Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Protection built in.

Meet the Other Phone.
Protection built in.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to wonder why so many people don't get married before having DCs?

342 replies

EveWasFramed · 03/05/2010 10:43

I promise, this isn't meant to be judgemental!! But, my DH and I grew up in pretty traditional families, where you got married first BEFORE having kids...it was kind of a negative thing to do otherwise.

I wanted to get married before my DCs just because I thought there should be some kind of (legal) committment to make it more difficult for one of us to bugger off if we got fed up...if kind of 'makes' us work things out if we ever run into any problems.

Don't know...thoughts, please? I am curious...

OP posts:
Original poster
EveWasFramed · 03/05/2010 11:56

Ugh shiny I don't blame you for that...what an awful proposal!!!

And you're right...being married DOESN'T make anyone a better parent. I do agree with you on that.

OP posts:
Reallytired · 03/05/2010 11:59

I'm a scarlet woman who got married when my son was seven months old. My wedding day was nothing more than a party with a church service. It's certainly isn't the most rememberable day of my life.

It hasn't changed my relationship or made us work harder at our relationhip. Frankly I worry about people who get married thinking it will somehow cement a relationship.

sweetkitty · 03/05/2010 11:59

Almost 4 DCs, been together 15 years, have the house, life assurance all those bits, just never got round to it. We are not the big white wedding church people either.

Original poster
EveWasFramed · 03/05/2010 12:04

Reallytired I think it depends on the attitude about 'cementing' the relationship. I think if people get married because they think a formal committment will make a struggling relationship better...that's not a very good idea. However, I did want our already very good and happy relationship 'cemented'...I was under no delusion that it would really change a whole lot, and I didn't want it to. We were happy before, and we're still happy.

OP posts:
mysteryfairy · 03/05/2010 12:06

I still don't understand though. If you are joint tenants I thought your house wouldn't be included so you're only looking at other assets taking you over the threshold? (Which you may have for all I know but I don't think it is a problem for most people!)

I don't understand how you are disadvantaged by being a non UK national either?

Original poster
EveWasFramed · 03/05/2010 12:13

Nothing is in my name, mystery...that's part of the issue, and partially why I'm disadvantaged...

If my DH dies, I am subject to inheritance tax. Our estate is over the threshold. I don't understand it, either, but I don't automatically get everything on spousal right like a citizen would. I have talked to solicitors, financial advisors, AND HMS revenue, and they have all assured me that inheritance tax would apply to me based on our assets, etc.

OP posts:
AmberTheHappyLuddite · 03/05/2010 12:15

TBH, I'm not entirely sure why people get at married at all these days.

I'm a divorcee. I married young. I did it because I was flattered to be asked (aged 16!!) and was steam-rollered into it depsite having my doubts. In hindsight, I should have had the guts to tell everyone to fuck off but hey.

I really do not know why a compus mentis adult would choose to get married for anything other than religious reasons.

There are legal motiviations I know, but prettty much all of that can be accomplished via other means.

Really don't get it.

Original poster
EveWasFramed · 03/05/2010 12:15

P.S. Mystery if you have a way around it, then please let me know!!! Though I have no problem becoming a citizen (it means my DCs and I will share US/UK citizenship), but it's expensive, and if I can avoid AND not be financially vulnerable, then that would be fab!

OP posts:
Alouiseg · 03/05/2010 12:16

Did anyone just fall head over heels in love and wanted the whole world to know?

That has a lot to do with the romantic side of marriage.

Missus84 · 03/05/2010 12:17

I'm pregnant, doubt we'll get married though. We're not religious, and I don't feel a contract will make our relationship any better or more stable (though completely understand that some people do feel that way of course).

If we did get married it would just be for the party.

Original poster
EveWasFramed · 03/05/2010 12:18

Amber...maybe the difference is the youth thing? I got married at 33. It wasn't about being flattered, it wasn't about wanting to be a princess for a day. It was only about DH...I loved him, and wanted to make a formal committment.

But, I was old enough not to be blinded by all the romance that some women get all caught up in. I'm much more independent and practical than that!

OP posts:
mumzy · 03/05/2010 12:18

We lived together then got married when we decided to have children. Legally it is much more straight forward if you're married should anything happened to you or your other half. However since getting married I do feel the formal commitment you make in front of your nearest and dearest does make us work at your relationship when things get tough. Over the years we've learnt to give and take more and put petty arguments aside . I understand marriage isn't for everyone but I feel love being married.

Original poster
EveWasFramed · 03/05/2010 12:20

Alouiseg lol...sort of...but not in a romantic sense...I just wanted people I loved to celebrate our committment...it was just nice to feel all that love from our friends and family on that day...it wasn't about being fancy or OTT, just a lovely, happy occasion.

OP posts:
BarbieLovesKen · 03/05/2010 12:21

Sorry - didnt read all.

For me, I would have always liked to do it "right" (as its said around here), I like the idea of marriage personally and think for some reason that I cant put my finger on that its just better for my children.

It didnt work for me like that though, as dd was a accident suprise. We did however, always plan to get married and definately wanted to before the next baby arrived, we subsquently did when dd was about two.

Have never passed any remarks at all on whether people do or dont (although I can see your point), its a personal thing imo however, recently through studying, I have learned about legal implications of not being married in this country (Ireland) and the privilages/ protection afforded to the marital family - this has changed my mind completely and to be honest, prehaps contraversionally, I think a couple with children who dont get married are absolutely and completely mad not too. If I wasnt married and couldnt afford to do so, I would pay the few euro just to go in to Registrar and sign the license.

That said, I think if more people were aware of how vulnerable they and their children (but particulary the unmarried fathers of these children) are, they wouldnt think twice about it. The government is very wrong not to better inform people.

I know this isnt a very romantic view on the whole thing, but unfortunately it is what it is.

AmberTheHappyLuddite · 03/05/2010 12:23

That's fair enough, but I personally prefer knowing that DP and me are together because we want to be right now. There is no bit of paper making it more difficult to split up. Just a will to be together. As for telling the world - we're far to stubborn to give a stuff what the world thinks

I'm actually starting to think that the sole effect of getting married is to make more difficult to get rid of the bugger if things go wrong!

Iggiepitomisesvacuity · 03/05/2010 12:25

There is no way to judge how committed two people are to each other. I don't think people who think marriage is the "done thing" are thinking too much of divorce/death in their calculations, it seems to come down to what is viewed as "respectable" IME. Hating this facade of respectability is what kept me co-habiting for last ten years! Finally got married recently when no-one at all expected us to still to it, IFSWIM. For me, children definitely a bigger commitment than marriage.

Original poster
EveWasFramed · 03/05/2010 12:25

lol Amber I have a friend who thinks that same thing...she wants to be able to boot the bugger out if she gets fed up with him (though they've been together now like 25 years, so she may only be kidding )!

OP posts:
Alouiseg · 03/05/2010 12:25

.........a bit of a tangent but it's 14 years tomorrow that Dh and I got married.

I'd do it all over again happily.

BarbieLovesKen · 03/05/2010 12:26

Well thats true, hence it being the ultimate commitment to each other.

Can understand where your coming from though..

edam · 03/05/2010 12:27

I never planned to get married. Partly seeing my parents' relationship break down and their hideous divorce, partly all that being given away by your father and expectation that you'll change your name - obviously you don't have to go along with it but marriage smacked of rather old-fashioned attitudes to women.

Lived with the man who is now my dh for several years, then gradually came round to the idea - we wanted to be together forever and it seemed to make sense. (I didn't change my name but I did ask my father to walk me down the stairs to the hall where my wedding was - it was nice to have his support.)

Not sure if getting married before having ds is particularly different to being unmarried - legally of course it has big implications but probably not in a day to day how we live our lives way. It's just the way things happened.

Original poster
EveWasFramed · 03/05/2010 12:29

Iggie...that 'respectable' thing is exactly what I grew up with, and I don't particularly like that arguement.

Also, thanks for that first point..."there is no way to judge how committed two people are to each other".

I did, very naively, think, before this thread, that married people had more level of committment than couples who aren't married, but I am glad to be proven wrong.

OP posts:
BarbieLovesKen · 03/05/2010 12:30

Sorry that last post was to amber

Alouiseg - congratulations

Iggle I used to think the same - that having children is the biggest commitment to eachother. Not so sure now though, think having children together is definately huge but not exactly the biggest commitment to eachother - the commitment is to those children, from each of you individually. DH and I could split up tomorrow, both remarry - our commitment would then be to our new partner, not eachother but nevertheless we would both be committed to our children regardless, if that makes sense.

Original poster
EveWasFramed · 03/05/2010 12:31

Alouiseg Happy Anniversary!

OP posts:
Original poster
EveWasFramed · 03/05/2010 12:32

That's kind of what I was saying about why I got married, Barbie...I wanted DH and I to have a committment to each other, outside our DCs...

OP posts:
mysteryfairy · 03/05/2010 12:34

EveWasFramed - I don't know a way out of it - I was thinking EU worker - same social and tax advantages but then you mentioned US .

If you are working and putting money into assets into your DH name perhaps there is an argument for holding some assets yourself?

I think there are ways of planning stuff in later life but that they are not really appropriate for protecting your assets whilst you have a young family. It sounds like you have already talked to the right people though to cover anything off. I think some insurance policies etc can be written in trust with you as one of the trustees but I'm sure you will have already done that.

This thread has highlighted to me one disadvantage of being unmarried (loss of entitlement to widowed parents allowance) but I think your situation is relatively unusual and it would be a shame if anyone reading this thread who was unmarried and in the position of being a joint tenant and/or having other assets below the threshold got worried that they were massively disadvantaged - they should be able to protect their interest assets by making wills.