To think my normally sane DH is in danger of looking like a racist prick?

[FlamingoCrimbo]

DH just forwarded me an email that has been forwarded to him and to other people at his work by one of his colleagues.

I'm hoping he's not forwarded it to anyone except me - it doesn't look like he has.

It's one of those ones called 'border law'. Just found a US version here - swap the US references to UK ones.

DH is just misguided, IMO, sending this on - he ought to know I'd find it offensive. But it's made me wonder if IABU to find it offensive and to think it's probably been written by someone in the US equivalent of the BNP or at least widely distributed by BNP supporters.

So - AIBU and, if IANBU, how would you tackle it with him? He's very lovely, kind, and, sometimes, misguided so I don't want to upset him. I had to stop myself replying with 'you know this email makes you look like a racist prick, don't you' but that's not really very nice, or helpful!

I dont personally give a shit about the email now (sorry OP...) , but I DO think our immigration policy is fucked up

Does this make me a BNP voter???

I dont thinks it's right that birth centres in some urban areas are overwhelmed by immigrant mothers why have never gone in for ante natal check ups, hence it all goes wrong and resources are wrongly diverted

I dont think its right that we have to spend millions on translation services because people dont make basic efforts to learn the language, and this after being here for YEARS

I dont think its right that some schools suffer because over 50% of the kids start school and dont speak a work of English

I dont think its right that some immigrant families have 5+ kids in the comfort of knowing that the state will pick up their housing, health care and education, and this is with both parents not working

I do however think that as a rich country we should offer asylum, but its gone a bit crazy in the past 5 years and its FUCKS ME OFF then when you say this, you are instantly branded a BNP racist

I have always been proud to live in a multicultural society, and I am proud that the UK is a tolerant place. But its gone a but OTT in recent years, everyone knows it but people are too scared to say it, hence BNP get in!!!! This is not a black/white thing either. I know people local of all coloours who share my opinion

MsDoctor, we don't treat illegal immigrants any better than other countries - they get to work shitty dangerous jobs for (a minimal amount of) cash in hand, and if they get caught, they get deported.
They don't get benefits/council houses/all the rest of the crap the BNP makes up, and the gullible believe.

(porcamiseria, are you italian?!)

calm down, porca! You are not called a BNP racist if you have some issues with immigration. You are if you vote or intend to vote BNP.

You are fully entitled to give your opinion as long as you don't resort to BNP propaganda and cheap shots.

breathe in..... and out......

sorry, but I just saw this tit for tat going on and I felt a bit annoyed!!! Its such an important issue and we pussyfoot around it, there seems to be no middle ground between Nick Griffen and bleeding heart lefty liberals and that annoys me

no sono inglese!

I thought we had the odd amnesty? Although I was confusing the illegal immigrant with an immigrant.... apologies.

porcamiseria - It isn't a black and white issue, I agree, there are massive grey areas where the convenient stereotype doesn't fit. Like the grey area where many, many immigrants actually do work hard, pay their taxes and contribute a great deal to this country. In this grey area immigrants do not cause all the problems that you have listed in your post.

And yet, you would never know it because nobody looks beyond the headline or the propaganda to see the real story or the real people.

porcamiseria - It's not racist to say that we should restrict immigation becuase it strains our resources. But it is selfish.

OOJA
why is managing the economy, and managing immigration selfish? Its common sense, and every country does it in one way or another

Its so easy to say make sweeping comments like that.....

and accio, you have managed to make me sound like a racist! There are millions of hardworking immigrants that add so much value to our country, I am not disupting that

But cant you see in parallel that what I point out IS happening, or are you in complete denial?

"They don't get benefits/council houses/all the rest of the crap the BNP makes up, and the gullible believe."

I'm not sure this is true. I know people who have entered legally, stayed illegally, and then claim.

Certainly there is free health care after a year and certainly before in emergency cases.

porcamiseria - because it values the 'worth' of inhabitants of this country more highly than inhabitants of other countries.

Ahem: are you suggesting we supply and medicate the entire world? Every country functions along these lines, while still tendering a helping hand to the needy.

is that unreasonable? err is that not the whole point of paying national insurance and TAX, so you contribute to your own countrys resources? then benefit from them

I agree we are bloody lucky to be born here, or within the EU, very lucky.

I'm saying I can't see a moral reason why we shouldn't. Of course, this isn't going to happen, but we should not pretend that refusing entry to anyone who wants to enter the country in order to improve their circumstances is not a selfish act. Can you provide a moral justification for it?

People crying BNP are odd -- seemingly you don't see the difference between Britain and other countries, when it comes to the welfare state. Even the difference between Britain and other European countries. It is as if you feel if Britain were to discriminates (in the genuine sense of the word), it's racism, but for other countries it's natural. Because to criticise other countries' attitudes would be racist too.

This is very circular, no?

Oooji, if a stranger comes to your door and says I want to improve my circumstances, can I have dinner with you and sit and watch your telly tonight, what do you say?

Please tell me you'd say yes, I like a bit of consistency.

Yes I can, that in providing indefinately for everyone (and I mean everyone) that wants to enter the country will be at the detriment of UK taxpayers, simple

porcamiseria - But that argument says that UK tax payers are more important than those who want to enter the country. How is that morally defensible? It says that my life, desires and needs are more impotnant than, say, an Albanians. I'm sure Albanians would disagree.

peacock - No I wouldn't. But I should. I walk past the homeless too. Just because everyone does it doesn't make it right.

Take a different example - if your family could get a better standard of living by moving to another country, should you be prevented from doing so, as it would prevent someone from that country doing the job?

TheShriekingHarpy/Peacocks - (Almost) no one lives a morally blameless life. If we did all live according to principles of sharing and fairness that we attempt to teach our children, Daftpunk would have to love her neighbour, I'd have to let randoms into watch the telly, and we would live in a socialist utopia.

Expecting someone to live according to a set of principles is like asking water to flow up hill. We are all to a greater or lesser degree, venal, selfish and ignorant.

What we CAN do is make policy according to the best principles we have or to at least achnowledge that we are breaking them in our own selfish self interest. There is no moral high ground in restricting immigration.

OOJA if your family could get a better standard of living by moving to another country, should you be prevented from doing so, as it would prevent someone from that country doing the job?

thats why people cant just up sticks and move to the US or Australia, I am OK with that, fair enough!

Off topic, but a similar thing comes up with school places - one of the things that parents who fraudulently get places for their children are accused of (other than the whole fraud thing obv) is depriving other children of the opportunity to go to this school. Of course all the children who get in legitimatly are ALSO depriving other children of the opportunity, but this never gets mentioned.

porcasmieria - well it pisses me right the fuck off. It's completly inconsistent with their free market principles at least in the case of the US.

Immigration does have to be restricted to some extent.

If anyone could get into the country with no restrictions and could access the entirety of the benefit system right away then the country's economy would collapse.

And then we wouldn't be in a position to help those that do need helping around the world and to grant asylum to those that need it.

To do those right and moral things we need an economy powerful enough to handle them.

So to an extent we put locks on the doors.

If we try to help everyone we can help no one.

By accepting that we can't help everyone we're in a position to help a few.

And that's how the moral logic can work.

No country, even the US, has a completely free market based economy.