to be bl**dy furious that my DD has measles because other parents won't vaccinate?

[elportodelgato]

poor DD is only 11 mo and has horrid measles all over her, full of cold, streaming eyes, diarrhea, very unhappy and sleepy and limp. I am so so for her, but more I am absolutely bloody with idiot parents who won't have the MMR!

The doctor actually told me this morning that the reason it is so prevalent in our area is because of stupid people refusing to vaccinate their children and compromising the immunity of the whole group. So now my LO, who is only 2 months off having the vaccination herself, is really really sick because of other people's stupidity. It's making my blood boil! Do people not realise how dangerous it can be in little babies? And does anyone still seriously believe the so called "research" which claimed a link between MMR and autism? It has been so completely discredited in recent years you would think people would have got over it by now and started vaccinating again

Arrgh!!

well I thought the HPA and WHO were pretty reliable - oh well I thought wrong

Novice for you and your little DD.

SOrry if I'm sounding patronising or anything here but have you tried laying in a cool bath with her for 5 minutes to see if that will even help a little?

I am no expert just I remember when I had a fever my mum used to do that with me obviously not sure how it is with measles though. Maybe try laying her down with her favourite TV show or something and give her a massage sorry am really just trying to think of anything that calms my son down when he is ill.

And don't you fuss yourself about research etc you have enough going on!!! If you are quarantined then where else are you meant to vent?

Better to let it out than hold it in with such a stressful situation going on.

If you need to talk then feel free I for one am willing to listen to you rant away ;)

Novice

If I offered you the chanec, for the sake of social conscience, to tke my ds4 to the surgery for a vaccination wold you then be rpepared to look into his and my eyes in a few years time if he developed ASD and say 'well it probably wanst the jab and you now, for the sake of others..'

I ahve 2 disabled chidlren, ds1 willalways need supprt, ds3 some level of lifelong care, he is in a special needs school

DS2 has probable adhd / dyspraxia

we kniow taht we are at risk, teh genes and Paedds tell su that- what they cannot tell us is the triggers that might set off the genes in the alrge likelihood he has them (he ahs the casein intolerance that seems to be linked with the boys).

I have to do what I can to protect him. And not just him- having been told three times now that boys have SN to various levels has worn me out tbh, I don't want to do it again. I joke with people that three gets you an award four would make me a saint but actually no, four would be petrifying, the abyss.

The reason your children haven't been affected by these diseases Leonie is because most people do have their children vaccinated - not because they have a good constitution or whatever. Good isn't it - you can get away without giving the MMR and because most people do your little darlings will be safe. If you want to live outside society you should go and live on an island somewhere.

And LOL @ "social conscience"

Are you really saying that you would vaccinate your baby if you thought there was the slightest chance that it could damage her for life?

You only gave her the MMR because you think that concerns have been discredited.

Social conscience, my tired feet. As if anyone here, anyone at all, would potentially cause damage their own baby for the common good.

CoteDAzur sorry but "everyone I know" isn't a scientific sample!

For example ...

Everyone I know who's had unprotected sex hasn't caught a serious STD, but if I was still single I'd be using the condoms when sleeping with a new partner.

Do you see?

[not criticising you FAQ]

ruty- the difference probably comes from it being a developing country where vitamin A deficiency makes measles so much more dangerous. So perhaps worth trying to make sure you don't miss any cases who have lost maternal protection before 12 months. However, if you give a measles vaccine before 12 months you require another one in your second year. Post 15 months is slightly more effective than at say 13 months (no idea why they changed the timing here to 13 months - have never managed to find a reason).

I don't understand basic immunity.

Why does all of the population (or large percentage) need to be vaccinated in order to prevent the disease if one's DCs have been vaccinated?

Am genuinely puzzled...

yes saintlydame you're probably right. Sorry thread making me feel a bit sick, though sorry about OP's dc.

But Cote those of us that drive take risks every time we get into a car, life is full of risks surely?

Hope your poor little dd is better soon, novicemama. All the best.

Well I was certainly aware of the (very small) risks arising from vaccinations. I put those into context of the far greater statistical risk of contracting measles, both to my child and the broader community, and made the decision accordingly. Given my family health history, the risks were very much in favour of having the MMR.

It's to prevent spread of the disease ilove. If your child has been vaccinated and the vaccination has worked (which it doesn't always) then your child shouldn't catch measles (but if exposed should have a very effective booster).

but look at the figures in my "oh got it" linnk - look how many cases were NOT in children.

You can't go blaming parents who have decided not to give the MMR since the Wakefield report for the outbreaks when you look at the figures and see just how many cases there have been in ages 15yrs+

2003 - the first real "peak" in the number of cases - of the 438 cases, over 1/2 of them were in people for who the Wakefield report would have had no impact on their vaccinating (or not) their child.

novicemama, I am so sorry to hear your DD is poorly with the measles. I had the measles as a child and remember it being an awful experience (felt like death warmed up )

Can I just say in regards to you statement in you op (idiot parents who won't have the MMR!) I am one of those idiot parents who hasn't let DD have the MMR. I have however had DD vaccinated with the singles vaccines so she is still vaccinated against it. I take offense at being labeled an idiot for not letting DD have the MMR, she is still vaccinated but the statistics don't show children who have been given the singles vacs as being vaccinated.

"Given my family health history, the risks were very much in favour of having the MMR.'

And that is the point. Given our family history I believe the risks to ds2 and ds3 are in favour of not having the MMR. It would be quite easy (and cheap) to set up an immune panel and questionnaire to try and ascertain individual risks before vaccinating (and tweaking the schedule accordingly). Unfortunately the Dept of Health prefers to spend millions on advertising and hiring a lion .

As Linden says, every single day we do things that put our children at risk. Mine do lots of statistically dangerous sports and also play out unsupervised. Like everything in life, one has to make a calcluation of the realistic risk versus the benefit.

For the majority of people, the risk of problems arising from any vaccination are statistically tiny.

Yes the doesnt always work is important also; I cant find a link (sorry) but in a recent outbreak in Wales a significant number of the children had been vaccinated.

TBH if vaccination doesn't even gusrantee immunity, with our rare history I'm even less inclined to risk it

I have not read all the thread because frankly the level of ignorance by some people dismays me.. I must be an idiot parent because I spent hours and hours over months researching vaccines... and then chose not to vaccinate.. how much research did those of you that chose to vaccinate do? Or did you just blindly beleve the vaccination leaflet?

oh that's interesting FAQ. Wonder whether vaccine induced immunity is wearing off earlier than expected (I don't buy the one or 2 jabs for life for measles immunity line) so the increase in cases is due to waning vaccine immunity.

Have been saying for years that the Dept of Health needs a teen booster (then a thirties booster, then a 50's. then 70's.....)

Herd immmunity occurs when the level of vaccination reaches a certain level for the population. It varies with different diseases. For measles the required vaccination level is quite high to stop an outbreak. Also the vaccination only fully vaccinates about 10% of those vaccinated - hence the booster, which mops up most of those for whom it didn't work the first time. You always have some that remain vulnerable despite being vaccinated, add to them those who can't be vaccinated for various reasons and you get your vulnerable group. If you add in a lot of people who choose not to vaccinate the levels do not nearly reach those needed for herd immunity.

Peachy- children with autism are statistically less likely to develop rubella immunity after vaccination than those without autism. Fairly recent paper somewhere.