To want parents to stop blaming their child's teacher for everything?

[starlightexpress]

I'm just so sick of reading parents on here moaning about how crap their child's teacher is for one reason or another (not aimed at any particular thread this evening, btw).

In any given class of thirty-three, seventy percent of my time is spent dealing with about three kids who couldn't give a fuck. They don't want to learn, they don't want anyone else to learn. I'm not talking SEN, here, I'm talking just plain naughty.

As far as I'm concerned, the majority of the time when a parent is on here moaning about how shitty their child's teacher is, it falls into one of four categories.

Either your child is:

a)Badly brought up and you're making excuses for them.

b)So-called "SEN" which means they can behave when they want to, but misbehave most of the time using said SEN as an excuse. You allow them to do this because you prefer not to take any responsibility for their behaviour.

c)Genuinely suffering from an SEN, which I probably know very little about and am given little support (either in terms of training or TAs or resources)for.

d)Suffering from the fall out of "inclusion" which means that so much of my time is spent firefighting (see a, b and c) that I don't have the time to spend on your child that they deserve.

Of course there are crap teachers. There are also medicore teachers and there are good teachers who have crap days and make crap judgements sometimes. But mostly it is not your child's teacher's fault.

If you are a C or a D parent, then get thee to the Head, the governers, the local MP and kick up an almighty fuss. You're right to be upset, I don't blame you, I'm not happy about it either but what can I do? I'm doing my very very best but I can't fight the system on my own.

If you're an A or a B parent, do what the fuck you want - that's what you do anyway, and I'm not interested in your whining.

Before you ask, I teach in an inner city secondary school. Not the worst school in the whole world but not great either.

I'm a relatively experienced teacher with a decent results record. I don't have classroom management issues - last Ofsted (they actally watched some of my lesson) they said that this was a strength, fwiw. It's worth nothing actually, as Ofsted couldn't identify one end of a decent lesson from another, but I know their opinion matters to a lot of you.

Go on, flame me, I will have heard worse at parents evening, I can take it.

AIBU?

I agree captainpeacock I think it should be much easier to get rid of poor teachers or even to move teachers on to a school in which they can work in. Often teachers are not bad teachers but are in the wrong school.

I was a good teacher in my previous school but in some ways the behaviour challenge was too much and I was at odds with the school philosophy. In my new school I am far better as I fit,

Stille I am having a similar thing with dd and her school. Dp and I have had a disagreement about it tonight as he says I am playing the teacher at home with dd and automatically backing the school.

flatcap - i have let all his educational issues go over the last 6 years (he is in year 5) as i have stupidly trusted the school and not wanted to be a PITA parent but at the expense of my son's education really . he is going to an independent school in Jan and because i will be paying (rightly or wrongly) I will be kicking up more of a stink about things in future as i hope i have learnt my lesson not to always side with the teacher.

"dizietsma so you have written of the whole state education system because of one teacher after a bad day?"

Nope, I see this kind of attitude as symptomatic of the greater ills of the system and social institution of school. The way institutionalisation affects individuals is damaging for all involved. School is no exception. I don't blame teachers for the terrible state of education, but the system is rotten to the core, and I will not impose it on my DD.

I've put a lot more thought into not sending DD to school than just reading a post on mumsnet BTW! OP's post has confirmed my suspicions though.

I think Alan Moore is right on the money about school-

"The flow of vital youth along school corridors like sheep towards a shearing. Frisking, unaware. The real cirriculum is punctuality, obedience and the acceptance of monotony, those skills we shall require later in life. Oblique aversion therapy to cure us of our thirst for information, and condition us so that thereafter we forge an association between indolence and pleasure."

What, so the OP saying that she's tired of badly behaved children and crowd control has confirmed your belief that the state system is "rotten to the core"?

Do you have much experience of a modern school curriculum dizietsma ?

The quote from Alan Moore does not relate to any school I have been in for a long long time, even in the failing secondary!

The OP is a teacher who;d had a bad day at school yesterday. Have you never had a bad day? The OP simply let out a bit of a rant on here. Doesn;t mean she did it at school woth her pupils does it?

"The flow of vital youth along school corridors like sheep towards a shearing. Frisking, unaware. The real cirriculum is punctuality, obedience and the acceptance of monotony, those skills we shall require later in life. Oblique aversion therapy to cure us of our thirst for information, and condition us so that thereafter we forge an association between indolence and pleasure."

I know there are some bad schools, I taught in one until I could do it no longer. But that quote sounds nothing like the average school day of my pupils. The system is not rotten to the core at all, there are bad parts and bad teachers but there are many wonderful schools in both the state and private sector.

Guess we will have to agree to disagree though, as you say you have not based your judgement on MN so I am not going to make any difference.

I don't let things go and the school has not done anything wrong tbh. Dd is kicking up a fuss every night about reading her school books. She is a very good reader but I dont think she is making the progress she should. She does not read enough at home. I have made an appointment to speak to her teacher, dd is distraught as she loves school and her teacher. Dp says I am mean.

gerontius... I think it's maybe the fact that she describes some children as "shitty" that's maybe confirmed parts of it.

As a nurse i have nursed patients who are more challenging and difficult, but don't think i would ever call them "shitty".

Not nice, and i think she lost a lot of credibility when she said that.

dizietsma you are wrong. The OP has accepted she was having a bad day. You have numerous teachers on here telling you it is not their experience.
I have posted on numerous threads recently about how I use the curriculum to do the exact opposite of what Alan Moore claims and have many colleagues who do the same.

I am actually offended that you assume that we work in a system that treats children like sheep. Credit us with more imagination, creativity and morality.
It is arrogant to impune the whole system and by default all of those who work within it. It is also inaccurate based on my experience of 12 years in the classroom.

Also, sitting her wondering how after almost thirty years of formal education, and working within a "rotten system" for so many years, I haven't yet become punctual, obedient, monotonous, lazy or have lost my thirst for knowledge.

"The quote from Alan Moore does not relate to any school I have been in for a long long time, even in the failing secondary!"

Oh yeah? What about the rote learning and recitation of knowledge for SATS then?

It's not specifics about school that I object to, not individual cirricula or initiatives, it's a philosophical objection to the whole dynamic of learning as something to that happens to children, as opposed to something they do, live.

Cirricula that are decided by someone in an office far away from the child it will be inflcited upon, often totally irrelevant to the needs and interests of the child.

"Also, sitting her wondering how after almost thirty years of formal education, and working within a "rotten system" for so many years, I haven't yet become punctual, obedient, monotonous, lazy or have lost my thirst for knowledge."

LOL

Well, the system fails on every level then, doesn't it?

Me neither Clemette

I love to learn and will never lose that, I spend hours every week updating my subject knowledge and get a huge buzz from passing on something new or even better when a pupil teaches me something new.

applauds clemette

The "system" as you and Moore see it doesn't exist.
Genuine question, have you spent many hours in a school?

PS We don't do SATs

whats cirricula?

I am not as bonkers as flatcap though. I do not like marking

Can't stand it myself - one advantage of being a music teacher

singular of curriculum

I have never ever asked a child to recite anything apart from once when I had a set of Year 11 boys who struggled to read. We learnt though singing hymns in a tongue in cheek way, they loved it.

Oh and "never eat shredded wheat" I think we chanted that a few times the other week.

Shit I think I may be crap.

ohhhhhh curricula [winks]

Advantage of my subject is that I can teach whatever I want.

indeed!

It is the one thing I don't miss about A level teaching.
(wistfully thinking about the days when my "obedient" and "indolent" students were ejected from the House of Commons for heckling...)