AIBU in thinking that tax-payers shouldn't fund private schools?

[larks35]

Several private schools in my area are going for Academy status, which will bring them public money, while they can still continue to be selective and charge parents for their child's education.

This is an absolute travesty IMO. I always hated the Academy idea, but the Labour government thought it would help out schools in deprived areas. Now, the Tory/Lib govt. are actively encouraging private schools to take up the status and therefore, those of us who cannot afford to send our kids to the lovely private school up the road are contributing to their funding. Grrrr, it is pissing me off.

"Much better than many secular schools. "

There is no such thing as a secular school in this country!

That aside, any school which requires effort to get into is going, by definition, to have better results than a school that people get into by default. This is nothing to do with faith, it is to do with a higher percentage of parents who think about their child's education, are involved in it and understand the highly complex system. Any school with a higher than average percentage of parents of this type is going to have better on paper results. It's not rocket science to see why!

Church schools follow the national curriculum and teach about all the major world faiths. Discussion is encouraged and RE lessons are definitely not about "teaching myth as fact".

coffefestival - you have to pretend that myths are fact in order to get in though.

At one local primary school I had a look around, the head teacher promised me that children are required to participate in a collective "act of worship" each day, and that there is a weekly assembly where they praise God and learn from the scriptures. Walking around the school, there were pictures on the walls in every room with religious messages, and in one room, children were playing with a "Noah's Ark" toy.

I was told, that according to regulations, I could ask for DS to abstain from religious activities, but was warned that this was not at all recommended for the "good of the children" as they would not want to be "made to feel different". A threat, perhaps? It's not RE, where they learn about all faiths. It's about ramming doctrine down the throats of children whose parents are mostly atheist or agnostic.

I have sent DS private as a last resort. Many of my friends have no choice but to send their kids to this school because of catchment, transport and money issues.

CoffeeFestival

There is a link above to the syllabus of a faith school (it is also an academy, interestingly)

Of several years of RE, they have one hour on faiths other than Christianity.

They also teach that God is the Soveriegn Creator. This is a state funded school.

Their is no justification for the state funding of this tripe. None.

We have Tony Blair to thank for strengthening the hold the church has on education and public policy here. Look at the bullshit he's getting involved in now, convincing the world that religion will be the main focus on the planet in the 21st century, just as political ideology was in the 20th:

www.tonyblairfaithfoundation.org/

Holy jumpin' Baby Jesus on a popsicle stick, the bloke is going to turn back the clock a hundred years.

His missus at it too, letting criminals get off scott free so long as they are people of faith:

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/religion/7154277/Cherie-Blair-spared-violent-cr iminal-from-prison-because-he-was-religious.html

There seems to be a lot generalisations and sweeping comments here.

I went to a private religious school, which was not the same religion as I am. Despite having to do RE GCSE and going to worship twice a week I never felt that religion was "rammed down my throat". It did, however, teach me the many good things that many religions have in common - tolerance, charity, putting others first, understanding that despite the fact that different people may have different beliefs to you, they're not stupid.

I went to private school on a full scholarship - and mixed with the children of both the uber wealthy and the normal, hard working classes of this country and many inbetween. I do not find it at all "hard to relate to my state school peers" - dear reader, I married one.

I've been on the end of inverted snobbery many times and its frankly as disgusting as snobbery, but it seems to be OK to call someone "posh" but not to call someone "common".

Anyway, this is all totally off-track. OP, YABU but I think only because you haven't got your facts right (though I apologise if I have misunderstood). If a private school converts to an academy and therefore becomes free of charge to all, where on earth is the harm in that??

I apologise, I'll make the links easier.

www.tonyblairfaithfoundation.org

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/religion/7154277/Cherie-Blair-spared-violent-criminal-from-priso n-because-he-was-religious.html

The issue has always been about do we make some state schools super good, copy the private, copy the grammars, copy the religious schools or do we dumb down. We will never every achieve total equality and I am not sure most people want that as we want the best for our children whilst ensuring the people employers need to work for them know enough to do good jobs and enable the UK to compete internationally.

The aim in the 70s to ensure there was one type of state school only the fully comprehensive didn't do that well really and religious schools were kept too.

Andy by the way the state religious schools andm ost of the grammars are still no where near most of the very good indendent schools. Soeone was telling me about the truly marvellous state school they'd moved heaven and earth to get their children into. I look up this wonderful one which they said was selective and that's parent with 3 children tehre... and (a) it's not selective at all and (b) it's about position 550 int he country. Some parents just have no idea how bad their children's schools are compared to others. They need more not less information.

And on the whoel you don't pick a private school. It picks you. Most people who apply to the god ones fail to get in as they aren't clever enough. Of course some children are so bright they get 6 offers but plenty get rejected by all as they're not clever enough and that's what we want - little concentrations of excellence perhaps.

I suspect what UK schools need most of all is a total moratorium on any change for 20 years. They 've been messed around with far too many changes for many many years all wasting tax payer money at any turn.

That would only apply if you believe Christianity is a myth ;) The vast majority of children at church schools are those who live locally.

"you have to pretend that myths are fact in order to get in though"

coffeefestival -this depends on where the school is and what other schools are in the area. Where the school in undersubscribed anyone can get in - they will probably be local. Where that is not the case religous criteria will exclude the children of parents who are not prepared to pretend to believe.

TheCoalitionNeedsYou - you're a good egg.

I don't understand why there isn't more of an upoar to be honest. I'm a teacher and a SENCo, in a state school, and we are disgusted with what this government is trying to do which is essentially privatise the state education system. Free schools are more likely to be set up in afluent areas where parents don't have to work all the hours God sends, and would like to really get involved with their child's education. All very positive until you realise that every small free school set up by these people will deprive the local schools of funding. They won't have the support of outside agencies such as the Educational Psychology Service or Specialsit support teachers, which is vital if your child has special needs. Acadamies wil also be unable to access these services that are currently provided by the Local Education Authorities. Finally, it's a great way for the government to save money. Teachers in both sorts of schools do not come under the National Pay and Conditions. Hence they can pay what they like and contribute what they like to our so called 'gold plated' pensions. So please, if you believe in a free state education system, where schools support each other and work together without business bodies being involved, don't support the free school/academy route.

shamster

I'm horrified by the proposals. Totally and utterly horrified by it.

I think it's a grotesque betrayal of the working poor and the long term unemployed, both groups who stand to lose out massively with this scheme.

It also gives a possible gateway for further state schools..

Which is in my eyes (and I rarely swear on here) an utter fucking abomination. Have we learnt nothing over the last few years about what segregation does to socety? Nothing?????

I quite agree! The money is there to support the schools we have. They've also shelved the new national curriculum. Doesn't sound like much but every school had several copies sent out, we were starting to adapt our style to it and, for once, teachers on the whole liked it. It tied in with the Foundation Stage ad put an emphasis on skills. Give people the skills to learn and they will be life long learners. Stuff facts in as the new government want to do, and it's bloody useless. How many facts do we remember from our school days? Anyway, the point is that them scrapping this new curriculum means all the printing costs, The Rose review (which it was based on) and the costs involved in the training that has happened so far, has been wasted needlesly. Not exactly saving money... I too feel betrayed. This is not what I voted for when I voted for Lib Dems.

*sorry meant "further FAITH schools"

Got carried away!