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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think that banning teachers from being members of the BNP is outrageous!

551 replies

londonone · 23/06/2009 10:19

news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/8112747.stm

Now I abhor the BNP and their policies however they are a LEGAL political party and as a teacher I would find it appalling that my freedom to join legal political parties was being curtailed.

If the establishment believe the BNP to be that abhorrent then they should make them illegal. If a teacher acts in a racist, sexist, homophobic way AT WORK, then discipline them on that basis.

If BNP membership is to be banned then what about the SWP, some would say they are as extreme.

OP posts:
moondog · 23/06/2009 20:36

A point that obviously has gone waaaay over you head, Her.

duchesse · 23/06/2009 20:37

moondog- what about over 50+ swim sessions? How different is that in terms of discrimination? Bearing in mind that many/ muslim women would not be able to swim at all unless they are guaranteed women-only sessions? ie, with no male pool attendants around either.

hatwoman · 23/06/2009 20:38

I can;t comment on the detail of the Black Police thing as I don;t know enough about it - but the underlying principle/reason is that things are different for ethnic minorities and as such there are legitimate reasons for things like the black police association. when we live in a world without discrimination then we won;t need them.

moondog · 23/06/2009 20:39

Of ocurse they could swim Duchesse.They simply choose not to.

I've no choice when i go to Saudi.I can't swim with my family whether i want to or not.

moondog · 23/06/2009 20:39

Of ocurse they could swim Duchesse.They simply choose not to.

I've no choice when i go to Saudi.I can't swim with my family whether i want to or not.

BitOfFun · 23/06/2009 20:40

We may have even met then JoPie

I was more of a Woody Guthrie girl myself though...

moondog · 23/06/2009 20:41

Hmm,Hat that is a pretty shaky line though.Not least because BNP are actually using it about themselves, saying that the indigenous Brit is an endangered species.

duchesse · 23/06/2009 20:42

Yes, but respecting other people's customs and ways of living is arguably one of the things this country does best. Which of us who has lived as an expat can honestly say they didn't miss the tolerance of UK society? Which is what makes the BNP's views all the more unpalatable to most people in this country.

kate1956 · 23/06/2009 20:42

not sure what the funny face is for moondog - perhaps you don't realise that you're actually spouting racist crap!?!

moondog · 23/06/2009 20:44

Here's another funny face for ya Kate.

skidoodle · 23/06/2009 20:49

The wave of immigrants since 2004 kept wages down at the bottom end of the labour market, while they continued to climb higher up the scale and inflation was high (especially the rpi).

It became pretty much de rigueur for employers (or "entrepreneurs" as we're now beseeched to call them whether they started a business or not) to moan openly that they couldn't get lazy, thick working class Brits to do jobs they were offering subsistence wages for.

Wealthy people happily trilled about their cheap, efficient polish plumber while barely any British boys (of any descent) were getting apprenticeships and training, and older trained men could not afford to keep their families on the wages being paid to immigrants. Many of these men were shunted onto dla to shut them up.

Anyone who cares about workers' rights should care about how cheap labour was imported to undermine the working conditions of skilled and unskilled labourers for the benefit of the wealthy, particularly those involved with property development.

If you keep writing these people off as useless, stupid and smear them as racists if they try to make a case for why they matter why wouldn't they turn to a party that seems to listen to them?

FairLadyRantALot · 23/06/2009 20:49

the SWP sounds like a good party, from what I have now heard....and does seem very unlike BNP....but I am making this judgement simply on those replys on this thread....to make a real judgement I'd have to look into it deeper.

moondog...yes...many leaders are...but I suppose it all depends on how they use it....I used Hitler as an example, because I am german, and hence know more about the in and outs about Nazi Germany and Hitler than I do about say, teh Apartheid....iykwim...

To be honest, I think any high rank politicians should be psychologically profiled before they are allowed power...and if found to be dangerous for x, y or z reason they should not be allowed power....but, of course that won't happen...

Qally · 23/06/2009 20:52

"where I know plenty of relaitives of illegal immigrants, seeing as I have spent most of my life in the developing world."

Well, that clearly makes you an expert on all illegal immigrants from all developing nations, then. Tell me, given that universal expertise, are all developing world populations cloned? And I'm half Australian, I've lived in Sydney - does that osmotic educative process make me an expert on aborigines?

The BNP sounds reasonable if you read what they say at face value and don't analyse it, or research into background. For example, Griffin whines that he doesn't hate Muslims, oh no, just theocratists, because, like yeah, right, we live in this society where there's separation of church and state, okay, and that's an intrinsic part of what it means to be English. And those towel-heads foreigners just don't understand our ways.

"But if there was a group which wanted to impose a theocracy and do away with separation of church and state which is part of the foundation of the constitution and the way of doing things which has made this country such a wonderful place, despite its many failings and so on and a place to which, presumably, your parents wanted to come, it's based on that, that separation of church and state.

Gosh. Must have hallucinated the part where our Head of State is simultaneously head of the armed forces, the judiciary... and the Church of England (see that name? There's your clue). And oh yes, what are those people with funny hats who get automatic seats in the House of Lords (part of our legislature)? Why, Bishops. Real threat to public order, those bishops.

He's arguing on the one hand that we have a separation, and then in the same interview that this is a Christian country; internally totally contradictory. It's all bollocks. But then, it's intended to be. Griffin's got a Cambridge degree in history and law; the constitutional setup of this country is a compulsory part of the syllabus. He isn't just lying - he's sufficiently intelligent that he knows he is. He's just assuming that enough listeners will be either too thick to tell, or in broad agreement with the implied racism.

His background.

The problem with the BNP is there are a lot of stupid, or gullible, or ignorant, or just downright fed up people in this country, and they're being played like violins. If the UK really was "overrun by immigrants" then the BNP would be pointless because most of the power wouldn't be in white hands - but take a look at parliament, or the boards of the top 100 companies, and they're almost all run by white men. The majority of the money is held by white men. Race is a scapegoat, no more, no less.

But hey, vote for a bloke who said, "Adolf went a bit far" when talking about Hitler if you like, just don't expect me to let a member of his party educate my child. Because said "Adolf" murdered several of his grandpa's relations.

moondog · 23/06/2009 20:53

Great post Skid.

Fair, I wish I spoke German.I would love to understand more of how Hitler appealed to Germans. I understand a bit but not much.
Was his German really bad?

daftpunk · 23/06/2009 20:56

absolutely skid

BitOfFun · 23/06/2009 20:56

Fairlady, it boasts an appeal to the most kindhearted of loons, like myself and Daftpunk by the sound of it

I'm done with this thread now- londonone, if I've been unfair I apologize, but I hope you understand the sort of experiences which have led me to be suspicious.

I am on a much more uplifting thread to help one of our members who has been very cruelly burgalled and had her baby's things defiled in a particularly sick way. If anyone wants to participate in the nicer side of human nature I will link it in a sec...

HerHonesty · 23/06/2009 20:56

honestly moondog, no need to be quite so rude. just asking you to clarify.

flatcapandpearls · 23/06/2009 20:56

Many moons ago I was a member of the SWP, the closest I ever got to violence was slamming a volvo door outside of a pub after a night of eating hummous and discussing the revolution.

My heart wants me to say teachers should not be members of the BNP but banning teachers or any profession from being part of a legal party is a dodgy path to go down.

I have however seen BNP members use violence and seen a boyfriend attacked with a broken bottle by a BNP thug on a march we were peacefully taken part in. I have also been threatened by a BNP activist while taking part in a peaceful protest. Having said that I have taught children of BNP activists, and think I still do actually and although I privately think the parents are twats I would never treat their children unfairly,

However if I ever found out my dd was being taught by a member of the BNP I would withdraw my daughter from the school. I have worked with a teacher who used to boast about being a BNP voter and he was one of the most inept unprofessional and unpleasant people I have ever worked with and I would go out of my way not to even breathe the same air as him. As a budget holder working in schools I have had to declare my biases/influences and so have always declared to my headteacher/ governers my political membership and religious beliefs. They are things I am proud of so feel no need to hide them.

moondog · 23/06/2009 20:57

Qally, could you just highlight the part of my posts in which I claimed to be

'an expert on all illegal immigrants from all developing nations'.

Seeing as you are so clever with all your fancy underlining and pretty colours.

Do you edit and proofread for a living?

chegirl · 23/06/2009 20:57

Excuse me skidoddle silly? Why am I silly for quoting what I heard on the BBC news? Did I say the Nationalists DID it? No dear i said the attacks have been attributed to them.

Read my post properly before you start making silly comments.

ScaredOfEverything · 23/06/2009 20:58

great post QALLY

daftpunk · 23/06/2009 20:59

lol bitoffun......they are loons.....but i still read the socialist worker

FairLadyRantALot · 23/06/2009 21:02

wel...he was austrian, so, part of why his german wasn't quite the way ordinary germans would speak is down to that....they use different phrases and have a different accent, of course (Austrians I mean)....but...yeah, he talked a lot of rightious bollox, but he did it very well...although, he kinda did not have any charm or charisma going for him...he was a powerful speaker....it's difficult to explain....
we had to watch/listen to his speeches as part of the history curriculum....and I suppose it was more about affect with him....the way he left the listener feeling, etc...like I said, it is difficult to explain...

and obviously BNP will be much more careful about the finer details, especially with stuff they have on their website....it will be worded careful, and in a way, that if not analyzing it deeper, you may find yourself agreeing with it....

I watched a programme the other sunday, and there were some people from the bnp there...and again, they were at times saying things you could not immediately find fault with....I found that very disturbing....

theherbgarden · 23/06/2009 21:03

teachers who are found to be members of the BNP should be dismissed.

BitOfFun · 23/06/2009 21:03

The thread I was talking about to spread a bit of MN cheer is her guys.

Swipe left for the next trending thread