To think it’s crazy that National Minimum wage is £27k

[Butterflyfluff]

Yet it’s not really enough to live on 😢

My first job paid £7.5k per year and I thought I was loaded! And I’m not ancient.

Now 2 people on NMW earn over £50k between them yet it’s really not enough these days.

Oh, here we go 🙄

Food and energy bills are bad but IMO It’s all housing. I’m not far off minimum wage but because I have a £350 mortgage (cheaper part of the country, bought before house prices rocketed) I’ve got plenty spare, paid off car and a couple holidays a year. If I was renting or wasn’t able to buy when I did I’d be paying £1000+ per month and life would be very different. I feel really sorry for everyone getting shafted by housing costs.

But what are your contracted working hours/weeks? It’s unlikely to be 37/40 hours a week all year round.

You have your answer there - it's housing costs and children, sadly! We spent exactly the same in the last financial year, and live very well, run two cars, go away etc, but we own our own home, and our children are now adults.

Yes we do. But we're not on 20k a year like the poster in question claimed.

I totally agree!
Im saying in order to say a full time job at NMW is 27k, that a 21+ person would need to be working 41 hours a week!
Which is nonsense!

Whilst there is no legal definition of FT in the UK, 35-40 is generally considered to be FT, with 37.5h used as a benchmark in many sectors.
So really a FT minimum wage job is more likely to 25k than 27k!

I think what's crazy is that there are loads of jobs that demand experience and degrees and perhaps even post grad qualifications and these are not earning that much more than 25k. The margins are small in so many careers.

Mumsnet is usually ridiculous though. Expectations are way in excess of the average salary.

What has happened in the last 30 years is that it's become essential to have two salaries. If you are single, it is very very hard.

Inflation is insane. I was on 36k 10 years ago exactly and was feeling very pleased with myself that after several promotions I'm now on £56k only... my BOE inflation calculator tells me this is exactly the same as my ssalary 10 years ago in real terms, despite my role being several rungs above. Actual roles at my preivous level are still paying around mid 30s, so the same, but of course much less due to inflation so more like what 25k or so would have been 10 years ago.

We've all been royally shafted.

😂 works full time but just happens to earn personal tax allowance. You mean he doesnt declare his earnings correctly?

Apologies, ive read on where someone has pointed out its not you who originally posted about the 20k

That’s definitely going to be the way for people in my generation. But my experience has been that pensioners now have really healthy private pensions (unless only one working or previously self employed) and own their own homes. I appreciate that this isn’t the case for all, but for my generation and the one that comes after it, it doesn’t look good for us comparative to pensioners now.

This! I doubled my wage with a 2 level promotion, then minimum wage got higher and higher and dragged all of the levels super close again.

Somehow the high rate of tax is only double minimum wage too…how is that healthy for an economy.

i didn’t realise there was a differentiation for GP salaries - learn something every day :)

in Ref to the poster who spends £21.5k Pa - you obviously don’t live in the SE, basic housing cost for the four of us is just under £20k without council tax/ water/energy/childcare/car+fuel/goid, forget holidays and eating out.

But we’d be super rich earning our salaries out of SE, now it’s rob Peter to pay Paul 😢

The average private pension for current couples who are pensioners is £500 a month.
People on MN seem to know mainly wealthy people

My take home is £2600 of which £1000 goes on mortgage - I’m a lone householder so no one to share the bills with and am struggling
On the average household income I could not survive

Yeah I don’t. I only know people who did manual labour or office jobs etc…but the pensions were very lucrative so they’re taking cruises multiple times a year. My own mum only worked part time, my dad retired through ill health just as his career was taking off (at around 50) and yet she takes around 5 holidays a year now on hers.

Is your figure looking only at those who take a monthly pension, because many don’t have it set up like this and will instead have pension pots worth 100s of thousands, just drawing down on it when needed. Are they skewing your numbers downward because they show as receiving 0 or very little a month?

Honestly, how do you manage that, with new cars and holidays on 20k a year? No mortgage/rent?

edit: I see others have asked! Ignore me :-)

It’s hard. I’m also a single income and on 28.5k

I mentioned DH and I spent £21.5k in the last financial year, and we live in an expensive area just outside London. However, I pointed out that we own our own home and our adult children have left home, which are the two biggest expenses. When our mortgage finished and our DC finished university, we suddenly felt rich, after years of expense and frugal holidays!

Theoretically it should be enough to get by but if you are living and working in the SE, it isn't. Elsewhere in the country, where the work and opportunities are even scarcer, what do you do? We subsidise our one DC £1000 pm so that the training stage is affordable. It's okay, we manage, and it won't be forever, but most people can't pay.

Where are you getting your figures from? Someone working a normal 35 hour week (lunch not paid for ) it’s £23,132. My son is on minimum wage and could not afford to pay rent, council tax, bills, his phone etc. Ok if he was a couple, but he’s not.
So £1793 take home after tax and national insurance. Now take away average council tax (inc single person discount), average utilities, phone, insurance, internet/cable tv you are at about £1300/month. Food - £200/month excluding alcohol if careful. Transport? Car (after purchase) is about £220/month for petrol, insurance tax, MOT. Could be a lot more! No car? Then £120-150 for public transport. So a bit of savings there. Work pension? My son contributes £53/month to his. £827. £50/month clothes. £30/month hair. £100 for odd drink or takeaway, movie or dinner out. Ok now left with £677. And if you want Netflix? Amazon Prime? Most people have one or the other and maybe another like Disney Plus, but not essential. But let’s take care of our teeth! NHS are hard to find so £100-120 for a hygienist and annual dentist check. £647 left. Got any family or friends you want to buy a birthday or Christmas present for? Maybe a weekend away? Can’t afford a week! Why? Because there’s rent! What’s the average rent? The average in the uk (excluding London) in a shared house is about £700. Oh dear. So can’t afford average do better move to a cheaper than average area.

Yes it's monthly pensions. £145k is average pension pot for 65 to 74 year olds.
I don't know anyone taking five holidays a year except one couple. You know pretty wealthy people. It's not just about salary. Plenty of well off people inherit a lot, often close to retirement age.

I think whether it is enough to live on depends on where you live. Currently in London so you couldn't afford to rent anywhere and pay bills etc. Whereas when I was in a rural area of Wales this would have been enough.

When first started working after I left school around £1.50 an hour was average and if you manage to get a job that paid £2 an hour you would be delighted. Things are a tad more expensive these days.

Sorry, the housing thing is total and utter nonsense.
in the 22 years since we bought our house, in london, adjusted for inflation it has gone up 30% adjusted for fee’s its more like 20%
by comparison the money i put in my pension is up 200% adjusted for inflation
Yes between 1992 and 2006 massive increase, since then basically nothing

about half of pensioners are paying rent , and a significant fraction can claim pension credit/ universal credit because they are so poor

i think you have a skewed idea of pensioners

and a lot are used to living frugally to free up money for their treats

a lot who could claim the benfits they are entitled to don’t because they are used to paying their own way and living frugally

Our mortgage is less than £700 a month but we have a basic 3 beds house in a semi rural big commuter village. It's not a new build. We could have a bigger house but we don't want to stretch ourselves.