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Original poster

Daily Mail...dont shoot me!

157 replies

milknosugarplease · 08/09/2009 12:44

ok, i have seen daily mail mentioned everywhere on messages and in names-never positive!

i am in no wy sticking up for it...just would like an insight on the reason for this strong dislike (hate is a strong word!)

a confused but in no way liking the daily mail, milk

xx

OP posts:
MorrisZapp · 10/09/2009 14:03

Thanks for that enlightening post sm!

I wouldn't dream of giving anybody 'permission' to do anything on here, post away for all you're worth.

But I am allowed to point out that if you're going to continually invoke the 'off switch' argument so beloved of Points of View correspondents, then you might want to apply the off switch yourself and stay away from threads about the DM.

scottishmummy · 10/09/2009 14:07

why do you repeat request i don't post on this topic?

clearly you don't grasp the concept of open access public forum.that posters contribute and post their subjective opinions,without need to ask for permission or limit/sanction topics

it is not your remit to request or suggest i desist in posting on dm topics

and nor shall i desist

is that clear enough for you?

jujumaman · 10/09/2009 14:14

What Scottishmummy is saying and which I agree with - for once - is that it's astonishingly patronising of mnetters to assume THEY can see through the perniciousness of the DM but the great unwashed can't and are therefore brainwashed by it.

I don't think it works like that. The DM doesn't so much influence its readers, as reflect their opinions. Like it or not the DM mindset is that of many in this country and they buy a paper to have their views reinforced. That is their prerogative. The Guardian way of seeing the world is not the only, correct way. But I doubt many DM readers swallow every word of it as gospel, they probably agree with some of its lines and not with others.

Personally I skim the DM (and the rest of the papers) online for the gossip and find its "why oh why" perpetually outraged stance funny rather than upsetting. I'm a floating voter because I don't think any newspaper or political creed holds the answer. Give the readers some credit for being able to take things with a pinch of salt.

BethNoire · 10/09/2009 14:17

Well Sm becuiase of it being free she can ask- doesn't mean you have to listen though.

Frommy own experience only, I think quite a lot of DM readers do see it as it is, but is imo also inevitable that a certain select bunch who are looking not so much for information as validation of their own views will be drawn to it. Much lime a depressed environmentalist * might ike the Indie.

*Stereotypes abound.

scottishmummy · 10/09/2009 14:24

indeed,one can ask not to see a divergent opinion on MN.and i possessing free will and volition,and acting in ethos of MN open forum can decline

intellectually, i quite like discussing and debating many points of views and don't need to have my own opinion reflected back

it would be dull if mn was all concordant posts and gosh i so agree with you.mwah

i also think a liberal democracy has a range of media

some one may like
some one will not like

i would hate to see excessive censorship or intervention

thesecondcoming · 10/09/2009 14:27

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

MorrisZapp · 10/09/2009 14:27

Gah! I haven't tried to stop you posting, or from offering your opinion SM. I've pointed out that if you're so keen on the 'if you don't like it then ignore it' approach then you could - if you wanted to - use that approach yourself and refrain from commenting on posts that you don't like.

As for the idea that the 'great unwashed' believe all that the papers say, I don't imagine they do.

On the other hand, I don't imagine that they read the DM, go 'Oh my god, this is racist, sexist guff, filled with lies' and then continue to buy it as their daily paper.

I don't believe what the DM prints myself, but I don't buy it. That's not the same as buying it every day (which many thousands do), presumably not all of them are buying it in irony - most of them must agree with/ concur with it's agenda.

I agree that most people buy the paper that reflects their views rather then have their views influenced by what they read. I accept that as an Indie/ Grauniad reader I am subject to stereotype myself, some of which is right, some of which is way off.

thesecondcoming · 10/09/2009 15:27

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

MorrisZapp · 10/09/2009 16:44

Yup. There are many many people in this country who truly believe that Christmas has been banned, English flags have been banned, and that you're not allowed to celebrate St George's day etc.

If you ask them to highlight or link to this new legislation they can't, they've just absorbed these beliefs from reading it so often in the papers.

scottishmummy · 10/09/2009 17:00

also,many don't believe those things and have ability to distinguish fact from spurious rubbish. as you assert you are able to do. like all the folk here who read dm but don't believe it

good to acknowledge not everyone is a porous membrane,just absorbing information

so some will read dm and think its true
so will read dm and think its tosh

people have individual nuances and preferences

MorrisZapp · 10/09/2009 17:08

Sorry, why would millions of people pay however much it is a day to read a newspaper that they consider to be tosh?

tallulahbelly · 10/09/2009 17:10

It's 50p Morris. But I read it at the stand and put it back crumpled after pinching the sudoku pullout.

Pikelit · 10/09/2009 17:12

I didn't read the previous messages because there will always be one, over-riding reason to treat the Daily Mail with the contempt it deserves - they supported FRANCO in the Spanish Civil War. And yes, I know I am an unreconstructed old lefty but that does it for me.

(And the relentless stirring up of racial hatred of course.)

scottishmummy · 10/09/2009 17:55

ask the many here who read dm and proclaim it to be tosh.hey maybe they don't pay - maybe they find it in a cafe. i didn't presume about payment, that's your query. perhaps pose the question though?

i am reflecting oft made comment on here i read dm and it was vile etc

so clearly on here some do read the dm amd find its content objectionable. they have said so

jujumaman · 10/09/2009 18:00

"There are many many people in this country who truly believe that Christmas has been banned, English flags have been banned, and that you're not allowed to celebrate St George's day etc."

Where's the evidence for these many, many people and their beliefs? Or is the truth if I asked you to produce it, it would be because you've "absorbed these beliefs from reading it so often in the papers."

policywonk · 10/09/2009 18:03

Well, to be fair, most of the major non-Axis European countries came pretty close to supporting Franco in the SCW (in that their policy of 'neutrality' was in fact greatly to the advantage of the side with the greatest military capacity, ie the Nationalists). So as far as that goes the Mail wasn't doing anything exceptional. It has, of course, been on absolutely the wrong side of pretty much every issue ever since.

MorrisZapp · 10/09/2009 18:03

I keep swearing not to engage in this any more but aaaargh I can't help myself!

Poeple who think the DM is vile DO NOT buy it every day.

They have read it in somebody's house, at the dentists, online, whatever.

Your argument is guff that DM readers know that it is tosh. If they knew it was tosh then they wouldn't buy it would they.

'Reading the DM' is not the same as 'I have read the DM and think it is vile'.

Nobody on here who thinks it is vile 'reads it' the way they read their own chosen paper.

Nancy66 · 10/09/2009 18:14

I think a huge percentage of MNetters read the Daily Mail, they just keep quiet about it because they don't want to be rounded on by the torch carrying, swallowed-a-dictionary crowd on here that froth at the mouth at the merest mention of its name.

scottishmummy · 10/09/2009 18:17

i think you make this up as you go along zapp.how can you possibly know how anyone procurs their dm?purchased,found at dentist or not?

you cant know that and are making spurious assumptions to support a weak argument

and read my posts carefully as your summation is inaccurate. i didn't say "DM readers know that it is tosh"

i actually said

so some will read dm and think its true
so will read dm and think its tosh

as numerous others have asserted when discussing dm,that they have read it and find it objectionable

zapp you say "Nobody on here who thinks it is vile 'reads it' the way they read their own chosen paper".and again how can you possibly presume to speak for how other people read the dm. such presumptuousness

actually, reading dm and being able to recall content and the intellectual impact/response it provoked is most certainly reading a newspaper. reading is the retention,understanding and recall of printed

daftpunk · 10/09/2009 18:27

absolutely nancy66...plus there's the snob factor ..."i'm far too intelligent to read the DM"

LevitatingCopy · 10/09/2009 18:29

SM - is your argument that people SHOULDN'T say 'I've just read something and I think it's crap' for fear of being thought hypocritical?

Would it be better to pretend it doesn't exist (maybe out of politeness or something)?

scottishmummy · 10/09/2009 18:33

suppose i am bemused at the inference that the hoi polloi can read its pernicious content and believe it. yet some MN readers are impervious to its sinister content.because they are so clever

read what you want frankly

scottishmummy · 10/09/2009 18:41

LevitatingCopy,i dont presume to tell people about their chosen reading material

up to them

pooexplosions · 10/09/2009 18:45

"suppose i am bemused at the inference that the hoi polloi can read its pernicious content and believe it. yet some MN readers are impervious to its sinister content.because they are so clever"

I don't see whats so difficult about that. Some people are more intelligent than others, some people are more gullible than others. Its simple fact, it doesn't make you snobby or anything. Or are we all meant to be equal in everything now?

The fact is, I am more intelligent and less gullible than some people who read the daily mail. Certainly more than most that believe in the Daily mail viewpoint. I freely admit to regularly reading the DM online though, it entertains me and reminds me how odd other people can be. Especially the comments after articles, there are some really scary people that post on there!

WebDude · 11/09/2009 13:05

SM - I think what MorrisZapp was indicating was that where infrequently some may see the DM and "have a read" the general "I read XXX paper" is taken to mean "I read ..." every day

Now, under those circumstances, if someone has looked through a copy, perhaps once a week or fortnight, over a coffee, or in the dentist or library (must admit when I was unemployed 15+ years ago they seemed to take the Daily Post and Western Mail, plus broadsheets, and perhaps the Mail and Mirror).