To think the 11+ is the work of the devil?

[LynetteScavo]

And if you don't agree with me, you're wrong.

Oh, and the test is unfair!

DS happens to have a gift for non verbal reasoning, son it seems. What has that got to do with school work?

i like them

Oh, as as you'll be able to tell from my posts, DS get his intelligence form his dad, not me.

I reckon the people who like the 11+, passed the 11+ themselves, and have children too young to take it yet.

Sorry, but imho YABU - I totally agree with Pranma and Firawla. If you lived in my liberal-minded county, with it's excellent Unis and (at best) second rate senior schools, all of which are comprehensive, where each child is educated to the lowest common denominator and to aspire to better than this is frowned upon as non-PC except in the better off circles, where independent schools are fine but those who call for the return of grammars almost social pariahs, you may see it differently.

I took the 11+ myself, which was as stress-free as Firawla's appears to have been. I think now that the stress children experience in taking the 11+ is very largely caused (perhaps understandably) by the parents alone.

And why? Because there are far too few grammar schools and far to many huge, impersonal comprehensives where our children are often little more than mere names on the register.

Hides behind the sofa, waiting for the onslaught!

The old chestnut of 'it helps the clever child from a disadvantaged background' argument is the one that really bugs me. People trot that one out when they will pay out a fortune to tutor their average DC to take the place from the really intelligent child who hasn't even seen the questions before.
It is very, very unfair. It also takes no account of the late developer.

Mixed, VERY mixed feelings.

Absolutely agree is divisive and not at all fair. Worried about impact of middle class flight on other schools. Still considering entrance exam for selective school in next county though.

Dunno. Haven't looked at any of them yet.

seeker wrote a response then did not dare!

I never knew the 11 + still existed [really old person]

it does take account of summer borns

parents are not 'smug' when their dcs get in

not ALL children are tutored although mumsnetters choose not to believe this

it does take account of summer borns

parents are not 'smug' when their dcs get in

not ALL children are tutored although mumsnetters choose not to believe this

lynette, i passed the 11+ as did all my family....im quite surprised at the posts here saying people tutor their kids for up to 4 years in advance? ive only had to think about it now because ds1 is in p7 and the system has only just changed here

how odd

honestly, i would rather it was still 11+ here for my ds (and the rest of my younger ones)

lynette i did not take11+

3 children have taken it

none tutored

My dd went to a very socially mixed large primary school on the edge of a very disadvantaged housing estate.

The children who passed the 11+ from her year ALL came from middle class professional families. Without exception.

Grammar schools have something like 2% intake on free school meals.

It stinks to high heaven.

Its not the 11+ itself that is the work of the devil. Its the context in which it's now sat.

In my day (very end of everywhere being grammar/2ndary mod) we all did the 11+ and we all practised for it at school. No external tutoring. It was at least a reasonably level playing field.

Now - some kids are tutored or prep'd to the eyeballs. Many aren't in the catchment for a grammar so have to do phenomenally well to get a residual place.

Its a mess.

valhala...the comprehensive DS might go to is actually the same size as the grammar school he might go to.

The large bilateral school has nearly 2,000 pupils on roll, but is "outstanding" and achives excellent exam results.

People seem to dispair at comprehensives, but spare a thought for kids who mess up in the 11+ and end up in a secondary modern.

Like I said earlier...you are wrong.

yet they all went to the 'very mixed primary school'

there is a pretty good social mix at both our grammar schools

lol@ the thought of "tutors"!

I took the 11+ in a borough where all kids did. I got the highest mark anybody had ever achieved at the school - and nobody had tutors! I don't remember ANYONE getting stressed about it all - although there was one girl we were all surprised about when she failed. Just one - but for the rest of my primary school of ¬60 pupils there were no surprised whatsoever.

OK, point is - at grammar school - it was no fun at all for the "thick" kids who would've been top of the class of course at the regular schools. Must be even worse for them now that they're through sheer force/will of pushy parents.

My DSs comprehensive has been fantastic-no way have they been mere names on the register! They have had all sort of opportunities from kayaking in Wales to skiing in Canada -there is too much to possibly mention. They regularly send DCs to the top universities. They do this because the don't cream off the top end.
All the local comprehensives have recently been in the paper celebrating their exam results. Some comprehensives in the inner cities may be sink schools but not all comprehensives are bog standard! Several in our area get into the league tables published in the national papers-no mean feat as they take everyone. They treat the child as an individual.

"there is a pretty good social mix at both our grammar schools"
Is there? What's the free school meal %?

how can i find that out seeker?
the cohort comes from a huge catchment area

GrimmaThe Gnome - you are right.

I had to have DS's photo taken, fill out a form, have it signed by the head, post it,and drive across town to take DS to the test.

No way could he do this with out parental support. What about bright children with no parental support? It makes me cross.

equally i could say that the local comp round here has a low school meal take up (free) as area is affluent etc etc

the comprehensive is great but HUGE

It should be somewhere on the school's profile, notanotter, it will be a very unusual grammar school if there are more than 3%.

well it is a parents job to do the best by their child
you get a form to fill out anyway
lets face it people know the options...