To wonder how many people actually understand

[TheLadyEvenstar]

How it feels for the Victim and victims family when a criminal is released or escapes and then reoffends?

I have one hell of a lot of sympathy for James Bulgers family and to some extent understand how she is feeling right now.

1993 little James was murdered, that was also the year i was sexually and violently assaulted, no the 2 were not connected. But one thing that does connect them is Jack Straw made a bad decision on both cases.

He made the final decision on releasing the Bulger killers and also the final decision on moving my attacker from Rampton to Prestwich hospital - the result in both has been awful.

For Denise and her family they had to be notified when these 2 were released, and now that Venables is back inside after commiting another crime - level 4 child pornography - just one less than beastiality and violent pornography/acts.

For myself I was contacted in 2006 to tell me the criminal who attacked me had escaped and was on the loose. Took from November 2006 - March 2007 for him to be caught and then only because he reoffended did that happen.

I know the dread i felt daily and the pain it caused me and my family. Imagine being glad your Dad, in my case, was no longer alive to know he had escaped and that the man who had hurt me was on the loose to do the same to another woman.

Its easy to say, they were children/too young/difunctional family etc but at the end of the day the sympathy should not be with the criminals but the forgotten victims - THE FAMILIES OF THE VICTIMS. Because they will never forget what their child/parent/sibling went through.

harimosmummy - what would locking them up with no prospect of release achieve? It's not going to make the victims or their families suffering any less, will cost a lot of money, and is unlikely to act as a deterrent to people who act of the spur of the moment in the first place.

Of course they are, Showofhands,

I just hope you all live in your own bubbles of tranquility.

As and when you are faced with the reality, I think you will agree with me.

Harimosmummy, if it had been my child, of course I would be baying for blood. It's a natural reaction and I have every sympathy with Denise Fergus. However, do I want that emotional response to inform the law and criminal justice? No - because the aim of our penal system is to rehabilitate and attempt to incorporate offenders back into society, not to throw offenders to the wolves - and I wouldn't want it to be otherwise.

Oh, FFS - Oojaimaflip - with that mentality...

Why don't we just not lock our houses, then it would be much cheaper for robbers to rob our houses and we'd never have to prosecute on the basis that we deserved and they weren't as well off as we were so that's all good.

FFS

By sayanything Mon 15-Mar-10 13:47:49
Harimosmummy, if it had been my child, of course I would be baying for blood.

but, it wasn't.

So I'm not.

FFS!! What IS it with you guys!!!

PLEASE act how you would feel if this were YOUR SON.

Well harimo as others have pointed out, that is why we have a justice system. Because it's not knee jerk reaction to the crime that decides the punishment. You cannot undo the hurt done to the victim's family by any act but you can do what is best for the good of society and in turn, the perpetrators, themselves victims though in different ways.

And, no, I don't think I will ever agree with you on any point. You confuse canine and human psychology on very basic levels. And there's no way you can know your dog will never commit an act of aggression btw.

harimosmummy - I don't know how on earth you got that from my post. What DO you think locking them up forever would achieve? I am fully in favour of locking houses.

Ladyevenstar - I am so sorry that went through such a dreadful experience, and I agree totally with your OP.

"PLEASE act how you would feel if this were YOUR SON"

You're being ridiculous. We are debating the facts of a judicial system, not reacting as personal victims of a crime.

You don't want to debate rehabilitation, you want to bay for the blood of the criminals in a specific case.

The Lady Evenstar -

People often say blame the parents - I don't know if that's often appropriate, occasionally appropriate, or never appropriate, and I don't know if that is correct in this case.

What I do know is that most criminals have a family, they have spouses, children, siblings, brothers, sisters. Those people are not often to blame for anything but will not ONLY lose the person that committed the crime (to prison, probably, they also lose the person they thought they knew) but they suffer persecution at the hands of the general public.

I'm talking about the sister of a murderer, the children of a sex offender, the wife of a paedophile. Losing their loved ones, having to live with the terrible crimes they have committed without an ounce of support or compassion.

Well, yes.. SHowofhands - we will disagree.

Because I KNOW my dog will never be agressive.

As much as I know that there are some criminals who cannot be rehabilitated.

And, I'd like to point out - no one has give me 3 cases of criminals who have gone on to provide something useful to society.

I think the only people who disagree with a knee jerk reaction are those who have never suffered a crime.

"PLEASE act how you would feel if this were YOUR SON."

No, that's exactly the point. If it were up to the victims' families to decide on punishment, our penal system would not depend on rehabilitation or prevention of reoffending, but on revenge, on vigilantism essentially. And I, for one, don't want that.

And you KNOW your dog won't be aggressive in hthe same way you KNOW that Thompson, for example, will reoffend? How do you KNOW that he will and that he can't be fully rehabilitated the way Mary Bell was?

I find it astonishing that every poster who says " if you were the victim you would feel differently", makes the arrogant assumption that those in favour of rehabilitation and the due process of law to achieve justice rather than knee-jerk hijacking of another's pain, have had no experience of violent crime.

Who the hell are you to make assumptions about where people are coming from?

Just because you would all rather wallow in a sense of personal outrage at someone else's desperate misfortune, rather than trying to see what the best resolution for society as a whole is, does not mean we all give way to such unmediated self-righteousness. Whatever our personal experiences.

ok harimosmummy - if you insist:-
Leslie Grantham
Stephen Fry
Nelson Mandela

and as for convicted criminals not going on to be useful members of society, it would be more fruitful to look at recividism rates rather than base your assertions on your gut feeling.

Frank Sinatra.

Jeffrey Archer
Jonathan Aitkin
Martin McGuiness

Jimmy Boyle

I was going to put Archer but just couldn't.

"I was going to put Archer but just couldn't."

Johnny Vaughan

Nick Leeson.

It took resolution, believe you me.

The fact is haris, we of course know that SOME offenders will reoffend. But until we decide to keep ALL offenders locked up because they MIGHT reoffend, we have to say they have paid their due to society and let them get on with their lives, with whatever appropriate monitoring.

If you can hand on your heart state you know for certain which offenders will reoffend, then fine. But you can't.

Erwin James

erwinjames.co.uk/biog.html