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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

In thinking that a couple living in a one bed flat with 2 kids should not have decided to get 2 dogs ?

252 replies

nevereatbrownsnow · 08/02/2010 21:45

Am watching tower block of commons and really don't see the logic in this.

Both dogs are peeing everywhere, those children have no beds and there little playspace is saturated in dog urine.

Children deserve a bed at least and cleanish floors to play on, makes me feel

Seems selfish, they have little money and feeding two dogs of that size is not cheap.

Feel really sorry for the poor girl in temporary accomodation tho.

OP posts:
GetOrfMoiLand · 09/02/2010 16:39

Well if you say that every one of these people who are feckless feckers are depressed it is a bit of a slap in the eye for people who are depressed, and have been cripplingly so for years, who struggle to manage and actually do raise their children without smoking like troopers, getting plastered, having no bedding for their children and living in hovels.

Sometimes there has to come a point where the sympathy stops and you look to the people as making a choice in life, and feeling able to judge and say they made the wrong bloody choice. You choose to spend £40 on fags as opposed to buying a second hand bed for your kids for example.

And I am not saying this from some ivory tower life where I have had it easy. No. I grew up with people who made the wrong choices. I grew up having to make difficulyt choices myself. And I am by far the perfect mother but dear god my daughter did not have to live in a flat where she had no bedding and where there was dog piss everywhere.

expatinscotland · 09/02/2010 16:41

Applauds, GetOrf. Bravo.

Well put.

MorrisZapp · 09/02/2010 16:42

Seconded.

DoingTheBestICan · 09/02/2010 16:43

The real issue here though is what do we as a society to ease these people off benefits & back into work?

Our country is in massive debt & we cannot sustain the benefits culture that has become a way of life for so many.

When & how do you say enough?

Sassybeast · 09/02/2010 16:43

Can't argue with that Getorfmyland.

Original poster
nevereatbrownsnow · 09/02/2010 16:43

Some people are just lazy, dog piss hoarding twat bags,fact. And that fact must be accepted.

OP posts:
amber1979 · 09/02/2010 16:44

£42 a week on cigarrettes??? What were they? Yves St Laurent? (sp?)

bronze · 09/02/2010 16:45

amber 20 a day I'm guessing
I dont know how much straights cost these days but that would make them 6 quid a pack

junglist1 · 09/02/2010 16:45

at dog piss hoarding twat bags

GetOrfMoiLand · 09/02/2010 16:45

AND I smoked in my skint days, But I couldn't always afford fags. I used to watch Coronation Street of an evening and yearn for some of the cigarettes I saw over Rita's shoulder in the Cabin. But was too skint and it would have meant fags or food.

I do not want to come across that I am stamping on people when they are down, but seriously and truthfuilly there is no need for people to live like that in this day and age.

And as judgy as you may think I am for saying this, those people in that flat: if it was their telly and not their microwave which had gone on the blink, am pretty sure that they would have found the wherewithal to fix it.

sarah293 · 09/02/2010 16:46

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TheCrackFox · 09/02/2010 16:47

Great post Getorf.

I think it would be incredibly shit to live on benefits but £42 on fags is taking the piss. We can make all kids of excuses for this but somewhere down the line she has to start taking some responsibility for her choices and how they negatively affect her children.

GetOrfMoiLand · 09/02/2010 16:48

Thanks everyone - smoke came off my fingers as I typed that stream of consciousness

I hate the way that this is how working class people are deemed to be. It is so not the case for the majority of people on low incomes, most of which are lkiving decent and productive lives. However it doesn;t make as interesting telly.

amber1979 · 09/02/2010 16:51

I smoked until a few weeks ago- I spent about twenty quid a week on rollys.... Even that I decided was too much.

I do think that people do just get into a rut though. It's hard to change your mindset - maybe her social worker should give her a lesson in how to role em lol, if she really can't quit.

pooexplosionsareimproving · 09/02/2010 16:52

Exactly getorf. too fucking right etc.

Morloth · 09/02/2010 16:54

Showing people living normal (if tight) lives isn't very interesting, which is presumably why it doesn't happen very often.

"Got up, took kids to school, got on bus to work, worked, stopped at supermarket for stuff for dinner, got on bus, picked up kid's from CM, went home, cooked dinner, did homework with kids, threw a load of washing on, put kid's to bed, did the ironing, watched telly, went to bed" rinse and repeat.

It not nearly as interesting as "got dogs, baby played in dog wee, partner went gambling/drinking, I smoked 20 ciggies".

2old4thislark · 09/02/2010 17:15

I propose nevereatbrownsnow for PM and GetOrfMoiLand for chancellor!

I agree with it being about choices - making the right ones for our children. We all mess up sometimes for very complex reasons BUT dog piss and shit and small children in a flat are not a good combo!

I love my dogs but in the end if I'd had to choose between them and my children, I'd have put the kids needs first and given up the dogs.

A good parent, no matter the circumstances, is someone who can put their childrens BASIC needs before their own!

TiggyR · 09/02/2010 17:29

Amber - I agree with you. I believe that if a couple (or a single woman) decides to have 6 children it is the state's responsibility to give her a four or five bed home. And if she wants ten children, then we are definitely duty-bound to provide her with her own small hotel. And probably some staff as well, because ten children would be hard work.
And as the poor common folk shouldn't be prevented from dog ownership when those horrid middle class toffs are allowed to have as many as they want, and no-one complains, I would also make it law that as soon as you get your staffie-cross you are entitled to an extra £50 a week and an immediate upgrade to a house with a large garden, (so you needn't miss any telly by walking it - you can just open the back door and it can crap for a whole half an acre and your kids could run around for days without actually standing in any. It's the least the government can do.

2old4thislark · 09/02/2010 17:36

Apparently when benefits were brought in early last century they were in the form of 'food stamps' (I read an article written by an elderly person who had been raised in extreme poverty so I presume this is true).

This was eventually changed to monetary benefits to avoid the social stigma as it was seen at the time.

I wonder whether this would be a workable system now, maybe in the form of a prepaid card.

Contentious, I know, but I really object to money going on fags, booze and dog food and not being spent on the kids!

sarah293 · 09/02/2010 17:39

This reply has been deleted

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2old4thislark · 09/02/2010 17:53

I wonder if it was a computerised card it would just reject the fags, booze etc......

DoingTheBestICan · 09/02/2010 18:06

What about the middle aged man who smokes 10 cigs a day who has worked all his life,suddenly finds himself redundant & having to rely on benefits in the form of computerised cards?

Not all people on benefits take the piss,a lot of people have shitty luck & through no fault of their own find themselves stigmatised as benefit lazy arsed bastards

KimiLivesInStarbucks · 09/02/2010 18:07

I think a dog in obligatory is it not

Some people are just stupid

TiggyR · 09/02/2010 18:16

It takes a very highly motivated owner to manage a dog in a flat. It will need to be taken outside four or five times a day to pee and given a off-lead run at least once a day. And even then, it's less than ideal. Any idiot who cannot see that is surely not safe to be in charge of children, never mind dogs. I have two dogs. With annual vaccinations, insurance, and their food bill they are a luxury item. A joy, yes, but like skiing or boob jobs or a champagne habit, they are an expensive non-necessity, and nobody's responsibility but mine. Would I have them if I struggled to pay my rent and clothe my kids? Of course not. I'm not that STUPID. I have enough sense to know that just because I want something, doesn't mean I'm entitled to have it.

We should definitely go back to benefits being paid directly to landlords and utilities companies, and a return to food and clothing stamps etc. It's the only way to ensure that the money is spent in a way that benefits the people who need it most ie the children. What's a bit of stigma, compared to knowing that your children will have a warm house and a hot meal, no matter how dim and short-sighted you are? The idea of removing all stigma is where it has all gone tits up. It's what has allowed people like Amber to think we are all entitled to get ourselves into any old pickle we like and the government should pay, whilst others struggle valiantly with real problems.

2old4thislark · 09/02/2010 18:20

DoingTheBestICan I see what you mean but smoking is still not a necessity - nothing to do with being a lazy arsed bastard as you put it!

It will certainly take tough measures to make some of the feckless put their kids first and others may get hit by the fall out BUT is it wrong to at least try and find a way to deal with this matter?

Anyone else got any suggestions?