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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To be seriously worried the new govt are looking at cutting child benefit...

444 replies

cherrymama · 14/05/2010 08:10

to 'middle class' families?What does that mean?We both work but have four kids and losing that income will seriously affect us...so please tell me IABU and that it won't happen!

OP posts:
4madboys · 14/05/2010 10:06

my parnter already does shift work, working for social services in a childrens home, he often does crazy hours, double shifts, does nights at least twice if not three of four times a week. his shifts change every week, and we often only get a acouple of weeks notice, sometimes they can change even after the rotas have been given out.

we have four kids, three school age and one toddler, there is NO way i could get any kind of job to fit around his, his hours are so unpredictable and he has rota support as well, so even when he is not at work there is the possibility of him being called in, ie for staff sickness or because there are problems with the kids he looks after etc.

i have looked at part time work, evenings etc, but dp works three weekends out of every four, and there is nothing available that is flexible enough to fit in with his shifts, let alone to sort out school runs etc.

we rely on ctc/wtc and will be screwed without it, purely because prices etc have gone up so much since we had a family, previously dp earnt the same or less but we survived, now rents/mortgages are so high that we simply couldnt afford to live on just his wage without the ctc.

i suppose we would eventually end up homeless as we would be unable to pay the rent etc and then go on the list for a council house?

we are both university educated and have struggled paying off debt and now have a small amount of credit card debt we are paying off.

we havent lived beyond our means, we budget carefully etc but we will be hit hard by a rise in vat and a cut in tax credits.

itsmeitsmeolord · 14/05/2010 10:07

fair comment ahundredtimes.

4madboys · 14/05/2010 10:08

sorry for typos toddler is climbing on me!

and i do agree expat that people shoudl work if they can, but it isnt always that simple. depending on where you live jobs are nto available and the price of living, rents etc is very high.

lowrib · 14/05/2010 10:08

"I think child benefit should be mean tested. The wealthy don't need it, do they?"

The reason it's not means tested is twofold.

Firstly, it actually costs a lot of money to administer a means tested benefit. You need people to assess people's means, offices to put them in, forms to create, etc etc. It's much cheaper and more efficient to simply give it to everyone and then take it back from the rich via their taxes. Means testing child benefit just creates unnecessary bureaucracy and doesn't necessarily save a penny.

Also it's money which is meant for children. The best way to make sure it reaches all children, including those of parents who wouldn't claim a means tested one (through pride / ignorance / difficulty with filling in forms or whatever) is to simply give it to everyone.

expatinscotland · 14/05/2010 10:10

'Personally I think it's bad they we should be creating a society where people in relationships have to work like that, but there you have it.'

It's not pleasant, but unfortunately it's seeming like it's not affordable for most to be otherwise.

I was watching 'Blood Sweat and Luxuries' last night and it did put things in perspective: in much of the world the woman works outside the home, too.

The difference is, of course, in many other societies there is extended family to help with childcare.

But it's a case of 'do what you can, with what you have, where you are.'

They're in. They're going to make cuts.

Things will need to change for many.

callmeDave · 14/05/2010 10:11

The total amount paid in Child benefit is £11.21 billion.

I think that it is 1.8% of total spending.

I wonder if reducing the amount might be better than scrapping it for 'middle class families'

I get just over £60 a week so I would lose £6 a week with a 10% reduction.

Aore typical family would lose £3-4 a week

A 10% reduction would save over £1billion with no significant admin costs/form filling/fraud problems.

I would be interseted to know what the savings would be if it was scraped for higher earners.

itsmeitsmeolord · 14/05/2010 10:12

It doesn't matter who is in, any party would have had to make large cuts. We have a massive deficit in this country.

callmeDave · 14/05/2010 10:12

A more typical

grumpypants · 14/05/2010 10:13

but osborne has already said they aren't means testing child benefit. The rest, no idea. TBH the hassle of tax credits makes it less desirable than it should be.

MrsSchadenfreude · 14/05/2010 10:14

Dave - I think not very much would be saved if it was scrapped for those in the higher tax bracket, given that it's quite a small percentage of earners who are in the 40% bracket.

cupcakesandbunting · 14/05/2010 10:14

I think I should be the judge of whether I need it or not! I cannot afford to pay for childcare whether it's five or fifteen hours a week. The money simply isn't there. We might fall over the threshold for claiming help with childcare but the salary that meets that threshold will stretch further in some areas than others. Someone earning our income fifty miles away might have the disposable income to afford childcare. We do not and that's all there is to it.

expatinscotland · 14/05/2010 10:15

'and i do agree expat that people shoudl work if they can, but it isnt always that simple. depending on where you live jobs are nto available and the price of living, rents etc is very high. '

Well, no, but life isn't simple. And I do find that, in general, many people are excusers. They make excuses rather than opportunities or being resourceful.

You see it here every day.

Fair play if things can keep going like that, but it doesn't look like they're going to do under this administration.

When you have to, when you really have no choice, you have to find a way to make things work.

No, I didn't vote for this administration, either, but we're stuck with it for now.

Time to get the thinking cap on before we have to file for insolvency.

Chunkamatic · 14/05/2010 10:16

I haven't read all the posts so sorry if I am repeating anyone, but whilst I understand that the deficit needs to be cut and am prepared for how that might affect us personally surely the Tories' refusal to implement a mansion tax shows the unfairness of these proposals?

We just earn over the threshold and both work in public sector, so are likely to see real effects on our income under these proposals. I have 2 young children and I will not be able to afford to go back to work after mat leave as we simply cannot afford childcare for 2 under 3's.

Its just pretty gutting that they cant seem to bring themselves to tax those who could probably best afford it, all because it would upset their mates too much...

porcamiseria · 14/05/2010 10:16

I dont need my £80 a month, I like it but dont "need it". nor do I need my £250 "healthy eating" mat grant.It helps dont get me wrong, but I dont rely on it. hopefully they target ppl like me!

nor do we need the £500 per kids trust fund, silly waste of money

schmontilidrop · 14/05/2010 10:17

Im rather worried about this all.
esp about the wtc and ctc being cut. Im a single working parent and without these i could not afford to live. I get 240 a week. Even if they bring in the £10,000 no tax thing, its no way going to be anywhere near what i get in tax credits.I get more in tax credits that what i earn.

OtterInaSkoda · 14/05/2010 10:18

How will HMRC/the DSS know what our household income is? The potential for over and underpayment is collossal IMO.

The cut off seems high - but imo it isn't at all. Of course Victoria Beckham doesn't need it but I do think that for many families earning £50k suddenly removing £80 a month is going to hurt big time - they have come to rely on it. By the same token there will be families on less than £50k who won't miss it much.

One reason why CB is a universal benefit is to avoid stuffing the sods who earn just a little bit too much. It should stay universal - Victoria Beckham getting £80 she doesn't need is a small price to pay.

dilemma456 · 14/05/2010 10:20

Message withdrawn

ahundredtimes · 14/05/2010 10:20

grumpy - this thread in response to this article here and another in the Daily Mail

I remember in the chancellor's debate, Cable said we should look at means testing CB. He also said, 'it's ridiculous to say the NHS budget won't be touched, it will be, it has to be'

lowrib - thanks. That's interesting. Perhaps they'll be defeated by the prospect of implementing it then.

MintHumbug · 14/05/2010 10:20

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

GetOrfMoiLand · 14/05/2010 10:20

I think that CB should be means tested, however as said above I think the reason why it is not means tested so far is because the admin costs related to everyone's CB claim would outweigh the savings made by making it means tested in the first place.

There must be a lot of people who claim it though and don't need it. I just give it straight to dd as her allowance. It takes the piss really.

I wouldn't like to say where I think the threshold should be but I would say something like a £40K household salary.

worriedaboutskinnybaby · 14/05/2010 10:21

*Chunkamatic" we are another 50K public sector family with double income and the CB was a factor in determining how much I should go back to work. Not going to be life-changing not to have it with one dc, but with two it would really impact on affordability of childcare.

expatinscotland · 14/05/2010 10:21

'Its just pretty gutting that they cant seem to bring themselves to tax those who could probably best afford it, all because it would upset their mates too much...'

Yes, it is. And then their mates always threaten to leave the country and throw their teddies out their pram and instead of showing them the door they're allowed to use that form of blackmail to get out of paying their fair share.

And I truly hope everyone who voted LibDem remembers that at the polls next time (Vote LibDem, get Tory).

I feel sorry for our MP, who is LibDem and does a good job, because he's going to lose his job in the next election, I'd be willing to create a bet on it.

grumpypants · 14/05/2010 10:23

I read that ahundred but tbh it just means the new administration will be reviewing the proposals put forward under a Labour government. No more, no less. Osborne's speech in November specifically ruled out toucjing child benefit, so I'm going to worry about stuff when/if it is actually on the table.

expatinscotland · 14/05/2010 10:24

'I do think the whole Tory-bashing thing is BU though.'

I think it's a moot point now.

I didn't vote Tory, everyone knows that.

But this is what we've got now: a Tory/LibDem coaltion. They're staying for 5 years.

There's nothing we can do about it now but make our feelings known to our MP as things go along.

That's it!

There's blame on both Labour and Tory sides.

But it's spilled milk now.

ahundredtimes · 14/05/2010 10:25

oh yes, I see grumpy. This is spin maybe! We're going to cut CB - no we're not, we're very nice!

Whereas actually, it's a pita to administer and nobody planned to do it anyway.... but we will do this instead....

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