to be really scared of the Tories getting into power?

[Coldhands]

I've never really been into politics but now I have a DS, I am thinking about the things that have helped us etc and I realised that Labour has actually done a lot to improve the things that I think are important.

If the Tories get in, the things they want to change/cut effects me and my family and I am really really dreading them getting into power to the point that it is making me quite upset.

I am on In Cap benefit for M.E./CFS and everytime I have a medical I have to prove how I cannot work. It is difficult to do this with a fluctuating condition that you cannot test for or see and the Tories want to retest everyone on In Cap with harder tests and I am terrified of not passing and being forced back to work where I would end up at square one again and have no energy, have to give up work again and go through the whole sodding process again whilst not being able to afford to live.

Then they want to get rid of the Child Trust Fund for anyone who earns over £16000. My DH earns just over this and it wouldn't be fair to subsequent DCs for them not to have a TF and DS has one so we would have to find the money to start them one.

They want to cut funding to Surestart that I have found to be absolutely brilliant and it really helped me when I had PND. There is more stuff that I can't remember and don't want to make my post too long.

I have sent off my postal vote so I have a voice but me and my DH were talking and we really don't see Labour getting back in as there are so many people who are fed up them and blame them for everything. One reader in The Sun (I know, quality paper that I read) was blaming Gordon Brown for the sodding volcano.

AIBU?

YANBU
People have such short memories.

DC keeps talking about a time for change. What is he going to change if what Herbie says he is gonna do is true? (i.e. not very much specific) He is deliberately vague because the cuts he is going to make if he gets in will adversely affect most working people and especially those at the bottom end. Anyone else notice he never uses the word 'Fair' like GB and NC?

Cos he won't be fair.

And who or what is this 'waste' he talks of??

yep, i'm really worried.
we are scraping by atm, and the loss of tax credits would require me to take on evenings and/or weekend work. but my ds needs me at those times. i work my arse off, full time, and my ds really does need me outside of those times. things became more and more possible for low income families like ours with every improvement made to the tax credit system.
also as a single parent i am damned if i want the tories back in power: they despised women like me. single mothers were vilified. i don't deserve to be vilified.

Thank God he doesn't bandy around 'fair'. Life isn't fair! The sooner people accept this, the sooner health/education can be improved (paradoxical but true).

Yeah righto thanks for that Antoinette

How ridiculous that you may hope and strive for a fair education for all and a fair health service for all. What a bastard !

Governments can make things more fair - you do get that right??

I am not happy with people called antoinette turning up with contrary views.

We need antoinette c and antoinette o.

Sorry that this matters not a jot to anyone else.

After reading this thread, and being relatively new to mumsnet, I am shocked at some of the comments made- if I ever start a thread I think I'll nedd a stronger back bone!!

I despise David Cameron and the Conservatives- throughout their campaign they have constantly jumped on every opportunity to 'slag' off the other parties as if in the playground. Fancy the shadow travel minister using the recent ash cloud as a way of making a dig at labour for the way they handled the national emergency- hmm did any planes crash or people die!?!

I think lib dem will be a wasted vote due to the electoral system and I intend on voting labour. They have done plenty for myself and my family- and the people I work with- the Valuing People Now White Paper backed up by the updated Disability Discrimination Act has changed many peoples lives for the better.

I will have my fingers crossed on May 6th and hope we have ay least another 5 years of Gordon Brown and Labour!

Are you sure?

Have you never had a member of the family needing medical care? School funding? Childcare vouchers?

Or is it more that they have culled heriditary peers and that really affects your family?

Carrots - I think your posts are great, esp the first one. I agree with most of what you say.

I first voted in 1997 and so far have only voted Labour in general elections but certainly won't be voting for them again. Gordon Brown's record as chancellor is shameful - he's bought on credit luxuries that we can't afford and now many of them will be taken away. None of the parties dare to admit just how deep the cuts will have to be. My generation and my kids' will be saddled with this debt for many years.

I don't know who to vote for - considering the Tories but not sure at all. Think they'll all end up doing the same things anyway. We're in such a mess there isn't much choice.

Even though I quite like some things the Tories say, I still laughed a lot at Riven's video.

I hadn't noticed that education funding was 'fair for all'; in fact, it is quite the opposite if you don't live in a Labour urban area.

Not all children as someone pointed out earlier, should go onto higher education, as some are not capable of it.

Labour have ignored those who live in rural areas and have no idea of what concerns them. Brown screwed the Armed Forces for years as chancellor as he didn't 'get' defence, and not much has changed. He has increased NI and other taxes, and screwed pensions.

I can see no reason at all to vote Labour. Voting Tory may cost us money as a family, but at least they have the will to tackle the deficit and acknowledge that there will be austerity for a few years.

Thanks lions

When you're in debt, you either cut down and live more frugally, or you carry on as you are and borrow more. Sadly, the help that Labour's given was paid for by borrowing money (and stealth taxes), and this is the critical point - it's not because they care more, or because they have some magical formula, it's because they've borrowed it.

Eventually that needs to be paid back - and it's all of us who need to pay it.

scary I think you've hit the nail on the head. People keep saying they will vote Labour as otherwise they'll lose money, as if Labour's magic bottomless wallet will continue to provide forevermore.

I find it frustrating that so many people talk about the evil Tories and how Labour is so KIND, so CARING, so GENEROUS - yet it's all about mememe - what's I'll lose, what my family will lose, I will really struggle, etc etc and the Tories just "don't care". There's such a lack of vision about the bigger picture, about spending more than a country has to spend, and what absolute devastation will be greated by continuing as we have been.

Of course I feel for those who will lose out. But believe me, everyone's going to lose out. Not because the other parties don't care, but because Labour has stiffed us right royally and now, I'm afraid, it's payback time.

flirty realistically all of the parties have been taking digs at the rest. It's the way it works. It's irritating and unhelpful but it's clearly not just one or the other - it's all of them. Realistically the ash cloud situation could have been handled better - possibly - given that actually there were flyable corridors - but I don't think any party would have done any better, any faster.

My final point is about fairness. I'm not sure why it's "fair" to only consider the lower income/lower paid. Why is it "fair" to disproportionately tax those who earn more? Given that it seems right to ensure that everyone has a basic standard of living, why is it wrong to be able to improve on that? It's not that people who earn more than others don't care for others. That's seldom the case. Why does everyone have to be the same? Why can't people have opportunities if they're more skilled, luckier, better, do something a little bit differently to everyone else? I've not felt that Labour has wanted to stop this as such, but it seems like a constant complaint that "it's not fair" that some people have more than others. .

The world is made up of a mixture of people. That's the way it is. What's one of those things you say to your kids when they bicker that makes your slap your head and realise how you sound like your mother? Oh yes, "Life's not fair".

DC's school lost £60,000 of their budget for the 6th form last year!
So much for labour investing in education!

Riven, give those of us who are Tories the credit for knowing that there is a difference between carers like you and Peachy, and those (and I've taught them) who feel the state owes them a living and have no intention of working.

"The next time some Tory says those on low income are lazy or workshy he or she is getting dd delieverd to their house!"

That would be very amusing Riven!

herbietea I wanted to come back at you about your statement that the "gap between rich and poor has got wider under the Labour government."

Obviously the stats behind the statements that we both made are more complex so I wanted to put my case. It has taken a little while to gather the information but here goes. My main point was that Labour has reduced poverty while you stated that the gap between rich and poor has increased which may be correct. However the way the stats work it only takes a very small minority of very, very rich people to increase to make your statement accurate.

I think it is more telling to look at the many, many poverty stricken peoples change in circumstance.

So here is the evidence for my point of view that poverty has reduced under Labour:

Small fall in poverty since 1997/8 on the most used numbers under 60% of median income measure. See tables 3.7-3.10 of Households Below Average Income: research.dwp.gov.uk/asd/hbai/hbai2008/chapters.asp

The small fall masks large falls in pensioner and child poverty, but rises in poverty for childless working age adults.

If you want an independent view could do worse than look at the (independent) Institute for Fiscal studies 3 page note on inequality under labour, where they say inequality has increased slightly - though the Govt's tax and benefit policies have generally targeted money at poorer households, and prevented rapid increases in inequality which otherwise would have happened. See: www.ifs.org.uk/pr/ebn123_2010.pdf

For those who really want to understand what's going, you could read the latest IFS report in inequality and poverty here: www.ifs.org.uk/comms/c109.pdf

(And of course measures based on income rather than wealth, or wider concerns.)

Feel free to come back at me.

LadyBlairBlair:

Have you never had a member of the family needing medical care?

Yes. Me. I had to blardy well pay £750 for it because I had a lump in my breast and was going to have to wait for weeks to find out what it was. Believe me, I did not feel happy about this.

My mum had a suspected cataract. Again, she paid to see someone because the choice was that or waiting for months.

School funding?

What do you mean?? Again, we blardy well pay for schools because our local ones are so unspeakably rubbish. There are more children in independent schools than at any time in history for this reason. Again, I am not happy.

Childcare vouchers?

No. I am self employed and don't qualify for anything (is this fair? No. But I don't whinge about it). I fit in being self employed with looking after my own children, so don't use childcare. I would appreciate financial help with this, but can't see any of the parties offering it!

LadyBB, I did say that things will improve for everyone only once people stop bleating on about 'fairness' (which, btw, isn't fairness if you look at it really closely).

Carrots, I like your posts.

Did I fail to mention all the voluntary work I do? Not that this counts as looking after other people, of course.

Secondcoming, I would say that you are pretty badly off according to those figures. That being the case, do you really feel that Labour has been good to you?