to think that schools admissions aren't fair

[picklepud]

This is different from saying that I wouldn't go through the system if my child's local school had religious criteria, but I am feeling a bit sad and up in arms for a friend today. Same old story, her local school (primary) is c of E VA. She's not, and chose not to get baptised or go to church twice monthly. So now she will have to drive to her allocated school. So incidentally will many of the people who got in on religious grounds from way away. I really really would go to church for my dd to get into my local school, so I'm not criticising those who do, but I just don't think it should be necessary. Or that religious commitment should give you priority in a state school. And particularly that the vicar should not pretend for a minute that he (as he said in a newspapaper article) say that this is a school in the heart of the community serving all the children of the community.
I know, I know, some people might genuinely change through exposure to the church but I don't think it's the way for a church to expand its membership. sorry. and sorry it's so long.

Good luck wubbly I'm sure it will all come good. If DH believes and is happy to practice then why not.

Our idea is maybe that DH will take the children to church and I will tag along to keep them company

Oh the whole thing just stinks. Am sick to death of it.

Quite agree with Lady Biscuit (at 19:45)

7 YEARS?

Crikey mikey spacedog you win a prize for that one

i am not catholic but would happily convert to get my kids in the local catholic school

Right if now being compared with bribing business people then this is the end of my contribution to this thread

TantieTowie - missionaries are highly distasteful. Please don't mention them as a force for good - they really are zealots who undermine local communities in a lot of places.

Where I live 9 out of 10 of the schools in my borough near me are faith schools. Which means that every person who subscribes to a faith has a choice of at least one more school than I do as an atheist.

I've just looked at the census data for my area. 47% of people would consider themselves Christian (no distinction between Catholicism/CofE/other Xtian faiths made), 12% Muslim and 0.5% Jewish. So there are 40% of the population who are supposed to send their children to the one remaining school? That's entirely rubbish

willsurvive I don't think you were being compared to corrupt business people. I think Imsonottelling's point was about the unclarity (as your Archbishop would put it) of the admissions criteria, which the printed material would have you believe were definitive and non-negotiable.

willsurvive this don't get the wrong end of the stick.

I am simply saying that if the rules as published are not actually the rules, then how the hell is anyone to know what the rules actually are?

the whole point of publishing the rules was to get rid of accusations of preferential treatment, and yet there is still preferential treatment, which is not openly mentioned in the rules IYSWIM.

I am arguing about the rules, and lack of transparency, not about your personal situation.

Willsurviethis - dont take it personally. Its an emotive subject and good to debate.

dont forget hypocracy ISNT. After all did nt a prominent politician recently send his child to a non catchment faith school. Not even his faith

Lady biscuit - that is really offensive about missionaries - most have been an incredible force for good - working with the sick, providing education, helping to stamp out slavery. You do not know what you are talking about.

Just speed-read all 36 pages. Can't get over the fact that some people on this thread seem to think that us non-churchgoers aren't up for it because we're lazy or think it won't be fun. Perhaps its because we don't believe in God or organised religion. Or is that not a pre-requisite for attending church any more?

Don't forget that regular attendance of church also discriminates against those who work weekends/shifts, those who believe but are not into organised religion, those who are disabled and unable to get to church etc etc etc

I feel like a teenager now. SNOFFAIR.

www.independent.co.uk/news/education/education-news/faith-schools-lead-to-greater-segregation-of-chi ldren-1671664.html

and here www.telegraph.co.uk/education/educationnews/7066954/Atheist-David-Miliband-sends-son-to-faith -school.html - for you ISNT

-school.html

What, ferncottage, like Samaritan's Purse you mean who won't give out the donations they've collected unless the recipients rescind Allah and embrace Jesus?

I have an issue with proselytising. I think it's patronising and racist but I suspect that's a discussion for another thread.

YANBU.The school admission system as a whole is unfair. Its all about discrimination and keeping people in their places whether that be achieved by wealth or relegion.

I don't think faith and education should be linked but dont see how that can change if the church owns the schools. However,I do think that faith schools ahould have their non-relegious intake to reflect the % of their money they recive from tax payers. So, if they recieve 50% of their funding from the government then 50% of their intake should be taken based on the same criteria as other non denominational schools.

I thiunk schools have to allow entrance as per the entrance criteria or they would be in a heap of trouble when people appeal -- and people appeal all the time. However, I think a vicar's child will almost always make the cut because 1. His parent is obviously a committed churchgoer and 2. The vicarage is probably very close to the church and probably the school as well.

Our vicarage is definitely one of the closest houses to the school.

"Mrs Miliband, a violinist, started attending a church affiliated to the school two years before the boy gained his place. "

HA!

willsurvive this would have clocked her straight off the bat and given her mega-eyebrow eh?

Good article, I have to say i like the cut of mrs milliband's jib.

We (DH and I) should stop procrastinating and do something, a la wubbly.

"Mrs Miliband, a violinist, started attending a church affiliated to the school two years before the boy gained his place. "

Interesting. I don't know where Mrs M lives but round here in SW London the admissions criteria is to be attending church for 3 out of 4 sundays of the month for 2 years prior to application. Perhaps Mrs M read that bit....

Haven't read all of this but thought I'd throw in my two penn'orth anyway. We're waiting to hear which school DD is going to go to in September - our first choice was a CofE school for many reasons, including that I really liked it when I looked round, it's near enough to walk to and it was a lot more diverse than the other schools I looked at (DC are mixed-race).

But the admissions form was a nightmare. I'm Jewish, my husband is Sikh, but neither of us are religious. How could I pretend to be so, go to church, get the kids baptised (assuming we'd even be allowed to given our respective cultures) just to get a school place? Surely I'd be the biggest hypocrite alive?

On the flip side of all of this my brother (an atheist like me) objects to his DD singing hymns and saying prayers in her non-religious state school. So my question is, if religious people want to send their kids to a school that supports their values and beliefs, then those who send their kids to secular schools should be given the same consideration. It's a nonsense.

Unquietdad put it best - there shouldn't be faith schools, end of story.

At our secular primary parents have the choice to opt out of anything religious and some do. None of the children think it is strange when other children do so.

Feelingsensitive its not what you know, it who you know.

Oh I don;t know, sounds like Mrs M did it by the book to me...