to feel that the school needs to help my DD instead of telling me that she may not make the grade?

[oldspice]

My DD is 8 and goes to a highly selective girls school where she has recently suffered bullying.

The teachers initially thought it was her own fault but have now discovered that other girls do see her as a 'soft' target and take advantage. My DD is one of the youngest in the class but is able to hold her own academically but not emotionally. The teachers feel that she suffers from low self esteem and friendship issues and have mentioned that it has started affecting her schoolwork as she is preoccupied in thinking about how others perceive her.

At home and in clubs outside of school she is a happy soul who has no problems in fitting in and making friends. She doesn't seem to suffer with confidence issues outside of school and when I met an independent counsellor (on the school's recommendation) the counsellor felt that she only has confidence problems at school.

If this is the case, then shouldn't the school be finding ways of helping DD regain her confidence again instead of suggesting that she will struggle at 11+ if her work doesn't improve?

I'm really not sure how to help my DD as the Counsellor does not feel she needs regular sessions but that these issues need to be resolved at school during PSHE and Circle time.

Also, I have considerd removing her but wonder if I am then teaching her to 'run away' from problems.

All advice welcome!

I am biting my tongue because I want to say why did you send her to such a ghastly place in the first place - bu I know that is really unhelpful, sorry.

What I want to say is that she is 8. She should have an input into which school she goes to but you should have the ultimate say. And if she was mine she would be out of there today.

the very fact that an 8 year old would say that she didn't want to go to a particular school because "it wasn't fast paced enough" would have all my alarm bells ringing, never mind all the other stuff you've said.

Yup, seeker sums it all up very nicely.

"Yes - they weed girls out regularly who do not make the grade."

And they are already telling you that they think she will not make it?

Kneazle - I think I will throw it back on them because as far as I'm concerned she was doing fine until they stopped listening to her so now they need to get her back to the stage where she feels good about herself.

If the grades don't sort themselves out, I will pull her out - GCSE's are far away and there is no reason she cannot make a go of it elsewhere.

Seeker - right now I am wondering why I put her there - she was so bright and confident at 4 that I wonder if I've made a terrible mistake - but no point in looking back.

I still have to give a terms notice if we are to leave so will review at the end of summer term and if I'm still not convinced re her self confidence I shall find another school for her.

Thanks to all who've contributed - really grateful!

A term is a long time in an 8 year old's life. Take her out now. There are lots of schools.

'She started reception at 4yo and they let girls go at year 2, year 3 and year 4...'

I am just staggered at this. Fancy being told at such a young age that you have to leave your school because you didn't make the grade! It is also educationally ridiculous. I did not read at all until age 8 and I got straight As at A-level and a first class degree.

Just heard an interesting comparison to this school from a school nurse.

We have a very high achieving (state) Grammar in my home town and the bunfight at 11 is something to behold.

The school nurse I spoke to told me she would never let her daughter go there as it has some of the highest levels of depression, eating disorders and stress disorders that she comes across. In her opinion it's too stressful and competitive for the girls to cope with whilst going through adolescence! The bitching is legendary and the parents are terrifyingly pushy.

Maybe an all girls academic hotbed isn't a healthy environment anywhere?

This is because these kinds of school "select" at 4.
You just can't do this, but any child who seems to have any kind of problems they suggest might be happier elsewhere.
Other schools keep up their grades by only taking a few at 4, and then taking a lot at 11 when it is easier to select. Those who can't keep up after 11 may decide to move somewhere less "academic".

Private schools are not all like this, but why would you pay £1000's a year if the local comprehensive gets as good results?

"Private schools are not all like this, but why would you pay £1000's a year if the local comprehensive gets as good results?"

I agree with seeker that not wanting a school because it's 'not fast paced enough' rings bells for me.

That's an adult phrase imvho and an adult way of looking at education.

Personally, from an outsiders point of view I think she is trotting out what is expected of her and interested in pleasing her adults...which of course, nearly all children do

however that doesn't sound healthy to me.

But then I'm out of step. I can't bear to think of 8 year olds being talked of in terms of 'getting great results'

results?

being 8 is not about results. Or shouldn't be. again, imvho.

Sorry Seeker, but that is exactly what the school is probably thinking about.
In my town there is a very selective Girls school (known as Anorexia Central). They select girls at 4 and then weed out those that they have made a mistake with (shown signs of not being the right material for 11 a/A* at GCSE). They expect to have got rid of most of them by 11. (Actually they tell you this if you listen very carefully on open day.)
Those who won't get fabulous A'levels (and those who just want sanity) also leave at 16.

I'm not saying its right, but it is just how these super achieving schools work. Because if they are in the top of the Times 100 list they attract the most pushy parents, willing to pay high fees. But you can't really tell all that from 4 year olds (well some you might be pretty sure of, but not all). Also they find it hard to tell a parent we'll take DD1, and DD3 but DD2 seems a bit thick.

Mummytime that is EXACTLY how it works!

EXCEPT this Times 100 School says thay they 'very rarely' ask anyone to leave and then only if they feel it would be 'in the childs best interests.' In the past they have got rid of kids who have mild dyslexia, behaviour issues and kids whose parents complain that there is too much homework.

In this situation, I really think they are only suggesting that she will not make the grade at 11+ because I am a 'problem' parent as I have dared to suggest that my daughter is being bullied and that they have failed to protect her.

I feel they are covering for themselves by asking me to seek a counsellor for DD1 as they want to be able to say her low confidence isn't their problem. However, this school has been marked as 'outstanding' for pastoral care and I'd like to see some of it....

"I really think they are only suggesting that she will not make the grade at 11+ because I am a 'problem' parent as I have dared to suggest that my daughter is being bullied and that they have failed to protect her."

Possible, although if she´s likely to pass they would surely want to keep her?

Is too much being expected of her & that is the problem?

If she was having problems with her work they would comment on it at every parents evening as that is how they are. As it is, they always say to all parents 'x could improve in...' as opposed to 'x is doing really well in...' That's just their way and judging by the reports we get she seems to be coping ok.

This is the first time they have mentioned any academic problems and I think this is because I have complained re Bullying.

The school does expect alot but nothing she isn't capable of or surely DD1 would be crying and making a fuss about workload?

Perhaps it is the bullying affecting her work though.

Why would she be crying & making a fuss about the workload though-she has been there for 4yrs & knows about it by now.

But tbh everything you say about this place makes it sound awful.

"As it is, they always say to all parents 'x could improve in...' as opposed to 'x is doing really well in...' "-lovely!

Blimey. DDs school is usually in the times top 100 junior schools; its mixed unselective and supports every child to fulfil individual potential, and go on to appropriate senior schools. The only child I've ever heard of being asked to leave was for bullying (doing it, not the victim obviously, or so I'd have thought before reading this).

If you can't get a more helpful attitude from your DDs school, look around some more oldspice - though maybe its easier to find a sane school away from the southeast (I'm assuming thats where you are).

If the school's full of terribly well brought up posh kids, they may not have much experience tackling bullying.
There was very little bullying at my (very academic all girls private) school. Incredible, but true.

I just don't understand what attracts you to this school... It sounds horrible. Why do your daughters attend different schools? From what you've said the implication is that your elder daughter is perceived to be more able than her sister? If that is the logic, I would be very concerned about how that could potentially affect their relationship as sisters and how they see themselves as people. It sounds like already your elder daughter has a specific view of her sister's school as not suitable for her and would feel that she'd failed somehow if she was to be sent there- how awful for both girls if this is the case. Does it worry you that she's thinking this way? I would be incredibly worried. Sorry to be so negative.

I am not trying to excuese them btw, but maybe they arent ready to swing into action. (they should be of course!)

I feel like a headcase now because I send her there It's just that most parents near where I live would kill for a place at this school and all I've done is slag it off

Admittedly, when we were looking for a school at 4+ we applied to about 4 private and the local state. She didn't get into the state and was offered at the others but we were stunned when she got an offer from this School.

Also she was constantly talking about it after the assessments and seemed so excited to go there that we accepted the place.

People kept telling us how lucky we were and how very few kids get in. She also flew through the 7+ into the junior school and we assumed everything was fine until June last year when she started complaining about certain children.

Initially I told her to rise above their comments and ignore them but this year things became too bitchy and she didn't really understand why children were being unkind. The teachers said it was 'just girls'and that they'd grow out of it and that she needed to have a more 'mature' attitude.

Finally, some other parents wrote in to say that DD1 was actually being treated poorly and so the teachers started taking more notice. Now they are being so kind to her and giving her lots of praise etc which will hopefully raise her confidence.

Grimma - I am in the southeast

"If the school's full of terribly well brought up posh kids, they may not have much experience tackling bullying."

In my experience the brighter and posher the children the more insidious and subtle the bullying. And the easier it is for the school to say it isn't happening. Sad but true.

A little unbalanced though this thread. I have had children in very high achieving schools, top 20 who have had none of these problems at all.

You probably sent her to the best school you could and she will benefit hugely from staying and coping with this. It sounds like it's being addressed since other parents intervened which is great. Also they do tend to change classes and mix children up. My daughters' schools I think did that at age 11 and also if there are certain girls in her class who are getting at her could she may be move to the parallel class in September to get away from the problem.

Also you need to decide how bad it is. She sounds robust out of school so that will stand her in goodstead. I've never had to my knowledge a child who are bullied but certainly have seen how catty girls can be about each other, who is in and out, who is not speaking to whom and when and how unfair that is and how one day X is best friends and the next day the enemy.

Do you have exact examples so we can say - that's normal why on earth is she fussing or that's terrible here is how she should manage it?

YANBU about the teachers comments, but I think you are being precious about the fact she is in a highly selective private school. Neither you nor her will be a lesser person if you do decide to move her away - her happiness should be the foremost issue.

Does she want to be there (or does she think she has to say she wants to be there so as not to let mummy down)?

What is most important to you, your daughter being at this top 100 Times school, or her happiness? If she is not happy/comfortable at school her grades may slip. If she was in a state school and these issues occurred what would you do - because therein lies your answer.

Sorry to sound harsh, just my reading of it.
I hope your daughter will be ok

'A little unbalanced though this thread. I have had children in very high achieving schools, top 20 who have had none of these problems at all.

I would say that this is because they are suited to a highly selective school. It strikes me that OP's DD isn't and she should find a school that does suit her. It is always better to find a school to suit the DC, rather than fit the DC to the school.
It always amazes me that people pay for something they don't like. I agree that the posher and brighter the child the more subtle the bullying.
The school are only interested in one thing-their reputation as a high achieving school and if the DD can't produce they won't want her. They are not pretending to be anything else and they are producing what people want. My advice is change the school.