To think Simon Hoggart could have got up and helped this "fraught and harrassed looking woman" instead of just feeling sorry for her.

[bumpyboo]

This is what Simon Hoggart wrote in Saturdays' Guardian.

"Baby buggies seem to get steadily bigger, so that if you're behind two mums having a chat, it's like being blocked on a motorway while one gigantic truck edges past another at a total speed of half a mile an hour.

The other day two of these vast things, like scaled-down SUVs, were wheeled on to a packed bus I was in. The first juggernaut occupied all the space provided for strollers, so the other had to block the whole aisle, making it impossible for other passengers to move.

That mother looked fraught and harassed, and I felt sorry for her, but it didn't occur to either of them to get off and wait for a less crowded bus"

Err maybe you could have got up and helped her fold the buggy Simon?
I've sometimes waited for ages in London for a bus with space for a buggy so when one comes you usually have to get on it and when you've got a baby its pretty hard to fold the thing up and hold the baby as well especially on a crowded moving bus.
Here's the link if anyone wants to look.

www.guardian.co.uk/theguardian/2010/feb/06/climate-change-simon-hoggarts-week

I think this has made me very happy that I no longer live in London. When my dcs were babies, I used to get the bus a lot. They were buses with steep stairs and no push chair spaces. The very lovely ladies who got on the bus with me used to hold my shopping and dd while I got the folded buggy and ds on the bus and then went back for the shopping. What a shame our cities have no similar sense of community.

I think we've strayed into a different thread here. No-one's arguing that people should fold up their buggies where possible (I think), and I am that someone wouldn't move out of the buggy space if a wheelchair got on.

But the point of the original post was that SH (twat) obviously has an issue with big buggies (and who knows what he classes as 'big'? For all we know one of those mums had a Mac Major that people are describing above, and a disabled child) and seems to think that women who have buggies shouldn't travel on buses.

I'm with tethersend. Fold him up and put him in the luggage rack. Or better still, give him a buggy for the day (any buggy, big or small) with a small baby in it, attach a toddler to the side, a few shopping bags underneath and get it pouring with rain outside, and then roll your eyes if he tries to get on a bus and suggest he get off and catch the next one.

Oooooo he really gets my blood pressure going!

God is he whining about buggies again
How ungallant and pathetic that man is

So does anyone have any suggestions for me? Easy fold smaller buggy that I can put my 6 week old in (I think my previous post got lost on bottom of the previous page) so ww can travel more easily on the bus?

ReadingTeaLeaves - what about a sling. Lovely for the baby and there is nowhere you cannot go and it takes up no room. Obviously might not work if you have back problems though.

"I do wonder why teeny tiny babies need buggies bigger than the average adult wheelchair though."

Babies do grow, though!

I wouldn't spend money on a pram (sorry, I hate the word 'buggy') that my baby was going to outgrow in a couple of months.

Some babies don't like slings beyond the newborn phase, and some babies are whoppers who'd do you back in if you carried them in a sling all day long past a few months old. Or wriggle and yell. Not much fun.

It doesn't detract, though, from the fact that if you use public transport a lot, you should consider getting a smaller push-chair once they're beyond the 3-month stage.

ReadingTeaLeaves - I had a lie flat umbrella fold Maclaren, which was suitable from birth. Had a quick look, it was a bit like this. Suitable from birth (though I used a sling and then a backpack a lot more! The one I got doesn't exist any more - dd1 just turned 10!

RTL I'd use a sling. I had a baby bjorn with mine and it worked a treat. I think the maximum time I could stand it was about three hours, but when they were only six weeks old I think it didn't really matter how long they were in there (some mums carry their babies continually after all). I loved it actually, made me feel reall close to my LOs.

Oxford Street is hell on earth, with or without a buggy. A sling will keep your hands free, keep your baby away from the crowds at a scary level and ensure you don't have to ask an oblivious Londoner to help you lug the buggy up the steps at Oxford Circus.

Agree with the sling idea (& the Simon/luggage rack suggestion) for young babies but at 20lbs my PFB is just not slingable for anything more than a 30 minute excursion.

I used a MacLaren from birth. There are a few umbrella models from them and other makers that are suitable from birth.

In my experience, a toddler in a sling on the bus can be worse for everyone involved than a buggy.

OK. Will be using a sling (Baby Bjorn) today - I am using it a lot for shorter trips but haven't ventured out for several hours with it before - will see how it goes.

Does anyone know if there's any issue for babies to be in one for several hours (given that they're not supposed to be in a car seat for more than 2 and surely there's more chance their spine is in a funny position when they're in a sling). I realise this is off topic - just thought you might have some thoughts!

And from 3 months bubs will be in the very easy fold pushchair so I can cause as little inconvenience to others as possible!

CornishKK - backpack? (for your 20lb-er, not SH. Although it might not do him any harm.)

RTL - don't know if there are issues, but presumably you'd be able to take a break and take the baby out at some point? Personally I'd be more worried about my back!

maclaren techno xt is suitable from birth and umbrella fold. slings also brill - if you can try something other than bjorn, you may find comfier options (and easier on back too). as long as baby gets popped out of bjorn a few times for break/feed, it'll be fine. good luck with ox st!

The problem with BBs is that their crotch takes their weight - their little legs are dangling and it puts pressure on their lower back.

With wrap type slings, like Calin Bleu, they sit into the sling, with their bottom taking their weight, and their knees pocking upwards (like a wee frog).

Yes, you do see some women with their babies on them all day long, but I'd only do this with the latter sort of sling, not a BB-type sling.

Second that LJBrownie - we had a techno XT from birth (returning to the shop the mammoth 4x4 one we had bought as PFB parents luckily they let us swap as we hadnt used it yet). Best transaction ever made. Mclarens nip on and off buses and can be folded though admittedly you need an obliging businessman to hold the baby while you do this. I remain totally puzzled as to why anyone living in a city who ever uses a bus or train would get one of those bugaboo/quinny things. Bonkers. All the bugaboo users in my NCT group had bought a mclaren xt by the end of the first month and wasted £600 a piece. Whoops.

Thanks all. Right...I'm off!

Yes I totally agree that Simon Hoggart should try a day out in London on public transport with a baby, buggy and toddler.
Just what got me about the article was that he saw someone obviously having a hard time and his only thought was that they shouldn't have got on the bus, no community spirit, no attempt to empathise.
I just find that really dissapointing

And again, he is a twat.

Go out with baby in buggy. Take sling. While waiting at bus stop, transfer baby from buggy to sling leaving both hands free to fold buggy and heave it onto bus and stow it safely in luggage compartment out of everyone's way. When you get off bus, unfold buggy and replace baby in it.
That's what I've generally done because until recently most of the buses around here have been old ones and you couldn't get an unfolded buggy on.

Plus I have never ever mastered the art of folding buggy one-handed, even my little Mothercare Jive stroller which is meant to be one-handed.