To want my hoarding parents to sort through all their accumulated stuff while they still can, so I won't have to when they aren't able to do it themselves?

[Rumbled]

I bumped into an old friend today. We've known each other since we were kids. We got talking about our parents' hoarding habits. She said that when her mum had a stroke and had to move, it took my friend, her brother and sister four months to clear out their mum's three-bedroom semi full of stuff, around their work/family commitments.

It's been lurking in the back of my mind that one day I may have to face something similar, but I've tried not to think about it. My mum and dad have so much stuff in their four-bedroom house - piles of papers and boxes of old stuff everywhere: lining the halls, piled up in the kitchen, in all the spare rooms, etc. The front room is currently a store room, and we often eat meals on our laps there because there's stuff on the dining table. We're not talking averagely untidy and cluttered here.

Talking with my friend today, and realising that there would be just one of me to sort Mum and Dad's stuff down the line (if they don't deal with it before they're not able to/around), and I'm on my own with a DS ... I panicked! I can't imagine being able to deal with this. Even with help, it would feel overwhelming.

I love my parents dearly and don't want to upset them by bringing this up - Dad will no doubt get angry and defensive, and Mum will feel guilty, and I expect nothing would change - but it seems so unjust, selfish, if they don't deal with this and get it under control while they still can.

Am I being unreasonable to be even thinking about this? Or are my parents being unreasonable to effectively expect me to deal with all their stuff some time down the line? Is there anything I can do/say?

Thanks.

Decorhate that is so right. My mother lives on her own in a large-ish house, 5 bedrooms. She has always been a hoarder but now as she gets more elderly (71 years old) it has got far far worse. The house is feels damp, musty, full of old shite, and I cannot bear to sleep there when I come to stay, nor let my kids sleep there, and my husband flat out refuses. Which means a hotel. Which means I visit a lot less often than I would like.

My mother cannot see this, and I cannot tell her the real reason why we dont stay with her becuase it would hurt her. She hoovers around all the mess and then thinks that's fine, whilst ignoring the piles of papers magazines old clothes books toys in piles on the floor with cobwebs around them.

What can you do? She is comfortable living that way, I couldnt bear it.

With my mother I think it is partly due to her age - growing up during/just after WW2, her parents were self-sufficient and nothing was wasted. I also think it is a bit of a reaction to her own mother who had no interest in possessions. Plus I think she felt defeated
by the mess that comes with having small children and just gave up and never got around to sorting things out when we grew up & left.

I have bought my parents a small metal filing cabinet with dividers in and they have put all documents in it - ostensibly in case the cat wees on them

This is all I can do in our case but I can relate to why they hoard and choose to ignore it.

My only worry is that they'll get sick because they can't see the dirt anymore.

My mum's mother was exactly the same, although not quite as bad, so there is something there that goes way back. As far back as I can remember even as a little girl, I thought our house had just too much "stuff" in it, and I was always trying to clean it, becuase it never seemed clean. I never brought my friends around to my place as a kid because I was so embarrased by the mess.

I have tried and tried over the years to help her clear out, get the house spruced up a bit etc, but even when she has decorated a bit, she starts to let all the clutter build up again and before long it looks the same as ever.

So i have kind of given up now trying to changer/the situation, I got too stressed out and upset, and it was doing no one any good.

My mother in the last 5 years has had to clear her own mother's house, and to help clear FIL's. Both were filled with clutter and she is determined that this will not happen to her. She said that it was distressing enough going through their possessions, but worse because so much was junk (not even sentimental value, talking out of date tinned peaches etc).

So YANBU to be thinking about it, but it's obv a very difficult thing to bring up sensitively.

You really have my sympathy OP. My aunt's house is so cluttered she needs to move boxes out of the bath to have a shower. She's got no children and when she goes it'll be me doing the clearing. Heartbreaking really, as I won't know what's important family archiving and what's junk so tons of stuff will probably get chucked when it shouldn't but I can't devote months and months to going through it.

My in-laws are also bit like this. I think it stems from their pride in not being wasteful, and also thinking that being 'funny' about tidiness is a bit non-u. They also both grew up in huge houses and live in a big one themselves and I think they don't really see why they should throw very much away. What it is sliding into as they get older is just a mess. The first thing anyone who goes to stay at their house wants to do is tidy and clean the kitchen.

They are planning to move out of their 8 bed house this year. And all that anyone who knows them can say is - how long do you think it will take them to organise all that stuff?!

Of course you're not being unreasonable - hoarders aren't happy people any more than the poor sods who have, eventually, to sort it all out for them. It can be a form of mental illness in the most extreme case.

My parents are terrible hoarders and their house sounds a lot like your parents' house. I haven't been there with DS since he was born over 2 years ago, because if I let him go, I don't think I'd ever see him again!

It is a worry though. They seldom throw anything out, and go to car boot sales every weekend and restock all the crap. The house got worse after my grandparents died - some of that stuff never got any further than the hall, where it's still stacked up. My mother can't bear to get rid of things she grew up with. They can't clean properly (this isn't a major concern) and god knows what sort of fire risk it is. There are cats in there, too. I think there are only two, but who knows?

My mum also tries to bring stuff here to our house. She is very well-meaning, but has never, ever arrived to see DS without several items for him - some books, maybe some clothing, toys, etc. Mostly from charity shops or car boots, which I have no problem with whatsoever, but he is a very well catered-for child and does NOT need anything else at the moment! And if I try to siphon stuff he doesn't use any more off to the charity shops, I have to do it on the quiet. She has been known to bring stuff back from charity shops, not realising I've just got rid of it!

I'm really very worried about it. I think they could both have a much better standard of life without all the shite, but they'll never make a start on it themselves. I'll have to be the catalyst, and I just don't have the time right now (it would take months and months - I have a toddler and another on the way). I can't stand to think of them living the next (last?) 25 or 30 years of their lives in a dump full of crap, where their grandchilren can't visit.

YANBU to think about this.

It comes from a thrifty state of mind where everything item has its use.
It depends how you broach it! I suppose it also depends whether is is clutter or organised clutter!
Would it make any difference if they decided to re decorate a room and they went through the stuff in that room working out what they wanted to keep? What if you said you would sort out old clothes/books for them and take them to a charity shop?
I look in despair at the cupboards full of vases - never used - that my mother has. Also, the BROKEN and cracked cups she holds on to which are unusable, unshowable and shoved in the back of a cupboard because she won't throw them out.

Spare their feelings now, in the future you will have the task. I had the same with my dear old mom, RIP, she wouldn't let anything go. She was hurt when I mentioned it, in the end I gave up, just like giving up smoking, she wouldn't stop that. She always complained about her messy house but when I offered she would argue with me. When she died, us 5 children had the task, and between us we shared all her stuff,some stuff to us the family, a lot going to charity and down the tip. So is it really worth the aggro? I now wish I hadn't gone on so much about it. I really miss her still.
You can never replace those times with loved ones,so why make them unhappy.

Depends on whether it is insanitary or not. My MIL was certainly a hoarder, in the sense of keeping/buying more items than she could ever use (50 handbags anyone?), but her house was always clean and tidy. I rather enjoyed clearing out her house when she moved to her nursing home: no harm to me in having kept 4 dinner services (inherited) as long as there are no rats. In fact, I am wearing some of her clothes now, clearly picked up from Tescos in a moment of optimism (I am a size 14 and MIL has never been below 18 afaik) and never worn.

Dh and I agree that though shopping doesn't do it for us, this clearly was something that made MIL feel happy and relaxed, probably to do with hard times as a young woman.

She had a panic attack of guilt about us clearing it just before she went, but all that meant was that she started chucking the really precious stuff out (Victorian photographs, pictures of dh as a toddler) so we then had to salvage that from the dustbin.

YRNBU.

It was a running joke in my family that my parents were the only ones who would get lumbered with the horrendous job of clearing my aged aunt and uncles house that's fit to bursting with crap - floor to ceiling newspapers, unopened mail, cat poo.....

Nothing was done about it because they were so unapproachable. However, my aunt was diagnosed with dementia in October last year and has gone down hill really fast - by Xmas she didn't recongise me and now she doesn't remember how to take herself to the toilet.

She fell over a big pile of old newspapers the other week and has purple bruising from her backside down to her thighs; my uncle couldn't get her to stand up so left her where she fell over night. My uncle, whose mental health is also becoming questionable, is taking the ostrich approach (bury head in sand) to her care, the state of the house and mortality in general and will not speak about it or, even take her to the loo.

Nobody likes to think about their own or their loved ones deaths, but better tackle the subject while they are in good health and rational enough to make reasonable choices.

When my dad died, I persuaded mum to get all her important documents and current bills and paperwork together in one place (one of those metal filing boxes) so that she had stuff to hand. She had bits and pieces in several places, and I wouldn't have known where to start looking. She was still dealing with correspondence to do with dads death, so she actually found it very helpful.

I also helped her clear a lot of stuff out that she just didn't have the energy or the will to start due to ill health. I think she had in mind what an enormous task it would be for me as an only child to have to clear the house after her own death.

Thanks for so many helpful posts.

It's somehow comforting to know I'm not alone and am not imagining that this would be a bit of a nightmare. And of course I'm not just thinking about their deaths/future illnesses solely as an inconvenience to me. It goes without saying I'd be devastated. This thread is about the practical issue of their house needing to be cleared, most likely by me, for whatever reason, which will need dealing with regardless of how sad and bereaved we may be.

I think I feel all the more overwhelmed because, most likely at the same time as needing to clear Mum and Dad's house, I will be taking on the role of carer/care manager for my disabled sister. This is something Mum and Dad do between them at the moment - handling her finances, buying in her care packages, and doing some of the care themselves. I honestly don't know how I would do a good job of looking out for her, clearing the house, being mum to my son and working, all on my own. I do have a brother too, but he lives on the other side of the world, so I'm not banking on his help.

Anyway, having read all your posts, I raised this as carefully as I could with Mum yesterday. I framed it in the context of our family friend, who had the stroke. She remained in hospital for four months while her kids cleared out her house, and from what I understood, she couldn't be rehoused in an accessible flat until her house was in order/sold - hence the long stay. And she loathed this extended stay in hospital.

Mum was great. Very understanding. Realises there's a potential problem looming here. She's on board, I think. Thinking about it, we had a mostly immaculate house when I was a small child. Mum is a fairly tidy person at heart, and tidied up after all of us - us three kids and our appallingly messy dad (who's an old school chauvinist when it comes to clearing up after himself). I think she got worn down by it and resentful and just gave up (and of course, she shouldn't have been doing it, so it was good to stop). And then, maybe because she was/is unhappy - with the accumulating mess, and the dynamic of their relationship - she's been a bit of a buyer and hoarder herself since. And now it's reached don't-know-where-to-start proportions. I could be wrong here, but it's helpful to have an idea of what might be underpinning the problem.

Anyway, thank you all again. This thread really has helped me I'm not a heartless bitch for sometimes thinking/worrying about this, and given me lots of ideas for supporting Mum and Dad in clearing some stuff if they want to - and the confidence to hire skips down the line if they don't.

Hi Rumbled, glad to hear that your mum was receptive to a discussion. I empathise because my MIL is a hoarder and her house is full to the point where whole rooms are too full of stuff to actually use them, and yes, when we go to visit we always have to eat meals on our laps, despite her having a dining room overlooking her lovely garden that could be great if it was cleared.

We suggested that it would be more pleasant for her and for visitors to have a useable dining space and she has agreed that we can help her to clear stuff on her terms, which means gradually. Being the older generation she hates waste and we found that she was happy to part with stuff that was gathering dust if we could find a home for it where it would be used and appreciated. I guess my point is that we have had to be quite gentle and not push too hard as it is a mindset that can be difficult to get out of. From what you say, your mum sounds a little different to my MIL if she used to keep a tidy home but gave up, as far as I know MIL has always been a hoarder.

Those that made a point that it is important to know where documents are kept are right. I had to clear out my cousin's home after he died to try and find his key documents and it was a horrible job and took ages to find them as he had put them in a safe place and not told anyone! We told our close relatives when we made a will that we had lodged key documents with the solicitor and gave them the contact details. You pay for documents to be kept by them but we suggested to our parents that it was a good idea 'just in case'. Anyway sorry for the long post, just sharing in case it helps.

My mum live sin a top floor flat, visited there a couple of weeks ago before she had her hip op - loads of stuff around the place that needs to be sorted out. She went camping up until a couple oif years ago and very active but no way is that going to get used now - needs a damn good clear out. Its a couple of hudred miles from here but may do it whilst she's recovering at a friends house.

Partially as a result of that and realising we also store too much been having a mego clear out - loads of stuff gone on freecycle and most people have just been very grateful. DW was a bit at first, why get rid of old pushchair and stuff - but we never use it now! Is quite now that she can see some space and sort out all the stuff on the shelves.

We all do it - the bigger the space you have the more it gets filled up. If you have not used it or genuinely can't see when you would need something then get rid to someone that will use it.

A couple of mums that are having 'unexpected' bumps also went away with extra clothes and toys after came round for a specific item. So hopefully they can pass the stuff on too - yes its sad to see the little outfits go but we are not having anymore.

Hmm, yes SDD, you are right and it's a nice feeling to have a decluttered house...

Only a feel a tab embarrassed when they come around and say "wow what a great house and they would love to have a garage like this" - which is where I'm sorting out all the stuff. Which is why I'd rather freecycle in some ways and DW says why not sell it as we paid good money - but I don't want the hassle and through MN realise how much a struggle it is for many.

This is an interesting subject, and I have every sympathy with the OP.

I don't think that people have every right to live life as they please and to expect the next generation to pick up the pieces. And I don't think that hoarding things that are no longer useful is a good way to live life.

My parents have a large house but have (fortunately) moved several times and have had some large clearouts. The one thing they have far too many of is books. I am itching to empty their never-consulted bookcases which are a dreadful eyesore and waste of space...

I breezed into my parent's house one day and they were piling yet more stuff into a cupboard. So I asked them what it was, and again it was "something we want to keep, you might need it" I simply replied that it wouldn't really matter as I intended to chuck everything out once they'd gone. they looked a little shocked at that (can't blame them, I had my mind on something else and wasn't really paying attention to how it came out ) but it had an amazing effect.

Next time I visited (a couple of days later) it was noticeable that things have been removed from the house and more space appeared. Both parents are hoarders, but they know I'm not into hoarding, so I inadvertantly shocked them into getting rid of stuff they really didn't need.

"The one thing they have far too many of is books. I am itching to empty their never-consulted bookcases which are a dreadful eyesore and waste of space... "

No no no! How can bookcases be an eyesore? A room is unfurnished without books.

Why are old, yellowing, never-read, out-of-date books the exception to any other sensible household management rule?

Yuck yuck yuck I say. I cull my books ferociously.

Oh Lord, this is all sounding very familiar. The in laws are terrible hoarders, especially FIL.

We have already told them that when they die a giant skip will be ordered and everything will be chucked. I think it was easier to say it to them as they are only young (60) and we're not expecting them to die anytime soon.

4 rooms in their house are rammed with junk 'which will come in handy some day' or 'are worth something'. They will never come in handy and they aren't worth anything. It drives me insane and I think MIL is nuts for letting FIL keep all of this shit.

I think it's also a generation thing. Nothing gets chucked away unless it's totally kaput.

I agree on the generation thing. The memory of not having anything during WW2 makes hoarders of many. My MOL keeps everything "in case the Germans come back."