Year 7 (who is very good at maths) has been put in the bottom sets.

[ReevesJeeves]

My DD has always been very good at Maths. In Year 6, she achieved Greater Depth in her Maths SATS (achieving 115/120). Since joining Year 7, she has been in a mixed ability Maths Set. In the work that has been sent home from Secondary and that is set on Sparx, she is getting 80% - 90% correct, independently.

We have just had a letter home today, advising that Maths will be set after half term, and my DD will be in Set 5 of 6! The letter also explains that she has been assessed as finding Maths challenging and not to worry about sets, every child will be assisted individually. AIBU to think the school doesn’t know my DD at all, and to send an email querying how they came to this decision? I fail to see how she can now be finding maths challenging and in Set 5 of 6, having achieved 115/120 in her SATS only months ago. Maths has always been a subject she has excelled in, right down to her KS1 Times Tables test where she scored 100%. BTW this is not a selective school or grammar, it’s mainstream state, so it’s not as though the department will be awash with Maths geniuses (in the least offensive way). I also don’t want to appear as a trouble maker or someone the school will be fed up with, but I think this needs to be questioned to find out what has gone wrong so to speak.

My husband thinks I shouldn’t say anything as the school will just think I’m a neurotic mum, I disagree and I think it needs to be dealt with and questions asked pronto - something has clearly gone drastically wrong either with the teachers assessment of DD or in the way DD is presenting herself in class?!

PS

We had a change of HT for S2. The new chap was a linguist who had interpreted at the peace negotiations between France and Germany at the end of WW2 and apparently had a bit more understanding with regard to the lack of correlation between foreignness and intelligence.

For English, half a girl's class had been placed with half a boy's class. Although we had been streamed, the English Department was using a common course where marks were dependent on outcomes. When we moved into S3 at the age of 14, I was moved into the top set.

The girl who eventually became a depute was deemed to be able enough to take Latin in S2 and above but, inexplicably, was put in the bottom set for English for S3. She'd been in the other half for English and we didn't have the same teacher - obviously her teacher had been less than thorough in giving her setting recommendations.

On her first day in S3, her new English teacher looked at her jotter, went up to her and asked "What the heck are YOU doing HERE?"

She was moved the next day.

ETA I'm rambling, I know, but just giving an example of how schools can get this wrong.

I just pick up the phone and ask to speak to someone then air my concern or raise my query. I do it respectfully but with a sensible approach. I don’t care if they think I’m one of “those” mums, I hope they do, I find it helps them stay focused when it comes to my kids.

Human in busy profession with multiple decisions, information and people being dealt with all day everyday, makes a mistake isn't the hot take you think it is.

As a secretary, what qualified her to decide whether a teacher's decision was 'a simple and obvious mistake' did she not condider that there was a lot of background information that your "support staff" friend was not party to?

It’s good you messaged the school. I agree with your husband that you don’t want to email the school about every little thing but I don’t think this is a little thing. It could have long lasting consequences for your daughter and just doesn’t add up.

I am a teacher. I would ring and ask to speak either to the head of year or head of maths. You are not being annoying, you are sorting a situation out that you know is wrong. Make sure that the office knows that you consider the matter urgent when you ring and need a call back today.

This is true, but it is also true that bottom sets are usually populated with the kids who struggle in all way - not just learning - and so behaviour is poor. Good schools put their best staff there. Others don’t and the kids struggle even more.

Chase it. Ring and speak to Head of Year or Head of Maths. Admin error. It does happen. I am sure it will be sorted. 115 puts them on a flight path for level 8/9 GCSE. They should not be in Set 5.

Wait and see what they say in the email - it does sound like there’s been an error.

FWIW my eldest DC was put in bottom set maths at his very academic independent school. The school was careful not to explicitly state which sets were top/bottom, but the kids seemed to quickly work out the order 😂

I was nowhere near as aware of you of his test scores etc, but I do remember being a bit surprised when he said he was in the lowest set, as he’d never struggled with maths. I think after a year the sets all got re-jigged…he went on to do maths a-level and got an a-star in it, so being in a low set for a while isn’t necessarily a catastrophe!

Bottom set of a comp?

It was the case when I did gcse in the 90s, it’s hardly new

Was this in a state comprehensive? As that would be very unusual for a school to keep someone capable of getting a top grade in the same set as children who struggled with basic maths.

They're claiming that your daughter is finding some aspects of the subject challenging. I'd be asking precisely which aspects of maths she's finding challenging and what is being done to address the issue

This is a great place to start OP.

Definitely chase it up @ReevesJeeves

But as people are saying, that’s not normal at a state school. Lower sets are taught foundation maths where the highest possible grade is a 5. They aren’t taught the content needed to achieve a 9. The bottom set will contain kids who need a lot of support just pass the GCSE. It makes no sense to try and teach them content needs for higher grades if they struggle with the basics.
So yes your son’s class / school may have done it differently, but it absolutely makes them an outlier and it’s most definitely not the case in the vast vast majority of state schools.

I hadn't realised your DS was at the same school as mine.

Bottom set in a very academic private school is completely different to the bottom set at a state comp. At the very academic private school close to me the lowest grade in gcse maths was a 6, only 11 pupil achieved less than an 8. So the bottom set would be achieving grades 6-8. In the bottom set at a state comp they wouldn't be learning any of the higher level content and would be put in for foundation so wouldn't be able to achieve higher than a 5. It's a completely different kettle of fish.

Was your child at a selective school where even the bottom set were put in for the higher maths paper? It just wouldn't be possible for bottom set to achieve anything above a 5 at a state comp as they wouldn't be sitting the higher paper.

I'd query it, and I'm not a pushy parent. I'm a school teacher myself, and realise that most people who also work in schools are simply trying their best. It's entirely possible there's been an admin error, for example, two Amy's getting muddled up.
I'd just politely email explaining you're concerned about her setting, considering she's always previously been fairly gifted at maths. If you don't get a sensible response, then ask for a face to face.
I remember my mum calling my secondary school when I was in Year 9 to tell them I'd been saying my maths set was too easy, and could I be moved up? I was a sensible, hard-working kid, so they were happy to go with it if I wanted to.

As for Sparx, it's total bollocks. I do some private tutoring after school, and twice a week go to help a Year 8 with her online homework. She's autistic and just can't keep up with it. And when she was new in Year 7, she was getting sent home the wrong homework, which was at about a Year 10 level - and this poor kid had got "below expected" for her SATs a couple of months before! Parents really had to push to get it looked at and altered.

Yes, chase it. You want it sorted before they go back after half term.

Agreed. The sooner this is dealt with, the better.

Let us know what happens op!

Yes chase it and I’d call the office too. It’s obviously an administrative error.

Thats surely very unusal or a more flexible school that my DC went to.

Maths here an usual three teir system compared to usual two- you can only get the higher grades on top paper and only first two sets really sat higher.

That's not new either - friend of mine at secondary in 90s sitting GCSE was in third group was put on a paper that capped highest score at C - she did really well but they wouldn't let her take maths A-level as she hadn't been taught the higher content - it was pain for her as degree she wanted often specified maths a-level so resticted her choices.

I know boards very hugely and school attitudes vary but sitting higher papers in lower sets is very unsual base on DC and DN and their mates experiences especially in a comprehsive school like OP DD in. It's probably less unusal in any sort of selective school.

It could well be a Sparx issue - they switched to it for DD2 and she lasted longest in her year with it but it was not a helpful peice of software at the time.

I would ring or e-mail again today becuase it is so close to half term - and politely ask what going on - is she suddenly struggling or is there an error in setting.

I would if she stays in the lowest set - do extra maths either on-line with you or with an external turtor at home so she doesn't fall behind and that becomes a reason to keep her in lower sets later on.

I doubt very much that poster is talking about a comprehensive school. No way are bottom set pupils in a comp getting maths grade 9s!