Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think public sector workers

358 replies

firsttimemum77 · 17/05/2010 21:07

Are being 'punished' for mistakes made by bankers / previous government? I work for my LA and at the moment everything around making savings is centred around our jobs and salaries! People think we earn loads, get bonuses etc etc - I certainly don't and I work unsociable hours with no bonuses and a average wage which pays my mortgage and bills...

So AIBU to feel like this or do I deserve it because I work in the public sector!

OP posts:
vesela · 18/05/2010 12:13

splodge - but they do work hard, though. It's pointless making the pensions issue into an argument about that.

LordPanofthePeaks · 18/05/2010 12:15

vesela - no, no need to dragoon everyone into jobs they have no desire to do. Seems a silly proposition and I have no idea why you would ask it.

splodge2001 · 18/05/2010 12:16

You're right Vesela

I'm just pointing out what their rationale is.

Reallytired · 18/05/2010 12:16

"Why don't I deserve that too?"

splodge2001, come and join us in the public sector. Or maybe you aren't the calibre of person required for the job. Would you pass the interview? Could you do a skilled public sector job?

Prehaps the likes of TheJollyPirate or me are more talented and able than you are.

The public sector offers a package to attract good quality people for often very skilled jobs. That package includes the final salary pension scheme.

Many private sector jobs offer company cars, gym membership, or bupa.

ZephirineDrouhin · 18/05/2010 12:19

Splodge:

"Do you not understand that if you pay tax you are automatically contributing and the more tax you pay the more you contribute.

where do you think the money for the public sector comes from?"

You seem to be suggesting that only private sector workers pay tax. Are public sector salaries tax free now?

ooojimaflip · 18/05/2010 12:19

Why don't you all go and do these jobs that you all work so hard at then?

vesela · 18/05/2010 12:21

LordPan - just that you seemed to be suggesting the private sector might as well pack up and go home. Or be nationalised. Otherwise why characterise it as getting people to buy things they don't want for the benefit of shareholders?

Reallytired, what proportion of private-sector workers have company cars, gym membership etc. though? Or bonuses, for that matter.

splodge2001 · 18/05/2010 12:23

Zephirine... I am not

I was responding to someone saying people who work in the private sector contribute nothing

reallytied

you statement is not true

most people in the private sector work for SME's, most of which cannot offer either health care, cars or pensions

and when there's no profit there's no pay!

SexyDomesticatedDad · 18/05/2010 12:26

The Comp[any car culture started in the private sector as a way of getting around restrictive pay rise limits by the labout gov't. Don't have any figures to back it up (except the Companies I've worked for) where there are Compnay cars, gyms and bonuses. Usually these are there depending on the level you are on - I'd hazard a guess that in general these are more prevelant in the private than public sectors - go look at any higher level recruitment pages.

splodge2001 · 18/05/2010 12:26

The pensions problem is Apartheid, simply immoral and unjustifiable just like anything that segregates opportunity in society

lovechoc · 18/05/2010 12:28

bankers shouldn't be getting bonuses - people who do jobs that really matter (ie public sector) should be reaping the rewards and getting these lovely 'bonuses' for the jobs they do. Seems you are screwed if you do a rewarding job these days.

YANBU.

LordPanofthePeaks · 18/05/2010 12:29

no, vesela it's about choices as to where you work, who for, and why. The private sector has a role, but it is structured around making as much money as possible for a few number of people, and this is one reason as to why I wouldn't ever find myself in there, unless totally desperate. Other people view things differently ( thank the Lord).

Following on from that then, yes, I value and admire public sector workers more than the private sector, all other things being equal. And things we value tend to get rewarded better. So yes, for me an advantageous pension scheme is one why of doing that.

scaryteacher · 18/05/2010 12:30

Teacher

But tell me why they deserve better pensions than us lot????

Are they morally superior???

When there is a war on, or the Armed Forces are required to do the shitty jobs like burning the carcasses of cattle during foot and mouth; standing in for the Fire Service when they strike; then yes, I do think they deserve good pensions.

There are few people out there who are able or willing to do what those in HM Forces do. You want the pension? Join up then and do the 30+ years required to earn it. You would not accept the conditions of service that HM Forces have, and because they do not enjoy the rights that every other worker in the UK has, they get that made up to them at pension time.

ZephirineDrouhin · 18/05/2010 12:31

Splodge you weren't responding to someone who said the private sector contributed nothing actually - you must have been reading it through your angry goggles. He actually said that the interest of those in the private sector is "to get people to spend loads of money they may not have for the benefit of a bunch of already-rich shareholders." Which is not the same thing at all, and largely true.

ooojimaflip · 18/05/2010 12:34

The already rich shareholders, being in very large part, pension funds.

ILovePlayingDarts · 18/05/2010 12:35

Only the highest levels in the civil service are making serious money.

The last time the minimum wage rose, emergency pay rises were given to the lowest paid civil servants in the Ministry of Defence as otherwise their pay would have been BELOW the minumum wage and therefore not legal.

Super pay? don't make me laugh

everyonesatit · 18/05/2010 12:38

I haven't read the whole thread, but to the OP, YANBU to feel you are paying for previous mistakes. YABU to limit it to public sector. I work in the private sector and have been badly hit - with both a pay freeze and a pay cut. I'm one of the lucky ones. Many were made redundant.

We are ALL paying for previous mistakes, but that's the way it is. It has to be done.

ooojimaflip · 18/05/2010 12:40

So the actual main function of the private sector is to pay pensions.

Reallytired · 18/05/2010 12:42

"Reallytired, what proportion of private-sector workers have company cars, gym membership etc. though? Or bonuses, for that matter. "

Depends on how intelligent you are and your financial worth. If an employer wants to attract you then they will offer a good package. I had private health, gym membership when I worked for a small private company. (It had 20 people) I also had a stakeholder pension which my employer contributed to as well as me.

Thick people with no qualifications find hard to earn more than the minimum wage. They will not get offered bonuses or perks in the private sector. There is no business need.

Such people tend to be on short contracts in the public sector so do not get the benefit of the final salary pension scheme.

If you have a poor package in the private sector then look for a better paid job. That is if you are capable.

I work 21 hours a week. I don't go on mumsnet at work. Today is my day off. Many public sector workers are shift workers and that is why they can get on to mumsnet. Where I work Mumsnet is blocked, unless you are IT support and know how to get round the proxy settings.

Even then I have no desire to go on mumsnet, my job is too interesting.

flockwallpaper · 18/05/2010 12:47

The public and private sectors are interdependent, as oojamaflip implies, and it is ridiculous to make assertions that a whole sector is somehow superior to the other. We need both and we should all take the financial pain. Market forces have already caused wage freezes and redundancies in the private sector. The public sector are less influenced by market forces so there is more dead wood, particularly in the quangos.

ooojimaflip · 18/05/2010 12:48

WHY can't we all just get along?

LordPanofthePeaks · 18/05/2010 12:49

Qualifications - intelligent. Otherwise - thick.

I see. Life is a little less black-and-white than this, rt. But that's another thread, nay Section!

flockwallpaper · 18/05/2010 12:49

I know oojamaflip. I have friends in RL in both sectors and we get along just fine.

splodge2001 · 18/05/2010 12:49

ooojimaflip

Makes an important point

we need a successful stockmarket to minimise the burden of public sector pensions on tax payers

And sorry Reallytired it's nothing to do with intelligence

The private sector reformed pensions across the board some years ago less than 15% in private sector get final salary whereas 90% in public sector still do.

I don't think you can make any argument to justify this

LordPanofthePeaks · 18/05/2010 12:54

If thousands of years of history, capitalism, and the human competitive spirit ( and greed) is anything to go by, then we won't be "all in it together" as DC insists, rather those with 'more' already may lose a bit, whilst those with much 'less' will lose proportionally much more. IYSWIM. All in it together implies a sort of fairness and equitability which our ecomonic and social system are NOT designed to deliver.