to be annoyed with this sexist reading advice sent home from school?

[morningpaper]

"Until the day your daughter expresses an interest in rocket science or your son gets into showjumping, you won?t go far wrong if you try them out with these kinds of books?

Boys...

• Enjoy books about their interests - especially dinosaur ones!
• Like books that are a bit scary, funny or have silly jokes.
• Often have a shorter attention span, so books you can dip in and out of may work better for them. Try comic strip books and non fiction.
• Prefer big, bold, colourful illustrations or things that can be moved or touched.
• Like reading to have a purpose, for example books that show you how to make things or tell you about things.

Girls...

• Enjoy series of books about the same characters.
• Like to listen to talking books and watch DVDs of favourite books.
• Enjoy a bit of fantasy, magic and make believe ? princesses, castles and so on.
• Like sparkle and glitter on the pages.
• Enjoy books that have props with them ? dolls, soft toys, dressing-up clothes."

I think it is a case of aiming for the very best we can, whilst obviously not trying to force what is unappealing or uninteresting for the child.

Couldn't agree more gingersarah.

but (speaking as a musician) there's some really crap music written (not just in recent times either - I'm talking 100's of years ago too) - but people still enjoying playing it (well I do anyhow )

good post gingersarah

Have just seen a post on here that mentioned that the poster piscesmoon I think, knows many girls in beavers, Cubs and Scouts, but NO boys in rainbows, Brownies etc

Well, that is because THEY ARE NOT ALLOWED!!

As simple as that. GirlGuiding UK is Committed to "a female only zone" (where girls can develop without the competition/distraction of having boys around).I DO know of ONE parent who wanted their son to join Rainbows because

a) they can join a year earlier and
b) he (the parent) thought some of the older boys a bit rough

with girls joining Beavers etc it might be beacause they have siblings or friends there, the day or time is more convenient, or because they genuinely like the activities, or through lack of alternative (eg our village has Rainbows, which I run, but no Brownies, so many of the girls go on to cubs instead rather than hunt around for a space/travel out of area. It depends on the girl. But BOYS JUST DON'T HAVE THE OPTION.

Now, how's THAT for sexist?!

me too, gold FAQincenseandmyrhh! but the act of playing instruments is real and unmediated, even if the actual music is some rubbish like Delius or something (sorry if you like Delius) (insincere apology emoticon)

Of course it's OK to read a wide variety of things. But if girls feel it's 'weird' to be interested in science, or non-princess type books, then they won't try them.

My dd1 (5) already comes with home with "these are boys things, these are girls things" and 'knows' that girls like princesses, make-up, dresses and boys like being rowdy, pirates, etc.

I'm continually challenging the gender stereotyping she gets (including from me) as a matter of course. So it makes me cross when a book company, or educational establishment start doing it too!

It would only take one of her friends to tell her that 'Horrid Henry' (which she loves) was a 'boy's book' and I don't doubt she would stop reading them - or it would make her feel differently about them. At the moment she identifies with Henry. And that's how reading was for me, doesn't matter if the character or setting is male or female, you identify with the character.

I'd hate to destroy that for her.

sorry but reading/playing music - when done for pleasure - what's the difference whether it's crap music or great music, crap writing or great writing?? Why do we have to be able to draw something for life out of a story - why can't we/our children just read for the sheer hell of it???

and, imo, books just like music are open to interpretation.

Because FAQ, great literature can expand your horizons (and your volcabulary) and TEACH you about the world

I don't know whether there are parallels with music but I am a music ignoramus

FAQ - it does matter what they read, because the more they read the more impact the material will have on their expectations of life. Will they expect to get out and do stuff for themselves, or will they be happy to do their hair and nails until 'rescued' by a prince?

I agree with goldfaq. I'm not bothered if it's good or bad. But I am bothered if you're told 'it's not for you - you're a girl'

FAQ - cross-posted. If you give your child crap writing how on earth will they learn to love reading?

I know you are MP - wasn't it you that started the "what's the point in learning an instrument thread" .

Fair enough great literature can expand your horizons, but you know what - sometimes it's nice just to pick up a book to read for the sheer hell of it.

I can't say that reading all those Enid Blyton books made me want to grow up and do my nails and hair and wait to be rescued by a prince!

And do you know why I think that is - because my parents (well my mum really) showed me things in RL (ie not in my little fantasy land in my head that I created while reading) that really showed me what I could do regardless of my gender. She expanded my view on the world in real life ways (as well as the non-fiction books I looked at).

Notreally - well I don't think that anyone on here would argue that most of my favourite books as a child were good writing, but it didn't stop me loving reading, and it didn't stop me reading some really great books as I grew older (Catch 22 withstanding - gave up after 4 attempts on that one)

A lot of Enid Blyton books are GREAT

I'd far rather my children were reading them than the Disney fairy crap that is around

oh god MP - ermm well I'm not talking about the more "grown-up" ones like Malory Towers, Famous Five........I'm talking about the stuff aimed at younger kids (Far Away Tree, Wishing Chair, that kind of thing) which I used to lie in my bed and read even as a teenager

And as for Disney fairy crap (as you so delightfully put it ), well are the story lines in those really that much better than The Princess and the Pea, Cinderella, Rumplestiltskin, Chicken Licken (oh that was my all timne favourite story when I was really little - my mum knew it off by heart as she had to read it to me so many times - but my goodness it was only when I read it to DS1 a few years ago I realised just how horrible it is), The Sly Red Fox (yes we had most of the ladybird series too)

But that Faraway Tree/Wishing Chair stuff is lovely - well apart from the racist bits obv - it's good old-fashioned KIDS FANTASY, imaginary worlds and fairy-tale creatures

It is not based on boys being naughty and girls being pretty, like a lots of 'modern writing'

We probably have diff ideas on what constitutes crap writing. For me it's anything that glosses over any inconsistencies that get in the way, or stuff that's clearly written just to sell something. I loathe Noddy but at least it has an internal logic... And anyone else have to sit through this week's Sarah Jane adventures? Universe saved but a huge blow to causality

FAQ didn't reading LOTR make you want to go on a quest?
Or Enid Blyton make you want to go to boarding school, and have your own detective agency, and go off adventuring every holidays?

I am glad your mum showed you what was available to you in rl.... but what is distressing is the fact that many little girls' mothers are also part of this pink fluffy playboy logoed world- who actually are bringing their daughters up to believe they don't have to work in school, because as long as they are nice enough and pretty enough, and groomed enough they can marry a rich man who will take care of them forever....

I know I have moved away from the books thing... but toys for girls are things like make-up and nail polish for 3 year olds- teaching tiny children to make themselves sexually attractive- completely irresponsible, and we wonder why UK has highest rates of teenage pregnancy, and early ages of sexual activity? I know you have boys... but you must have noticed the clothes aimed at little girls- cropped tops, short skirts, padded bras for 7 yo FFS!

I know, I know books are about enjoyment for their own sake, in the way that music is, (my favourite activity is reading) and yes we need heavy and light of both in balance. However- books are still our main medium for teaching children (and adults!) and girls raised on 'Sparkle Princess Fluffykins' are going to have a bit of a shock when they pick up secondary textbooks that have prose in that you actually have to think about, and work at to take in.

Nope reading LOTR for the first time made me realise that the train was running exceedingly late as I finished the whole thing on my journey home from school (was a bit disappointed actually as I intended to spend my half term reading it and finished it in one day).

And I didn't really need books to help me want to go on a quest, growing up 25+yrs ago, in a quiet little village within walking distance of the beach, in the days that a 7yr old boy and a 4yr old girl going off on their own for an hour or 2 wasn't frowned on there were plenty of real life adventures (and that was before I could even read)

The difference between traditional fairy stories and the Disneyfied versions though is that the people in the original tales had to use their ingenuity, or their valour, or bravery etc to win... and sometimes they didn't win through anyway (yes- I agree, many of the m are horrible re-reading as an adult).
With the Disney ones all that is required is for the heroine to be beautiful and win her man, and everything will be okay. It is so bloody vapid!

Funny - no one told me this when I was little. I loved the hardy boys and Journey to the Centre of the Earth etc. Always hated glitter and pink. Good at maths. Does this mean I'm a boy????! Funny I have breasts then

Cinderella is SHIT FAQ

utter tripe

let me make that QUITE clear