AIBU - sexist science homework

[Litchick]

Lst night's science homework was to write a short passage about a famous scientist, what they discovered and its applications today.

Fine except that each question said 'he'.

Eg what was his name? What did he discover?

DD and I chose Marie Curie and changed everything to she.

AIBU to make the point on the prep sheet or just touchy?
Does it matter? It felt to me like it does. Grrrr

seeker - I have not been ignoring you. I have just been out all morning.

I note TheShriekingHarpy has provided examples of 'loony left' political correctness. My PIL works for a large labour dominated local authority and the stories he tells of similar things are legion. I do not intend to or need provide links to 'prove' it happens. Why don't you pride link to show it does not happen?

notcitrus - very interesting about what Maurice Wilkins said. I saw a programme a few years ago on TV where he was interviewed about the issue. Very enlightening.

Having worked in both the academic and commercial world, me and DW firmly believe that women are far more discriminated against in academic life than in industry. We still have both male and female friends in the top levels of research biochemistry in a variety of univrsities and watching their careers over the years it is so obvious the men have had the promotions and funding where women have not. These are incredibly able women I am talking about, no more able than the men but the career outcomes are very markedly different. A terible waste of talent.

Absolutely, corriefan, and I nearly said that - but isn't that the point? How can a child make choices based on their own aptitudes if the decisions have already been made for them based on what other people have done? Shouldn't teachers want more for them than that?

And no, it's not necessarily better to go into a traditionally male career, though I suspect that engineers probably earn more than seamstresses (especially as most of our sewing is done in developing countries) and there aren't that many openings for fashion designers.

And in case it might be suggested that my DD has been fed the idea of engineering because it's a male-dominated industry: it's occurred to us as a possibility because of her passion for construction toys; her track record in school K'nex challenges; her strength in maths; and her spatial and visual awareness. She also fancies becoming an architect or an artist, but to be honest, we suspect she'll end up in a shack in Cornwall, giving surfing lessons. Fine.

It's even earlier to say, but I can see DD2 thriving in a medical-related career such as nursing, if the entomology doesn't work out (I shall support that as long as she doesn't insist on bringing her work home with her).

Neither of them is that likely to become a fashion designer, because they don't care about fashion, though of course, that might change. Also fine.

Unquiet Dad, that is such an utterly lame attempt to explain away your failure to provide any evidence. Not even slightly persuasive.

Yes, betadad, the academic career path seems particularly non-family friendly. I do know one woman who took a totally unorthodox path of 4 kids instead of a PhD, but ultimately went rapidly from Mrs to Prof ..., FRS but she's the wonderful exception.

Zoya - are you talking to me? Me and UQD do so often get confused. Its our shared admiration of Sarah Palin that causes it.

oops sorry ABetaDad, in too much of a hurry there. Also meant to answer your question: why should you provide evidence? Because if you don't, people will just think you've fallen for that ancient reactionary anti-pc urban myth about 'manholes' etc. You wouldn't want us to think you're that gullible, now would you?

Apologies again for the misidentificatio. But it was an understandable mistake, IMO - after all, it is kind of revealing that you and UQD have had the same kind of 'no no really what's all the fuss about ladies' reaction to this thread, don't you think?

ABetaDad ... the reason you need to provide proof of needless abuse of language, rather than other posters providing proof it doesn't happen is because a negative like that is unprovable. Virtually all cases of "loony left" councils banning words or concepts have turned out to be false. Chalkboard is in common usage because not all writing boards in educational establishments are black: it is the accurate generic.

And for those convinced of the prevalence of "loony left" councils ... Look around and ask, in Britain in 2009, how many there really are. Moreover, councils have a duty to ensure their services do not discriminate against those entitled to use them, and to maximise access. If that means changing terms that might be misinterpreted, I don't have the slightest problem with it.

As for OP, of course YANBU.

Zoya - no offence taken. It has often been speculated that my comments are generated randomly by the MNHQ computer anyway - so it is refreshing to be mistaken for a human.

As for our reaction to this thread, well it is unfair to speak for UQD but for myself I only argue that we should focus on the really important issues that women scientists be recognised for their contribution and that school chldren be taught about it properly. I feel passionate about that - so I just think picking over PC words in sentences that some 'feminists' indulge in so spectaculalrly diverts the attention away from the key issues it is plain wrong.

As it happens, when I write, I do use s/he in sentences or use syntax that avoids gender specific references. I just think there are far more important issues to argue over THAT is all I mean by my 'what's all the fuss' comments.

it may be that the prep work for this homework was a potted history of some of the great scientists - Newton, Pasteur, Einstein.and that none of those covered with women? I think just change it, it's not necessarily sexist.

the flashcard i used to teach little kids the word 'scientist' had a piccie of a lady in a white coat. Nina and the Neurons does stirling work promoting women in science to littlies.

My sister is a reasonably noteworthy organometallic chemist - though she has given up the lab to TTC (no, not due to sexism, mercury isn't considered good for babies...and it was everywhere in her lab) I agree there are bigger barriers to her progress in the world of science than mere grammar. I think she ought to be 'Nina', she'd be very good

Zoya - read the thread carefully. Several of the female posters have also expressed the view that the original homework was not necessarily sexist and that the battle can be fought in other ways.

I think people often leap on the supposedly "sexist" use of language because it's a very easy way to get "armchair points." You don't actually have to do anything - just tut a bit on a forum or in Grauniad CiF and you're all set up to feel nice and warm and glowy and PC for the day. There's a lot more to challenging sexism than that.

YANBU

I would do the same!

Maybe we should creat a list of female scientists who whould have been famous if only they had had a penis.

"I'm greatly in favour of 'pick your battles', but stereotyping and lazy writing aimed at young people is a battle worth picking, IMO."

Yeah - well no. It was a point worth making. And the OP made it nicely. Don't think we need to do to defcon 1.

Oh I like that analogy. I do know a lot of feminists who have such itchy trigger fingers

inventors.about.com/library/inventors/blwomeninventors.htm

ShriekingHarpy ... One can't produce evidence to prove something didn't happen: the nature of something that doesn't happen is that it leaves no evidence. That's why you need to produce evidence it does happen. And saying "my friend said something happened once" does not count as conclusive evidence of a widespread conspiracy of "loony leftism".

I heard recently that 20% of children do not fit into their gender stereotype. So 20% of girls are perhaps more inlined to be engineers than caretakers. 20% is a lot of people to be sticking in the wring group.

www.pbs.org/parents/raisinggirls/brains/understanding.html

W Personally I would not be offended - I find it a bit irritating when everything is sooooo PC. Also if it said just She throughout would you be inclined to feel the other way (ie, they should have included HE)? If you can honestly say yes I will accept that YANBU.

Do I have to wink to show a joke??

It's not disrespect at all - sorry if you feel that way. It's putting the other point of view. (This is, after all, "AIBU?", a question, not "IANBU", a statement.)

I don't quite get how arguing the toss over grammar is odd for me - I seem to find myself doing ti all the time...!

The 'mouth frothing' comment was in a humourous context. At least I hope so as it was mine that was thus being maligned

No, it wasn't aimed at anyone in particular!

Oh Lenin, don't you know by now not to worry your pretty little head about these things.

We are still teaching our daughters to take a back seat and be quite and let men shine in the glory of their (and our) achievements. But, really, it is no big deal and you are just getting all worked up about the silly things.

FFS anyone who thinks this is trivial is not taking it seriously enough.

I would make a big deal of this to my DD. I would tell her women are great thinkers. And I would pull out an array of examples to prove my point (as DD is not one to except what I say unless I prove it). I believe the OP did this.

I get very hot under the collar when I hear the school saying things that would discourage DD from exploring her full potentional in math/science. It is not a minor issue to me.