about the forthcoming BA strike?

[iwastooearlytobeayummymummy]

DS (11)is supposed to be going on a much anticipated school trip next week, but both outward and return dates are strike days.
I can't begin to tell you how much he has been looking forward to this trip.

DD3 (13 )is also away, at the same time, on a choir trip, but flying with another operator.

Excited at the prospect of 2 children away,and happy to leave DD2 ( 18) home alone, DH and I have booked a much needed break ourselves, first time away without the children in 5 years.

Now everything is 'up in the air', no pun intended .

Can somebeody please explain why cabin crew are so aggreived? I've had a look at BBC's overview of the reasons behind the strike, but don't really get it.I also work for an organisation ( local authority actually) that has announced a 2 year pay freeze, recruitment freeze and forthcoming redundancies. Apart from free tea bags and instant coffee I get no other priveliges.

IABU to think they've got nothing to strike over?

okay back to pilots don't have a massive salary-back to my husband earns less than a lot of Heathrow cabin crew.

Back to why do you have to keep putting spiteful jibes.

silver1, you have proved that you don't know how much Heathrow cabin crew earn? The only instance when a pilot would earns less would be only this:

IF A PILOT IS A JUNIOR FIRST OFFICER VS A CSD WITH 30 YEARS FLYING EXPERIENCE. But the pilot will go on to earn considerably more than the CSD in years to come.

OSTG - my DH's claims had nothing to do with petrol expenses. These were for hotel, food and travel to and from airports, and for more than one meeting abroad, and stop making wild assumptions and accusations to anyone who posts on here

More fool you for signing up to a job where your basic pay is not enough for you live on and you have to rely on the allowance to top it up. The clue is in the name - wage and allowance are not the same thing.

Was it the same basis when you signed up 12 odd years ago - wage and allowance - did you decide to ignore that one of those numbers is not consistent and budget according to that? Presumably if you are off sick you don't get paid apart from your basic wage, so why would you think that the allowance is anything other than an extra not a given amount. You cannot guarantee you are not going to be sick, just as you cannot guarantee what routes you would get, therefore what allowance you might get paid, therefore how much you have to spend. Simple economics

If you need more income get 2 or even 3 jobs with a wage like I and many others have had to do in the past. Oh but you can't because what other company would allow you to work one month on, one month off

Erm, I DO NOT read the Mail!!! I saw the front page in the shop this morning

And pilots earn more than most cc cos they have had more training and have complete resposibility for the aircraft; they are viewed as 'senior managers' by the company.

The fact remains, the cc strike isnt about loss of pay, its about crewing reduction. Thats why they have so little support.

Bigredtomatoe, you cannot compare the airline industry to other "normal" jobs. Yes, our income is made up of both basic salary AND allowances. You don't understand that, esp when you then say "what other company allows you to work one month on, one month off".
Let me explain it to you:

with an office job, for example, if you work part time you may work 3 days out of 5, or do 5 half days as opposed to 5 full days, yes? Well, with flying that is simply not possible. IU can't get on a ten-hour flight and then get off it halfway through. For operational reasons, BA say it's much, much easier for them to make me work one month on full time, and then have 1 month off.

On short haul, as flights and trips are much shorter, it's possible to do 3 days on, 5 days off (or something similar to that) as operational requirements are different to long haul.

Pinkycheesy, you're wrong and you know it.

Eh? What am I wrong about now?? I took my pashmina off

So OSTG any reply from your supposed email?

oh do get off your high horse OSTG, you are cabin crew, the job is not rocket science

and again, enough with the assumptions. just one example of my DH's travel for work involved a 6 week tour around Europe and the Middle East. On others he has to leave on Sunday night to be at a customer for business hours Monday, and return late Friday night. Hardly 9-5

you didn't answer my question regarding time's when you are off sick, you don't get paid an allowance for that - no? do you just not pay the gas bill?

I wish you bloody would get off the flight halfway through, passengers would be ever so pleased. And yes that probably was below the belt but frankly i don't care. You're like the child who sits there with fingers in their ears going la-la-la and has to get the last word in.

Enough people have explained their reasons for not supporting your strike, and given very comprehensive knowledgeable responses, and you are still there going la-la-la

Just to clarify it takes 5 years for a newly qualified pilot to earn what a senior cabin crew member does. This is because BA used to pay for their training, they no longer do but kept the pay scales the same. DH accepted this as a reality of life. Just as DH realised that if he wanted a job at BA he would need to swallow this salary scale, so will you have to come to the same realisation, the days of the fatted calf at BA are over. I can't see Willie Walsh holding off from his promise that the cost of the strike will come from Cabin Crew.

Let's not forget those pilots too who pay for 'type ratings' to join certain airlines, usually in the region of £20,000 to become qualified on a particular aircraft type. My dh has never had to do this and I sincerely hope he never will, but if in the future we had to, we'd do it rather than face the dole queue.

Don't forget the cost of gaining the ATPL too. Cost my dh circa £20,000, and I believe it's a lot more now than when he was gaining his some years ago.

BigRedTomatoe, I never said your DH worked 9 til 5. I just wish you understood that somebody whose job was based on travelling then woud have allowances as part of their pay.

If I was off sick I would only get my basic salary. I can't remember the last time I was off sick tho! And the bills/mortgage/debts wouldn't get paid, so I would probably borrow money. That ok with you?

I'm telling it as it is, I've been honest and have answered any questions about my job (which has to be the most scrutinised job in the world from non cabin crew) and let me tell you that I'm very god a my job and treat my pax as I would like to be treated.

Silver, I've had an email from my manager, saying not much really, apart from "thanks for your email"; she doesn't mention my staff travel or the fact that I'd told her I would've been on strike if I was due to fly. Most of you ("The Pilots' Pashmina Wearing Wives" or PPWW )won't believe I did this, but frankly I don't care.
Willie-no-mates hasn't replied to the email I've sent him yet, he's to busy filming himself and then posting videos of himself on youtube and bbcnews (FACT!).

....and lets not forget that pilots have to be well educated, intelligent, calm and clear headed, well trained and are not easily replaced unlike ooh lets think......cabin crew??

MunchkinsMumof2, if you think cabin crew don't have to be well educated, intelligent, calm, clear headed and well trained then please please try and apply for a job as cabin crew, see how you'd get the job .

Since we're on the sublects, when I joined BA each succesful candidate meant that 649 cabin crew hadn't passed the initial selection. Do you think you'd make it past 649 other candidates?

oh i understand, all too well. you just don't seem to understand basic economics and financial planning

i'm glad to hear you've never been off sick, you must be exceptionally healthy given all the reasons you're not allowed to work, ingrown toenail, colds.

If you're never been off sick and work so hard you'd be snapped up by a better employer, but then you wouldn't get the perks, hmmmm

ThickRedTomato, I've never said I've never been off sick! Just that it's been a long time since the last time. Plus the fact that I'm part time lowers the chances of me being sick during my working time by half. I've probably been sick in the last year, but not due to be flying.

Yes, I do work very hard indeed. Funnily enough if you talk to someone who's just started flying the one thing they'll tell you is how harder it is than they had anticipated.
Oh and I barely use my "perks", they're not that great as you and everyone else who doesn't fly thinks.

well now you're just being rude, again. lower yourself a bit further i can't quite understand you

and don't tell me about hard work, i am a self employed artist, doing hard manual work, who has given myself the day off after spending 10 straight days completing a customer job, no days off for me

so tell me, did you always aspire to become a cabin crew member. what was it that attracted you, the long unsociable hours, low rate of pay, abusive customers?

no, I hadn't always aspired to become a cc. I had wanted to become a doctor but had to escape an abusive household, so had to work tu support myself from the age of 19.

From then,I started living on my own and doing different jobs(teacher assistant, tour guide, conference planning, interpreter). They were paid well but local, and I wanted to "spread my wings". So one day I saw an advert for an airline loking for cc who coud speak languages and I decided to apply. I got the job straight away and then just over 1 year later I applied to BA, went through the selection process and got the job.
Here I am. The job itself was fantastic, I've learned a lot and met truly wonderful people. I would've wished to have been in a better financial position at my age, but hey, that's life.

I know it's hard to work as an artist (my father is one), the income is not steady, but I don't understand what point you're trying to make? You can apply to work as cc if you want?

you havn't noticed that i've been mercilessly goading you for the past few hours? i apologise for being a complete bitch but honestly, everything we have been saying was falling on deaf ears i lost patience

you believed everything I said and were led along like a sheep. it's easy to see why Unite have pulled the wool over your eyes and I feel very sorry for you and the rest of the cabin crew who continue to believe that they are working for your best interests

i do hope for your sake that you get some sort of settlement with BA and that Unite do not continue to screw you over

Tomato, how am I supposed to know what part you tell me is genuine and which is bullshit? Honestly, the last thing Mnet needs is looneys making up stuff to see if other Mnetters spot it or not .

Bring back the Pashmina Posse!

Ciao for now, am going to play with my DC.

OSTG - "how am I supposed to know what part you tell me is genuine and which is bullshit?"

exactly, swop me for Unite and there you are

Willie-no-mates hasn't replied to the email I've sent him yet, he's to busy filming himself and then posting videos of himself on youtube and bbcnews (FACT!).

I suspect actually the fact is closer to being;

he's quite busy most days to answer loony emails, and when he's out clearing up after the loons he's even more busy.

When I worked as a full time lawyer, before DS came along, I had an assistant who went through my emails, and filtered out the nonsense, the unnecessary and the waste of time ones so that when I came back from court, or case conferences I only dealt with issues that were important. I expect WW who has a much better job than I did, has a similar person in place, so he will never see your email.

that's terrible

"and don't tell me about hard work, i am a self employed artist, doing hard manual work, who has given myself the day off after spending 10 straight days completing a customer job, no days off for me"

Funniest quote of the week, by miles

Have I just heard on the news that all striking cc have been snet lettrs telling them they have lost all travel concessions?

Did you get a letter, ostg?