To think Mumsnet is xenophobic

[sittight]

When it comes to Americans?

If it was about any other nation it would be called out as the racism is it.

I’ve seen it today across the Halloween threads - people looking down their nose at Halloween because it’s an ‘American import’ (which it isn’t).

The attitude that baby showers are disdainful because they’re American. The snobbery about proms because they’re American. Elf on the Shelf, gender reveal parties etc. - fair enough if you just don’t like them but there are always derisive posts about them being American.

I suspect the same people embrace traditions imported from other cultures but when it comes to American traditions there is such snobbery.

to the extent this is a thing, it punching up isn't it.

It’s the sort of mindless, stupid ignorance behind every bigot. They hear the narrative they want to hear and refuse to believe that there may be a hugely diverse number of views and experiences in any group they don’t belong to and never will.

My parent plus siblings were evacuated to the states during the war where they were treated with the most extraordinary kindness, generosity and love. Their education was excellent. They were given gentle guidance to be the very best people they could be and returned with the most loving ties which lasted for the rest of their lives.

I cringe when I hear a Brit spit out ‘American’ like it’s a bad word. Shame on us.

because it is not Anerican

What on earth…? Yes, its a British website, founded by a British person. You don’t like that? Don’t use it.

Also there are many traditions that may be very old, that have crossed over and come back to us from the USA with new interpretations and rituals. There’s nothing odd about pointing that out. Nor about disliking them, actually. Every culture, by distinction of being one, chooses what it will import and how - the US wouldnt have been capable of introducing changes else!

Try being English.

Apparently we don't even have a culture!

Society is generally very divided at the moment and very opinionated. Lots of kill joys generally who just like to tread on other people's life about anything and everything. Just ignore them.

' A lot of American imports are nice and fun - like prom. What kind of joyless bores object to PROM? Or even baby showers.'

The UK has/had equivalents to both which didn't involve rampant consumerism. 6th form dances existed way before the introduction of 'prom' and the £ spent on hair, make up, dresses, limos, 'decor' etc. women had gatherings of friends and family to celebrate the upcoming birth of a baby without 'decor' (balloon arches, favours, pink and/or blue cookies)

While the UK has long history of marking Halloween, the trick or treat grabfest, plastic pumpkin 'decor' Freddie slasher costume celebration is very new. I saw footage fields of pumpkins being ploughed back into the ground yesterday because they hadn't sold as pumpkins for carving, and they're not suitable as a food crop. So thousands of acres of valuable, productive farmland given over every year to the production of 'decor' that is either used for a few days as a doorstep decoration then chucked, or doesn't even make it that far.

The US has many great traditions. Rampant over consumerism isn't one of them.

This is probably true but it's also true that it's unfair to blame all Americans for Trump. To do so is xenophobia in action.

You weren’t ‘attacked’ on that thread at all. You didn’t say where in the world you were to be shopping at that time on Sunday evening and you were the one that replied sarcastically, then continued to make personal comments about the same person. You ended up being the ‘attacker’.

This! I do find most part of mainstream American culture quite crass and tacky, sorry Americans! Brits have our problems we can’t deny that but the American stereotypes aren't exactly made up are they…

I have been on two European city breaks this year, popular with international travellers but it was only Americans who spoiled it.

Dominating conversations with the tour guides (I honestly don’t know how one kept their patience!) so nobody else could ask questions and the tour guide kept missing parts of the tour as the loud abrasive American couple would not shut up and listen.

In a www2 museum and two different unrelated American families complaining there was nothing about how the Americans saved Europe…

Intimate dinner and the American group behind us were talking so loudly we couldn’t hold our own conversation.

oh and the American family who asked us which part of London we was from when they noticed we where British 😂 we are bloody northerners, I live closer to Edinburgh

I often think that people don’t mean American as such but that it’s something people saw on the tv and then decided to copy it so rather than slagging off Americans they are slagging off people who live here’s lack of critical thinking. I don’t think it’s really an anti American thing.

I think there is lots of xenophobia. Im sure its very annoying if you are a us citizen minding your own business in england.

i think its in part seen as acceptable compared to other countries, because the states sees itself as leader of the free world and is a superpower and it exports its culture via film, TV and tech brands, consumer brands all over. So I think its always going to get push back from people who feel the dominance is a threat to thier way of doing stuff. even if we have always done things here its fair to say how we do things is influenced by America. Lots of people embrace it too and adapt what they always did. I grew up carving turnips, the joy of my first pumkin. So easy.

I really dislike Halloween. however baby showers. I like and think rather cute.and designed to give mum's to be a little party.i do agree with above PP who said we are influenced by US DM used to say when Amerca sneezes. The rest of the world catches a cold! It seems strange that we look down on a country that.is very powerful.

Anti-American rhetoric is very popular all across the Internet because it's not seen as harmful due to Americans not being an opressed minority. The same thing with anti-English rhetoric, its acceptable for many to show disdain for anything English but not Scottish, Welsh or Irish for the same reason. I do agree its not right. I'm a Yorkshire lass, and it's like when people up here group all southerners as being posh and arrogant, it's absolutely ridiculous.

YABU. It's not xenophobia. It's a form of cultural dissonance.

American traditions don't import well into small European countries. But the UK in particular has allowed them to and been stupid enough to buy into it ALL, and now British traditions are dying out.

People were a lot slimmer in 1999 pre the Starbucks invasion. Americans ruined Cadburys chocolate. Stretch limos look ridiculous on English roads. School proms are leaving dos and do not require stupidly expensive clothing.

This doesn't mean I'm xenophobic. It does make me fed up with this weird attitude some people have that nothing English is worth preserving.

Of course lots of Americans walk. In cities laid out prior to mass use of the car, pavements are just like ours. But in many areas, they don't exist at all. I walked all over Manhattan, but on Long Island I had to get ubers to shops I could see from my hotel window. Walking, in those circumstances, is for weirdos.

I am English.

Er, maybe reread the post you quoted, the point of which was that ‘English’ and ‘British’ are not interchangeable.

A lot of that stuff isn’t for me but I actually really like American exuberance. YANBU though, people can be a bit miserable about anything american. Yeah I would never do a gender reveal, I think prom is over hyped, I do like halloween American style, kids love it etc but culture is ever shifting, people don’t have to like it at all but it’s the reflex to tear it down quite viciously which makes me feel a bit startled sometimes. What other people do doesn’t really bother me unless someone is causing harm.

This. The consumerism and individualism...
Also, the fact that so many millions of people voted from Trump.. twice...shocking! USA is my favourite country to travel by the way but I won't be going as long as Trump is in power. I don't expect to agree on the politics of every country I visit but this is on another level, disturbing. I have lost a lot of respect.

I love Halloween though.

British people can be really snotty about the US and Americans, going well beyond valid criticism of things like the political system, health system and gun laws. While this site is mostly populated by Brits, if you want to see the balance redressed, go on the rest of social media and see what Americans say about British food. Apparently we live on beans on toast and jellied eels and all our food is totally bland as we’re terrified of spices.

Personally I think we should judge all cultural imports on their merits. If it weren’t for African Americans, we wouldn’t have jazz, rock and roll, soul and funk, blues music or any of the genres arising from them.

For me it is the conspicuous spending involved in some of the imported US rituals that grates. And the competitiveness.
I think these detract from the spirit of community rituals which are about sharing.
It is for instance very hard for many families to keep up when it comes to the excesses of the school prom. And wholly unnecessary. Don't get me started on nursery proms with mortar boards ..... !!

America comes across to me as a culture steeped in competitive spending and the flamboyant acquisition of goods which conflicts with their widespread avowal of their version of Christianity. I would be happy for any Americans on here to disabuse me of that view as there are I am sure millions of thoughtful citizens with solid caring values.
But they did vote for Trump (another Christian) which does not help!

I do struggle with the baby showers and gender reveals ... when I had my babies you did not count your chickens that all would go well with a delivery until they were in your arms!

By all means let us celebrate things of importance to us but let's get rid of the plastic tat and the competitive element.

I think some posters are missing the point, or perhaps being wilfully disingenuous. It’s not as simple as not liking a particular aspect of American culture/speech etc. Everyone is entitled to an opinion on what they do or don’t like. It’s the scathing attitude. It can be difficult to convey tone in writing, but plenty of posters on here seem to manage it. I do think it is seen as ok to look down on Americans as rather inferior. You can be disappointed to see US cultural practices taking over from British traditions, but there’s no need to be so sneering about it. If you don’t like it, don’t participate.

Such a shame that they were not so loving, and generous to their other fellow Americans, at the same time eh.

Starbucks pumpkin latte disgustingness is actively causing harm, I would say. It has 390 calories by itself, apparently. A cup of tea and a fairy cake has about 100.