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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to think if your 3 year old pulls your hair you should not do it back?

89 replies

nappyaddict · 08/11/2009 12:27

I know I know I shouldn't judge and it may have been a once in a blue moon thing and never ever happened before and will never ever happen again but the other day I was in Primark and a girl of roughly 3 years old was being carried around by her mum. The girl then pulled her mum's hair and her mum pulled her hair back and said "See, it hurts doesn't it."

Do lots of people do this and it is seen as acceptable because I've never seen it before?

OP posts:
booboo78 · 09/11/2009 00:36

My dd2 developed nasty habit of biting dd1 (never me or dh) we tried several different forms of discipline/punishment but nothing seemed to stop this behaviour.

When dd1 finally had enough after several weeks of this and bit her back, dd2 just bit her even harder!

Morloth · 09/11/2009 08:01

I can't remember what my parents did about swearing and it hasn't come up with DS yet. Must have been effective though, I would sooner bite through my tongue than swear in my mother's presence.

Will have to ask her.

PixiNanny · 09/11/2009 08:13

I don't think it's particularily wrong, especially when used as a last resort. I'm interested to have seen this thread as I remember being ganged up on when I said that I didn't think smacking (as a last resort) was wrong....

wb · 09/11/2009 08:22

Ds2 went through a terrible phase of hair-pulling between 15 and 19 months. The victims were me and ds1 and it was very painful (he was a 2 hands in and full weight down kind of child) and relentless - maybe a dozen times a day. After a couple of months of this it was really starting to affect his relationship with ds1 who just wouldn't go near him any more (the 'he doesn't understand he's just a baby' thing wears pretty thin after a while). I tried everything - big voice, ignoring, distracting, time out in playpen. In the end what worked was pulling his hair - in a controlled way, not enough to make him cry obviously but enough to show him it caused an unpleasant sensation whilst saying 'no' in my sternest voice. After doing this maybe twice or 3 times he stopped doing it altogether. Wish I'd done it sooner tbh.

nappyaddict · 09/11/2009 09:20

I remember swearing on three occasions. One time I got chilli sauce, the next it was tabasco and the final time it was soap. I didn't think anyone would do that sort of thing nowadays but perhaps I am wrong?

OP posts:
shockers · 09/11/2009 11:06

If my mum had done that I would have just made sure she didn't hear me next time.

morloth Sam or Dean?? ( you can't do both!)

Morloth · 09/11/2009 11:12

I swear, just wouldn't do it in front of my parents (or DH's parents) or their friends.

Definitely Dean, he is such a simple boy, very refreshing. Sometimes I feel a bit motherly towards Sammy and other times I think phwoar so am conflicted.

shockers · 09/11/2009 11:27

I know exactly what you mean. It's Dean for me. Sam is more my sister's type and she's a lot younger than me... I'm coming over all unneccessary just thinking about it.

seaglass · 09/11/2009 11:28

When my DS started biting, I did the scream then ignore thing - he thought the screaming was hilarious, so did it more.
I completely ignored him, didn't work, I took away favourite toys, didn't work.
One day, I was at the end of my tether, and warned him that I would bite him back, so he could see how it felt - I did that once, and it's never happened again!

Morloth · 09/11/2009 11:30

It was the episode with the "Eye of the Tiger" clip at the end last night.

Was giggling insanely.

shockers · 09/11/2009 11:33

I wasn't watching but I've seen that one before...almost wet myself ( before falling even more deeply in lust... I love a man who doesn't take himself too seriously!)

shockers · 09/11/2009 11:34

Sorry folks... something about pulling small children's hair was it??

Oblomov · 09/11/2009 11:52

Actually, I too am going to go against the grain here, and say I think it is an idea tat should be considered.
And the argument of 'oh that isn't an adult way of dealing with it, doesn't sit with me.
O.K. so biters. Often aged 18 mths - 2 yrs ? but lets not limit it to just that age group.
yes some of them are so young they can't comprehend the meaning of some of their actions. my friend has an 18 month who is very savvy and knows what no means, understands what hurting someone else. he knows. you can see it in his eyes that he knows he has done wrong.
My son was bitten by a biter many years ago at nursery. on the face. big black bruise. of visible teeth marks, in the shape of upper and lower jaw. I remmber clearly.
and the child, I suspect, who bit lots of the other children, had N IDEA the pain he was inflicting, with his very very forceful bite.

so if an adult had talked it all through, repeatedly said no etc tec. if they were to bite the child, they would never do it with the verocity of how the biter actually bites, so suddenly. else the adult would be up in court.
but a discussion of , can you imagine how that feels. now I am going to bite you to show you how painful that is for the other children....

or maybe this would only work with hair pulling. not so painful. but a quick tug, might show the child how nasty it was. they could feel it. it might shock them. then they might TRUELY understand the pain they are causing.

because if they have never been bitten, hair pulled, how could they have any comprehension of how painful it was ?

Just a thought. I am just saying that I do not think it is such a hideous or vile thought.
Not a nasty tit for tat way of doing it. not you pushed, so i'll push you. but a considered way, or actually showing, making the child physically feel how painful their actions are.

Just thought I'd throw that into the ring.

bumpsoon · 09/11/2009 12:51

Hope it was organic mustard, sorry but i dont think an unpleasant taste is the end of the world ,i remember a freind of mine putting fairy liquid in her sons mouth when he swore at her ,mind you he was 11 and had been 'pushing the boundaries' for several weeks .

Oblomov · 09/11/2009 13:43

bumpson, I did the fairy liquid trick. a few months ago. after ds was rude and answering back for weeks and weeks. 1 drop on my finger, in his mouth, after threats and threats. then I came on mn and hadn't realised what a crime this was. i think it was considered assault in a newspaper case, recently. won't be doing that again !!

Gelamum · 09/11/2009 14:06

I understand what you mean Oblomov, only if you are talking about an only child.

Surely in any family of more than one children do experience hurt from another child unfortunately sometimes. So they do know what things hurt. They do not need to be hurt by an adult.

Actually even if first born, they would again sadly probably had experience from playgroups unless they never go to one..

Hulababy · 09/11/2009 14:10

IMO it isn't on. I don't agree with hitting, biting or pulling of a child's hair tjust to show them it is wrong.

Oh, and DD is an only child and I would still never resort to this.

LimburgseVlaai · 09/11/2009 14:22

Bumpsoon, you think English mustard is just an 'unpleasant taste'? You must be a smoker. To a small child that must feel like his mouth and nose are on fire.
And fairy liquid?? Blimey, I thought the idea was to discourage children from drinking stuff in the cleaning cupboard, and there you go showing a child that, in fact, it's OK to ingest poison.
If I did this to my DD I'd be worried that she will use the same tactic on her little sister.

Two wrongs don't make a right. Same goes for hair pulling, biting, hitting.

bumpsoon · 09/11/2009 14:50

Tbh i wouldnt personally use fairy liquid or mustard ,i am far more reactionary ,if my 11yr old ihad called me a fat fcking cnt after weeks of all round abnoxious behaviour ,his x-box would have taken flying lessons out of his bedroom window ,but then i really know how to hit my child where it hurts ,so to speak . As for my friends son ,well he is in his first year training to be a Dr so i think he safely worked out what is and isnt poisonous . Personally i agree with many others on here about the biting thing up to a certain point ,in that small children /toddlers are egocentric ,in the true sense of the word ,and often telling them its not very nice /hurts etc isnt going to register to them as it hasnt had any detrimental effect on them iysyim , a quick bite back ,however makes them realise if i do a ,then it hurts and i dont like getting hurt so maybe thats not a very good idea , this is why it often works .Im not saying it should be the first line tactic ,just that as so many people have said and who im sure all love their children just as much as those who would never consider this ,it does actually work .

JoeJoe1977 · 09/11/2009 15:04

Time out is used here, DS2 (18mths) is a monkey and has done biting and pinching. He gets put to sit on his own in a corner after I've spoken sternly to him. My thinking is that he will realise if he behaves like that other people won't want to spend time with him.

Don't understand the biting back thing, I'm sure if I tried that with DS2 he would think it is a game and just bite me again.

nappyaddict · 09/11/2009 15:35

I'm not keen on time out especially with babies and toddlers as I have seen it really distress some kids out and for them it seemed just as cruel if not crueller than smacking. With DS I would put him down on the floor next to me so similar but not as potentially distressing I felt.

OP posts:
allaboutme · 09/11/2009 19:35

I havent bitten or pulled a childs hair before, and cant imagine doing so really, although havent been in the situation where I have a child who persistently does it and doesnt stop for anything else, so who knows!
I have thrown water in DS1's face though. He kept scooping up a cupful of bath water and throwing in DS2's face in the bath. I warned him, told him off, and finally said 'if you do that one more time, I will do it to you'. he did it again. I did it to him! He cried and we talked about why he didnt like it and perhaps now he knows why DS2 doesnt like it etc. Problem solved

JoeJoe1977 · 10/11/2009 13:33

nappyaddict - I agree, I don't put DS2 in a room on his own for timeout, just on the floor in the room that we happen to be in when he has misbehaved.

Also, i just realised that I didn't answer your OP in my post....IMO YANBU

BertieBotts · 10/11/2009 17:42

Allaboutme, talking about why he didn't like it and now he understands why his brother doesn't like it - that is the level of development a child needs to be at for this kind of punishment to work, I think, logically. I think that as a last resort and providing it's not something dangerous or damaging it can work in this way. The point about it logically only working when the child can understand "I don't like that... that is what others feel if I do it to them" is what I was trying to say earlier I think. A younger child (People keep telling me to bite DS - 13m - back if he bites me, and DP has pulled his hair and pinched him before ) isn't going to have that level of understanding, they are just going to think "Mum hurt me!"

mrleebob · 10/11/2009 19:07

Regarding the biting back thing.... Perhaps we should bite the kids children first to stop them starting it? :P

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