so his diet will suffer) or buying crap meat.

OP - "Fuck off you mad Tory bitch" is what I really want to say but that wouldn't be very polite, would it?
Perhaps I'll just say that I disagree with you and YABU.

I would add it onto everything but basic unprocessed food, like fruit, vegetables, meat, fish, grains, including pasta, sugar, oil. etc

eg currently VAT on biscuits but not cakes.

'20 sausages last a family of 4 for 2 meals?????'

Yes easily. I can make chicken nuggets and waffles last me 4 meals if I put beans with it. Thats less than £2 for 4 nights food for 4.

Its needs must. I havent got internet (im at work at the mo), sky, never go out unless its free, havent drunk alcohol in nearly 2 years, never smoked. I just have high housing costs thats all. We are on a joint income of 21k but dont get any benefits except to cover childcare and CB. I work 30 hours and my husband 45. I will just up my hours if I have to if they put vat on it or eat less.

increasing VAT anywhere will have a knock-on effect for everybody - every business will suffer.

for example, if someone has 3 children, and they would biy them one book per month at a cost of £5.00. but VAT has been put on food, which means that £5.00 has now been spent on food. that means that they can't buy the monthly book, because food is more important than books (i know, some people are strange like that! )
and if there are 140 families like that in my area, then i have lost 140 x £5.00 = £700 in one month!

that's about 1/5 of my monthly takings, and i find it hard to get by as it is. (pretty bad june and about £1000 away from being able to pay all my shop's bills this month).
well, that's me screwed.
so i'll have to close my shop (and still have to pay the rent on it until the lease is up because business rules are bloody awful). and i won't be able to get a new job anywhere, because there aren't any.

(i don't know why the number of children was important in my calculation....)