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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think public sector workers

358 replies

firsttimemum77 · 17/05/2010 21:07

Are being 'punished' for mistakes made by bankers / previous government? I work for my LA and at the moment everything around making savings is centred around our jobs and salaries! People think we earn loads, get bonuses etc etc - I certainly don't and I work unsociable hours with no bonuses and a average wage which pays my mortgage and bills...

So AIBU to feel like this or do I deserve it because I work in the public sector!

OP posts:
staranise · 18/05/2010 12:56

Where I live, I am surrounded by people who work in the financial secotr, (City workers, normally front office, lots of hedge funds) whose children all go private, all have expensive club memberships/skiing holidays/ lots of home expansions, getting the basement dug out/help at home etc etc. The last couple of years has seen no change here.

Yes, some were made redundant but the ones i know also got big pay-offs/generous gardening leave and most have found other jobs now.

Of course they work hard but so do the public sector and the discrepancy between the salary levels just seems to be so great. I'm afraid that it is the public sector who will face the majority of the cuts over the next few years. You can't stigmatise the whole of the private sector but it seems that the banking sector in particular has not been brought to task in the slightest for its mess.

scaryteacher · 18/05/2010 13:00

Being only just the right side of 45, it amazes me how every time there is a downturn the private sector bitches about public sector pensions; but in the good times when the private sector coin it in, no mention is made of them, as the public sector don't do so well.

If you wish to blame anyone for the state of the pension funds and the fact that there are no longer final salary ones, I suggest you look no further than one G Brown who took £5 billion out of the pension funds, and I believe has done so every year since 1997.

ZephirineDrouhin · 18/05/2010 13:00

Agree staranise. In London it's very clear that the big division is between the financial sector and everyone else, not between public and private.

ooojimaflip · 18/05/2010 13:00

The debt is not a banking sector issue though. The bail out has roughly doubled the deficit. It was already at around 6%. We will make money on the nationalised banks. Don't know about QE. The problem is that we have all (and I mean personally as well as nationally) borrowed too much money.

flockwallpaper · 18/05/2010 13:01

The part of the private sector you are exposed to is hardly typical staranise. Do you live in London? When I think private sector in my area, I think of the local shops, cafes, plumbers, carpenters, pubs, printing firms, solicitors offices, etc etc. Just ordinary people running their businesses and trying to survive. I don't believe that there is a big discrepancy for the vast majority between public and private sectors.

AuntieMaggie · 18/05/2010 13:01

I agree ooojimaflip

But I do agree that us in the public sector get tarred with one brush sometimes and life in the public sector is very different than it used to be...

flockwallpaper · 18/05/2010 13:01

cross posts...

flockwallpaper · 18/05/2010 13:03

Agree Auntie, I don't even work in the public sector but my friends that do have really varied roles, with equally varied terms and conditions. It is hard to generalise.

staranise · 18/05/2010 13:06

No, where I live is not typical at all, thankfully.

I completely agree that small businesses/manufacturers etc have or will be very hard hit and that the public sector provides some cushioning in teh form of pensions/good HR etc - but I think the OP specified bankers?

I think John Lewis always had the right idea, where the CEO's pay is capped at a particulr multiple of the lowest paid worker - that always seemed fair to me. But then, I'm considered to be something of a Marxist round here...

vesela · 18/05/2010 13:07

am agreeing with everything flockwallpaper says.

splodge2001 · 18/05/2010 13:09

Do you live in primrose hill staranise? hedge fund managers are not typical public sector workers and unless there is some kind of internationally agreed legislation on banking remuneration we can't do anything about their astronomical pay packages.

and if we try something unilaterally we will shoot ourselves in the foot. The revenue they create will disappear to Luxembourg or Switzerland

CaptainUnderpants · 18/05/2010 13:10

I wish people would stop moaning about public sector pensions - they don't get them for free you know .My DH pays 11% of his salary.

If you dont have any pension scheme where you work - you have been warned for years about the risk of not having a pension - so dont moan about other people having one .

splodge2001 · 18/05/2010 13:14

Captainunderpants

god you are naive

PUBLIC SECTOR PENSIONS ARE NOT LINKED TO CONTRIBUTIONS THEY ARE LINKED TO SALARY THEREFORE THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN WHAT YOU CONTRIBUTE AND WHAT YOU GET WHEN YOU RETIRE HAS TO BE PAID BY TAXPAYERS

THERE IS NO RECIPROCAL ARRANGEMENT

Sorry to shout but you lot really need to understand the difference

Penthesileia · 18/05/2010 13:15

splodge O/T: I would be very surprised if you couldn't invest your £400 per month better than in a poorly performing pension scheme. A £4000 p/a return at the end of your working life is not good, as you point out. Have you taken financial advice? Your profile says you are in your early 30s, so if you can save that much now, there's a good chance that there are better options available to you.

I am in the public sector. I am on a final salary scheme. It is decent, but it is also "deferred pay". My sector recognises that it underpays for the skills it needs (e.g. a doctorate), so the pension is an integral part of the package.

When I was finishing my PhD, I was headhunted by a number of different firms and companies. I turned down their generous offers in favour of my current job because I was following my interests and at the time had ludicrously idealistic notions about my role in life (had not yet found Mumsnet & Xenia. If I had, I think now, in retrospect, I would've taken her advice... ). My public sector paycheck is many times less than those which were offered to me from the private sector. Had I followed the alternative route open to me, I could have, by now, saved as much as will be available to me in my pension pot when I retire in c.35 years time (my scheme, like any other, is really only "worth it" if I stay in it for a long time). Wiser friends of mine from university, in their early 30s, have already "retired" from the city jobs they took when they left college.

It is not a zero sum game, btw. When I say, "yes, I deserve my pension" it is not to say that I therefore think you do not deserve a good pension; I do not think I am worth more than you, or anyone. Of course not. It is a scandal not that the public sector offers a good pension scheme (which would, I admit, be more affordable if the sector were streamlined and made more efficient), but that the private sector has been allowed to railroad over the needs and rights of its employees.

And incidentally, my pension scheme is - like any other scheme - involved with the stock market, in property portfolios, etc. It is not the case that the each person's pension is paid entirely from the public purse in a direct manner. Yes, my employwer pays an amount equivalent to 16% of my salary (and I contribute 6.35%) into the scheme, but the scheme is then managed like any other. Furthermore, and perhaps this comes as a surprise, the scheme is already under threat from our employers who plan sizeably to reduce the benefits of it, etc. Public sector pensions are not as "gold-plated" as they appear; only those of the top ranks of the sector. And those in the top ranks do well in any sector.

CaptainUnderpants · 18/05/2010 13:15

Blimey girl - keep your knickers on !

SanctiMoanyArse · 18/05/2010 13:16

www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog/2009/oct/07/public-sector-pay-freeze-george-osborne

No sector should be protecetd any mroe than any otehr but equally the popular notion that the public sector is all overpaid quange driving bureaucrats is also drivel. School cleaners, hospital meal cooks, admin...

Penthesileia · 18/05/2010 13:18

employwer employer.

CaptainUnderpants · 18/05/2010 13:21

Public sector jobs at times can be some of most unpleasant and thankless jobs in our society.

DH is a police officer - one things that may the job attractive nearly 25 yrs ago was the pension - still is.But boy he works damn hard for it like so many public sctor workers.

Not public sector workers fault if others dont have a pension.

I also have a deffered public sector pension - get it when I am 60 - pension and lump sum .

Sorry if you dont like it but dont get so angry about it .

backtotalkaboutthis · 18/05/2010 13:22

RBS still getting bonuses stinks.

ooojimaflip · 18/05/2010 13:23

Penthesileia - but the problem is that contributions of 16% are not ENOUGH to fund a final salary scheme. So the government would have to top it up. And at the moment the government doesn't have any money. It IS deffered salary, and there is a term for an employer who cannot afford to pay it's staffs salaries.

ooojimaflip · 18/05/2010 13:25

backtotalkaboutthis - Why shouldn't RBS staff get bonuses? They are paid out of RBS's pocket not the states. We want to keep the company running as well as possible so we maximise the profit when we sell it.

splodge2001 · 18/05/2010 13:35

So you get a Taxpayer guaranteed pension scheme coz your jobs is unpleasant. In that case abattoir workers should also get guaranteed pension schemes

And all that bullshit about Police working so dammed hard. My dad was horrified at the stunts they would pull to retire early on medical grounds for a full pension, it is endemic

splodge2001 · 18/05/2010 13:37

Ps I don't think they are morally inferior because they cheat the system. Anyone would, it's the system that's at fault

CaptainUnderpants · 18/05/2010 13:39

Spoldge - just step away from the computer and have a calm down , you have no idea my what my Dh does in the police .

Generalisation and judgemental statements are never a good thing on MN.

ooojimaflip · 18/05/2010 13:40

Generalisation and judgemental statements are what MAKE MN.