Parent and child spaces or parent and carseat spaces??!!

[margobambino]

I am getting really angry with people who park on the designated parent and child spaces just because they have a kid's car seat in their car. I strongly believe that I am not being unreasonable but wanted to ask your opinion anyway.
A couple of weeks ago I was looking for a parent and baby park in a retail park and saw one next to boots. I have a very active toddler and it is very difficult to keep him on the route so it would have been wonderful to park next to boots but a woman, who did not have a baby or child with her but had a car seat fitted in her car, drove faster and parked there. If I had time I was going to have a word with her and even take this to the shop managers etc. This happens quite often unfortunately. Next time I am planning to express my anger and concerns.

I'm not going to get into this argument cause I know they run and run on here but I did say very nicely to a lady once 'excuse me did you know these spaces are for people with children?' and she answered 'well it doesn't say you have to have them with you'

It does actually but I was so gobsmacked I didn't say anything else.

Oh my, not this old cookie again!

Nobody reply and nobody'll get hurt

I did not know it was discussed before Sorry if I opened a 'very big argument' again. I really cannot believe that they can even defend themselves. I am surprised.
Sorry again.
Don't reply then.
I will be fighting with them in real life though.

'Snot your fault Margobambino, why should you know if something has been a hot topic before.

It's just that it never fails to divide people and somewhere, someone will say that perhaps the woman was going to be meeting her DCs at the shop or that perhaps someone parking in the P&C is actually disabled but without a badge/visible disability and.. and.. it runs onandonandonandonandon....

Thanks WesternBelle I see your point, but..
The woman who meets her DCs at the shop can park in a normal space for once for god's sake! So she can feel civil and nice for once.
I am sorry but Disabled person doesn't have a right to park on P&C anyway.
Nothing can explain this "rudeness" to me.

As a slight aside, I did notice that in Sains car park the other day, that it's a £50 fine to park in the P&T spaces without a toddler/child/baby and half the proceeds go to charity!! What about that then??

The signs at Sainsbury say the spaces are for people with children under 12. WTF?! Who needs a wide space for a child over 3? Unless they have SN of course.

Now that DD2 is nearly 2 I've gone back to using regular spaces cos I really don't need the extra wide bit. I've always given people who use the P&C spaces with school-age DCs a dirty look, cos I can't imagine why they think they need them. But now I see they're "legally" entitled to use them.

I know it's been done to death on MN, and most of you think the spaces are completely pointless, so bear with me in my rant. But I think they should be parent and baby spaces, for under 3s only.

AND, the 'fines' for parking in a P&T space at places like Sains are unlawful apparently!! You don't have to pay them

It's a private thing, as opposed to a criminal thing (very technical aren't I!!)

Have we ever had a thread about that??

I get annoyed by people parking in those spaces when they don't need them, mainly because I have a slight disability which means I physically can't get my nearly-four-year old fastened into his seat properly if I don't have that extra space to fling the door wide open.

It's annoying that because I don't qualify for a disabled blue badge, I can't park in the wide disabled spaces (did this once when all the parent spaces were full & got an official 'warning' from tesco) but they don't care that people with no kids park in the parent spaces all the time.

I did leave a sarky note under the wipers of a car whose driver casually pulled into the parent space next to me one day. No child, no car seat. He probably didn't care, but it made me feel better

I am sorry but Disabled person doesn't have a right to park on P&C anyway

sorry have to comment on this... a disabled person who can't get parked in a 'legal disabled bay' does have a right to park in P&C. You do realise that by law that supermarkets have to provide disabled bays, but P&C are there to make mothers spend money, they are not legally enforced as there is no law that they are needed. As a mum to 2 disabled kids, aged 11 and 9, I have used the P&C if I can't get a disabled bay. Trying to get DS1 in his wheelchair without the extra space is a complete nightmare now he is 11. so shoot me now!!

I think the supermarkets say up to 12, as thats the age to need a child seat of some kind so it all ties in.

My 3 year old is in a 5 point harness and I still need the door wide open to put him in. The other day I parked in a normal space well away from everyone. Cue 2 people parking next to me, me not being able to get both the kids in (could they not see I have 2 child seats and park a little more accomodatingly?) Thats why the parent and child spaces are there - so you can open your doors wide and strap the kids in safely, not so you're nearer the shops. Still think they should be down the other end of the car park so less people use them unneccesarily.

I have a joint mobility problem too, but not eligible for blue badge. However if I dont have the kids with me I would never park in a P&C space. The amount of people at our ASDA who have an infant seat slung in the back of their car so they can park in the P&C space is stupid - all because they cant be bothered to walk those extra few minutes.

I get annoyed if disabled go into the P&C spaces IF there are plenty of disabled (which there normally are) but I think part of this is maybe not realising a difference (they're often together) but I would never begrudge a disabled person parking in the last spot over me - I can walk and take the kids, its just handy for the extra space!

I was quite amused to see in the supermarket yesterday a middle aged woman in a cardigan, and then a minibus full of people wearing 'Canadian Rifle Team' (and speaking in such accents) pull out of the p+c parking spaces.

It's not really the end of the world though, there's always a space somewhere else....

margobambino - I personally have never seen this topic mentioned before and I agree that it pisses me off when people do this. It pisses me off even more when people with no child seat park in these spaces.

If we try to find excuses for our each behaviour, we can find at the end. For example a burglar may be stealing because he is jobless and has to feed his baby.
Everybody has difficulties. Parenting has its own difficulties and it is very nice that some supermarkets are giving a tiny support to them. Parents of children who are not disabled, are not poor little sitting ducks waiting for those wild capitalist market owners to make them spend more money. They are not always going to markets to indulge their luxurious needs either. Shopping is an essential need for all people in these ages
I have a friend who had to drive and shop with her quite big baby as soon as the 6 weeks legal requirement finished after her c section as she has nobody to help. She cannot park in a disabled bay when she cannot find a P&C space even she is in pain and in a very difficult situation, can she??
For god's sake! Even in the best supermarkets there are only a few P&C bays. I have never seen in my life a car park in which all disabled bays are filled and P&C ones available at the same time. Nobody will shoot or say anything when a disabled person parks in their space under that extremely rare circumstances of course. But why chose those a few P&C spaces?? I would use 2 normal bays by parking in the middle and attach a note saying that there was no disabled bay available.
It is a moral issue, not legal of course. We can see how our society fails when there is no legal fines. It is sad.

I had an incident once where I got really distressed because I was very pregnant my dd needed to be lifted into her carseat and because I hadn't been able to park in the p&c bays my car had been blocked in on both sides and I couldn't open any of the doors wide enough to get in myself let alone lift her in too. I joke on here that I must be huge as a kitkat addict but I'm not that huge. Unless size 10 maternity is suddenly massive.

I had to go into the shop and ask for assistance.

I am 8 mnths pregs now and my son is 19mnths I had the space I was waiting for pinched by a woman with 2 teenagers and a 10 yr old the other day and i really get fed up with it because I can't face being in that "trapped out of my car" situation again. I wouldn't really care if the spaces were a bit further away if I was sure I would be able to open the doors on the car...

I would love to have a car to get out and about easier, I'm sick of waiting for buses and trains after doing it for 8 years.

Mind you, no point in having a car to get out and about when DD was a baby, since we'd only have been able to go to Supermarkets with free Parent places.
Can't possibly manage elsewhere.
No room to park, no room to get her out, can't possibly control her in a car park and just a nightmare.

It is hard being a parent with young kids and a car.

I do understand how those daytrips are limited to Supermarkets with the right parking Place.

You can't go anywhere else! How would you manage the kids and the car?

Dear Mutt,
I am not being ridiculous or selfish. I am only expressing my feelings re an everyday life problem of parents in a parenting website.
Besides when a P&C bay available there are usually plenty of ordinary spaces available. Do you really think when all disabled spaces full and there are no 2 ordinary spaces next to each other within a reasonable distance to the entrance, there will be a P&C available? I was trying to explain that this is really a rare situation. I am usually unable to find a P&C space even in an almost empty car park when I need it.
How do you know who has or has not a disability here? And how do you know that all disabled people would prefer this approach which is for me a positive discrimination?
Finally, please do not verbally attack directly.

margo, I am afraid YABVVU, and selfish too. Sorry.

The point peepople are trying to make is that you could park on teh other side of an empty carpark with your child and be able to get to the store easily.

A disabled badge holder has that badge as, for whatever reason, they cannot get across the car park as easily, whether it be an autistic child who isn't safe, or a wheelchair user who would have to get themselves across whole car park, or someone who cannot walk far and needs their energy to shop.

P&C spaces are a privelige not a right. By all means if you can't find a space then park in the middle of 2 spaces, it is a nightmare to get kids in and out, but don't be so petty about it.

'A disabled badge holder has that badge as, for whatever reason, they cannot get across the car park as easily'

(Sorry, meant to put in 'one of the reasons' at the start)

I dont think she is being petty about it at all.... shopping is stressful enough with 2 kids, without having the difficulty of parking problems. I have a peugeot 307 which I would say is a normal family car, but it is quite a wide one.
In a lot of car parks the spaces are barely wide enough to accomodate the car without taking into consideration of the door needing to be opened.

I have to carry a lot of equiptment round with me for uni and my course and if I need the double buggy this often has to be put inside the car rather than the boot..... its impossible to get it in and out unless I can fully open the doors.

The p&c spaces are there to try and help parents with younger children. Yes they might be a privelidge but that doesnt mean that people with out children have to take advantage of them. Its just selfish.

I really dont get how people can call you petty. I frequently have a go at ignorant people who park in them without children. Its just common sense to give mothers who need extra room just that.

hmm margo

so shoot me i park in p&c parking spaces.if there is no disabled badge spaces empty and it does happen quite often.

Ds is over 4 not the under 3 you are talking about getting priorty but then again hey he cant run of something to do with him only being able to walk short distances or bad day needing his chair.
Yes i know its hard parking with young kids not like i had to do before with my other 3dc and yes I do think that disabledshouldget priorty and this was before ds

I think that people without kids parking in the parent and toddler spaces is hardly the greatest crime of the century and really not worth getting het up about.

After all, P&T spaces are relatively new. Our parents miraculously managed to get us into the supermarket unscathed. If there is no P&T space available for whatever reason, park elsewhere.

I don't pay much attention unless they are right in my line of vision. Then I just say quite loudly something like "come out of the way DD so that the man can get his invisible children into the car".