After school detention

[Lonnie]

My 12 year old has just arrived home with an after school detention.

Now putting aside any personal issues I have with detention (I dont believe they are a good way to deal with these things but stikcing a pin in that)

My daughter goes to a school that is 20 mins drive away the school bus leaves the school at 3.05pm the detention ends at 3.30. I do not feel it is acceptable that the school expects me to be able to collect her at a time where they have not checked that I am available (as it is I am not on this day because I have 2 other appointments that I am at a stretch to make as it is) the only other way my daughter would have to get home would involve her walking on her own for 20 minutes and then taking the train having to change once again not something I am comfortable with my 12 year old doing on her own.

the other issue in this and that is actually what grates me the most is the reason she has been given a detention is because she has not done her home work (it says in awful almost non comprehensable handwriting even after extention) now usually I would be very well why didnt you do that but in this particular case it is over a piece of computer homework that was saved as a pub file. We do not own publisher in our home it is a £150 piece of soft ware that we have not felt was in our means to buy. Upon telling the school this the first time they simply said they would look into it, nothing was done the 2nd time we told dd1 to get them to print it out for her so she could get it home to do she got told go to the libary, libary says that they cant print out A3 pieces, leaves dd1 again to go to her teacher whom printed out some but not all and dd1 did some of the other stuff on the school computer however you can only book 2x 15 mins sessions of this time and it was not enough for her to get it finished.

now am I unresonable in feeling

1 the detention is wrongly given and that the school is in the wrong?

2 that it is unresonable to expect me to be able to rearrange my schedule (something I cant for that Thursday) to come and collect her (They do lunch time detentions too)

and lastly 3 to out right feel that once the school bell goes at 3.00 then the school has no say in what happens to my child.

1 maybe not deserving of a detention

2 but if it was I think it's very reasonable for parents to accommodate sanctions like this

3 disagree wtih taht too

YANBU - the school should make homework as easy to do ( in the technical sense ) as possible.
I would write/call and explain this and say that your daughter will not be attending this detention ( they can't force her )
but any further detentions that she attains justifiably will have to be carried out at lunch times as she can not get home safely without you to collect her, and you need more than a days notice.

Personal view:

1. yes, the detention is wrongly given

2. they don't expect you to rearrange your schedule - they expect your daughter to rearrange hers. Why can't she walk and get the train? Is it in the countryside? If not, this would have been the norm for secondary children less than 20 years ago, not sure what's changed.

3. If a detention is fairly given (see 1) she is being punished after 3 o'clock for something she did wrong before 3 o'clock. The child hasn't kept her side of the bargain, why would you expect the school to keep theirs?

Again, purely personal opinion.

yes we live in the country side she would need to walk afair distance to get the train and again at our end to get home

I would agree that the detention is wrong, especially as the school have already been notified that you do not have the means to buy this software. The school is putting your dd at a disadvantage and are being unreasonable.

YANBU had this with my dd2 14 her homework was to be sent in via email, we informed school our internet was fucked down but she still came home with detention we refused to sign the slip and she was bloody given a lunch time one her teacher called her a liar about the internet.it hasn't happened again as I went up to school and saw her head of year over them not passing information on.

I think the detention is wrongly given and i would call the school to try and explain the situation again. However, i think if detention inconveniences parents as well as pupils they might have more of an impact on work and behaviour.

I think you may be being slightly unreasonable on some issues. You have an obvious dislike of detentions and saying that at 3pm the school has no say in what happens to my child, smacks of mum thinking her precious DC's are too special to be included in school discipline IMHO.
If everyone had that school of thought, kids everywhere would just do what they wanted as mum would wade in and bail them out. A horrifying thought in my book.
I'd go back to the school & rationaly discuss your relevant issues, like being unable to pick up DD on that day, say you are happy for her to attend detention on a different day. Also address the software issue, however I'm sure if the homework was printed out the teachers would understand if the responses were just done on word or something similar. Also there are many free publishing packages avail on the net.

Do you really (and do the school) think she couldn't have finished the homework in the half hour allocated - the 2 fifteen minute sessions?

I think that's a really important question - did she book the sessions? did she muck about and not get it done? did she bugger off with her mates for a chat and not do it?

school disipline can be carried out during school hours.
my mum had 2 SN children to deal with often on her own, and it was a 5 mile walk to school, she never got us out of detention but made sure the school knew if they wanted to give us detention it had to be done at lunch time as she couldn't get to us after school.
Its not hard, they have enough bloody T.As to help out. - put all detentionees in one room at lunch, 15 mins for eating, rest of time is spent doing lines.

Usually I would be able to come and collect her but that specific Thursday I am unable to due to school matters from the primary school my other children are in.

The school has lunch time detentions if they had given her a lunch time detention I would have had less of an issue with it but as I see it they have basically peanalised her for their own incompetense 1 using a computer programme that many do not have available and 2 not correcting it when it was brought to their attention finally 3 not given her the ability to use the school computers in enough time to write out the homework.

Yes I am against school detention I do not believe it is a good way to correct behaviour nor do I belive it is a good idea to have me drive over to the school wasting fuel and energy when the school has a detention she could go to without this happening. I would have been willing to do so on other days I am not blind to my childs faults I am aware she could have pushed for more time and I have discussed this with her (however she is not a person that pushes well and that is something we are working on how she can be a bit more self assertive) I do attempt to back the school up where able when she got an detention for forgetting her PE skirt 3 times in a row I didnt pull her out of that and nor did I pull my niece out of her detention for wearing pink socks at PE (though i felt it was over zealous behaviour of the school) this one however in my opinion places my child at risk and that I am not comfortable with

You must have known that the school would give detentions before your dd went there so should really have contingency plans for such situations. I do think it's unfair to expect parents to have the capacity to print out homework.Can't she email ITC homework to the teacher?

Ok, so detention may be unfair but I don't think arguing that point with school will get you very far.

Suggest that you phone teacher who gave the detention and:

• ask if it can be swapped for a lunch time detention
• talk about how you can avoid this happening again (without attributing blame)

I think you need to show that you want to work with the teacher to find a solution that works for you all, both re the detention itself and how to get similar homework completed on time in the future

LaurieFairyCake yes the sessions where booked and she attempted to finish it it was finished today with a 3rd 15 min session so I would say not it was not possible to finish in the 2x15 minutes she had allocated to do it. the amount she did that was printed out (about a 3rd I would estimate from the amount of papers she said it was) took her 45 mins to do so she has managed a fair bit in the 2x 15 mins but not all..

Ok, then if she couldn't finish it in the time allocated then i think that you can legitimately bring that up with the school - do it in a friendly way. How many children were unable to complete this? What do you suggest (to the form teacher) I do? How can I ensure her homework is completed in time to avoid detention?

The difficulty is that if all of the children apart from yours competed it in the time allocated maybe she needs extra support and I would come at it from that direction? (I don't have publisher either and I can't imagine all the other kids families do and did this at home)

YABU. Your child did not complete a piece of homework despite an extended deadline. A missed deadline would usually result in a lunchtime detention, but as your daughter has missed two then I suspect that is where the after school has come from. We have a similar behaviour route where I teach. Also, only already late homework would be expected the next day so your daughter will have had time to go and find her class teacher and explain the circumstances thus not allowing the homework to become late in the first instance.

The handwriting of any teacher is not your concern, I have several dyslexic colleagues who struggle with handwriting, but they are all educated to postgraduate level and can at least spell and punctuate.

Oh, and do please remember your final comment next time you want your child's work marked, lesson planned or parent's evening attended as most of that takes place after 3pm.

We?ve had this issue with DC?s schools before ? I do think it?s unreasonable for schools to assume that every child has access to a computer out of school hours. If they require children to use computers for homework, there should be proper systems in place to enable sufficient time for this to be done at school.

On the issue of after-school detentions Lonnie government guidelines makes it quite clear that these are within a school?s remit, and that they are meant to be inconvenient to reinforce the point.

However, it also says that if you can?t ?reasonably make alternative arrangements for collecting your child from school? you should contact the school and explain why your daughter can?t do the detention on this particular day.

'Its not hard, they have enough bloody T.As to help out. - put all detentionees in one room at lunch, 15 mins for eating, rest of time is spent doing lines.'

How ridiculous! TAs are not there to supervise children who mis-behave, they are there to help SN. So you would you be happy if you had an SN child who had support taken away because TA is baby-sitting naughty children?

Why should Teachers have to give up their measly lunch break because your child hasn't done what they should. Instead of blaming the school look to your child. I'm sure your child is not the only one without publisher.

not all T.As are there for SN children, how ridiculous!
I had an ex police officer as a T.A in some classes, and i was in all top sets, and yes they often took over the job of supervising detentionees in a specially built unit!
im not sprouting crap, im telling you what was a very common practice in my secondary school.

Yes in your secondary school. TAs are thin on the ground as there is not enough in the budget for them, in my place there are 6 to cover the whole secondary (and there are a lot of SEN).

What do you think TAs are there for then, photo-copying? As I said, if you had an SN child who didn't get support because someone hadn't done their homework would you be happy? No, probably not.

I would ring the school to discuss the situation with the teacher (don't assume what your DD has told you is the truth).
Point out that you cannot be there to pick your DD up and if they insist on her doing detention then , that they will have to organise transport.
I can't beleive though that your secondary school finishes at 3;05! My Dc's school is til 3.55 every day.They are there half an hour longer than your DD even when sh has detention and they don't.

Tell the school it is not practical to do after school d's and could they make it a lunchtime one?