I’m curious about work, qualifications, and income and how they all relate.

[DoubtfulCat]

My dc has been asking how to become rich. I’ve no idea (🤣) but as I was musing that question I thought I would ask a few more:

What do you do as your main source of income?
What salary or income does this bring you?
What qualifications and experience do you have?
Did you have material and/or cultural capital support growing up and as a young adult - eg parents’ networks, paid tuition fees or ability to stay living at home and save on rent, support in mapping out a career path?

My answers:
I’m mainly a wellbeing practitioner in a school.
My FTE salary is £27,407.
I have a good joint honours BA, a postgraduate teaching qualification with 20 years’ experience in teaching, a Level 6 qualification in what I do now (which is related) plus over 2000 hours’ experience and CPD in that field. I also have experience in running a business, marketing, administration, bookkeeping, customer service…
I had cultural capital growing up but very little material support (I took loans and had a tiny grant at uni as they were phasing those out then), and no help with how to embark upon a career rather than get a job.

I love my work, I am super fortunate to enjoy working at what I do and rarely dread having to go to work. I don’t feel the pay matches the value of what I do. I don’t think it matches my expertise and experience. For me, I think it’s worth the low pay because I burned out before; however, it would be nice to get to the end of the month before the end of the money.

I work in another job as well which tops up my income. It’s as a lecturer in FE and there, my FTE salary would be £41,080. I don’t love the admin side of that job or the pressure, and I don’t think the pay there reflects the qualifications, skill, and demands of the job either. It has a reasonable pension (but not one of the old-style kind) but we are expected to take our holidays (during the college holidays of course) as booked leave and be on site if we aren’t on holiday. We get 21 days holiday FTE.

I’m curious about other people’s experiences in these areas. Are you willing to share?

You do sound underpaid for your qualifications and experience OP but being able to do a job you love is worth a lot.

I dropped out of uni, have had long stints of unemployment interspersed with minimum wage no skilled work. Did a qualification in aircraft maintenance but only worked for a year at that. Now I do a job (NDT inspection work) I have zero experience or qualifications for and earn just under 35000 euros, which isn't a great salary but its pretty good considering my lack of qualifications and experience. And I enjoy it.
My parents supported me in a non financial sense - education was always important and I was encouraged to do my best but they couldn't support me financially at all and I wasn't able to stay home and commute to uni. But even if they did support me it would have made no difference, I dropped out because I didn't want to return from my erasmus year.

To become rich, fundamentally you need to work for yourself and not someone else. Employment is not a route to wealth in this country.

I'm a SAHM at the minute but have two undergraduate degrees, one in law and one in English. Before we had kids I worked in management consulting and had a FTE of about 70k plus bonus. It was a bit of a roundabout career path, I started off in product management on a graduate scheme, then just kind of followed my strengths. My parents paid for everything until I left uni, no help with house deposit etc but I left uni debt free, able to drive, with a car etc. I got a 2:1 from an average red brick but I'm convinced the reason I got onto a competitive grad scheme was my extra curriculars, I was involved in EVERYTHING. Which of course I had the time and means to do, given that my parents were paying for everything, I didn't recognise that for the obscene privilege it was at the time.

I was going to mention DH's career too but other people have covered it, biotech, rare combination of people skills/common sense and technical understanding/ability. Working class background but very sporty. Makes in excess of 200k.

Most people I know who are ‘rich’ are later career, salaried individuals who went to uni, entered a profession that paid well when they left uni (law, accountancy) and went on to study for professional qualifications. Many were lucky to miss the negative equity drama of the early 90’s (an only just leaving uni) but have benefitted from property prices/low mortgages after that to build up significant equity and turn their salaries/savings into meaningful capital assets and are now late 50’s/early sixties and either already retired or planning it.

They didn’t set out to be rich - they set out to find jobs that would offer them a life-long career and, therefore, economic independence and security. They hoped they would find their careers fulfilling and interesting - and most have for the large part. So in addition to not being obsessed with ‘being rich’ they had no aspirations or delusions that their jobs should [only] be a vocation or a path to ‘self-actualisation’. They knew they would have to work hard and that professional training would be on-going throughout their careers.

We are ’rich’, but nonetheless went through periods of emptying the kids’ money boxes to put fuel in the car or do an end-of -month basic -shop to tie us over, especially in first few years of living in our current home 20 odd years ago (mortgage, renovations, unexpected/emergency repairs etc). We are now top 0.5% in terms of national wealth/income, which is nowhere near the wealth levels that people imagine it to be. There is a huge chasm within that top 0.5%, where we sit at the bottom. We could never afford (or justify) a Ferrari, a luxury holiday home in Europe or the designer brand clothing/bags/shoes that celebs and Russian oligarchs seem to flounce about with.

But we have been able to afford a practical second home (for dh’s job and DC uni, so they are sharing), private schools for senior school (both DC are SEN) and will be in a position to pay off DC student loans if they graduate (they have to complete/graduate to earn that). We will have a comfortable retirement, money for healthcare/old age care support (and have money to support my PiL for this), and we should be able to set our children up in modest first homes when we downsize. We will never have to ‘worry’ about money again and, hopefully, neither will our children which is the only type of wealth we aspire to given I started life in a council flat on benefits and free school meals. However, my DH has been physically sick from the stress for some years now. 12-16hour days, especially since hitting his mid 50’s and only being home 6-8 days a month has wiped him out and impacted our marriage at times - so it has come at a cost.

Being ‘rich’ is not the be all and end all. I’d be a bit sad if that was either of my DC’s driving motivation, rather than being financially secure and in a job/career that they feel is valuable and worthwhile - and hopefully personally rewarding.

I work in finance, it’s fine. It’s definitely not a passion but the work is easy, stress-free, and well paid. Computers have been doing 80% of the work for about 30 years, and AI has brought it up to about 95%. I do about 5 solid hours of work a week and the rest of the time I just keep half an eye on my emails while doing what I want. I earn about £70k which might not buy me my own private jet, but I feel pretty well-off. I made my choice early in my career to stay at the bottom of the ladder because I value having a peaceful easy life more than having extra money. I have never regretted that choice.

My degree is in maths. Parents helped me do well at school, gave me lots of extra maths homework etc. but they weren’t wealthy themselves so I didn’t go to private school or have a tutor or any networks. I’m glad about this, as with more “support” I probably would have ended up being partner by now, earning a lot more money but being a lot less happy.

Grew up in a financially precarious household due to father’s addiction. Then single parent household from his death at 14. Left school at 16. With 5 O’levels. Went to work in London as a Nanny. (No qualifications) . Then fell into estate agency in the LB of K&C (again, no qualifications needed) this was the 1980s so boom time. I made a huge sum of money. I don’t remember the cost of rent ever being an issue. After 5 years in the property world I took my self off to Italy to teach English (again without qualifications- but this time is was a disadvantage as my colleagues with degrees and TEFL cert earned 20% more. So I did the TEFL and went to Asia where I taught for 2 more years until I fell into aid work . There I staid until 31 when returned with husband and baby. I was picked up in the dole queue when my daughter was 9 months. (To be honest I was quite happy on the dole but what can you do when the jobcentre offers you a job ? )

30 years later I am still in the civil service. I’m now fairly senior and took semi retirement 3 years ago. When I finally took a degree through the OU as always felt stupid in comparison to colleagues.

My thoughts on this are that my experience was very much ‘then’ . With the exception of the civil service, where you can go in and work your way up - pretty much every job I’ve done , requires additional learning or a degree. When in fact all just require common sense and someone to show them the ropes .

I remember years ago, I was plugging away in my professional role, for which I was highly qualified, and at that point I had 15 years of experience. My next door neighbour, no real qualifications to speak of, worked in computers and software. He got an annual bonus which dwarfed my salary. Sometimes the relationship between qualifications, salary, experience etc makes no sense whatsoever.

115k, background is 1 BSc., 1 MSc and 1 Master in business (don't need 2 masters obviously but I changed careers in my late 20s). No other qualifications, 15 years experience.

My husband: 0 degrees, 20 years in civil service (including relevant qualifications on the job) then went private a few years ago. 65k.

How do you find it in terms of work-life balance since you had kids?
I am about to return from maternity leave to my job in a regional office of an international law firm and dreading it a bit!

To answer the OP’s question, I’m on about £120k as a lawyer (finance) in the regions however will soon go down to about £96k as I’m dropping to 4 days per week. I have an undergrad from a Russell Group uni and a law postgrad which you have to have and which was funded by my firm. I would be on much more money if I lived in London but that doesn’t really interest me.

I’m from a European country from a tiny village in the countryside, family not academic at all and whilst they did support me in everything I wanted to do, I had to find out how to do it and make it happen. Similarly in the UK I had no connections and didn’t know anyone when I arrived on my own at 19 years old but I worked really hard and made my own connections over the years.

Honestly, a bit grim. I went back on 4 days but quickly realised I was doing 5, expected to do 6 and getting paid for 4. That's frustrating. I did it for a while but then found the work load so awful I went back to FT working on condensed hours with remote working in my contract to save the commuting time. That helped my stress levels. I think you either have to do 3 days (at which point your career is effectively on hold) or 5 days but be aware you aren't competing on an even playing field. You just have to accept that for a few years. But you don't get that time back so consider it "leaning out" and "keeping your hand in". You cannot physically do what you did before. Don't try to be superwoman. Set realistic boundaries from the off. They will always take what you are prepared to give and will let you burn out. Don't.

It does get easier once both kids are at school. Much MUCH easier.

But usual rules apply - batch cook, slow cook, air fryer, Tesco delivery, cleaner. Lower standards. Which is hard when most women in law are INSANE PERFECTIONISTS.

Your question and thought pattern are as your title.

Thats a completely different question to ‘how do you become rich’.

I would ask your son what he thinks being rich is.

If it’s about accumulating wealth only then maybe get him the book ‘The millionaire next door’.

If it’s about being paid a lot then you are asking the right questions.

If it’s about living a rich life then that’s a completely different question. What is a rich life to him? Power, money, time, freedom?

You should read the story of the fisherman.
https://thestorytellers.com/the-businessman-and-the-fisherman/

So to your question.. I don’t earn multiple 100ks like PP. But am I rich. Absolutely. I work less days than the fingers on my hand per month. I pick my kids up from school everyday, I have no boss, freedom and live a comfortable happy life.

@JustMarriedBecca thank you for the honest response! I feel like your experience is the standard but no one really talks about it honestly.
I did think about condensed hours but will see how the 4 days per week / 80% hours works out. I don’t want to feel obliged to log on early or stay online late but as you say if that happens anyway then condensed hours makes sense. Even then I’m expecting to be excluded from certain kinds of deals because partners don’t like having a team member who is unavailable one day a week…
Apologies for the off-topic !

I have an 1st class undergraduate degree and a post graduate degree. Neither from top universities.
I am 10 years into my career, work 40 hrs a week and have worked for the same company since graduating.
Climbed the ranks without effort, promotions just happen based on experience, you don't have to 'go' for them.
I started on £25k as a graduate and now I'm on £60k. I should be on the cusp of my next promotion as well.
Pay rises are generous, both for promotions, inflation and then also regularly just to keep up with market rates. There is a skills shortage and that drives the market. Retention is important for companies.

My parents saved a pot of money to help me with uni, so I only had to take a loan for my masters year when the funds ran out. I did also work part time through uni to supplement it (and for years before uni!) They also gave me great advice. Particularly about the importance of saving for retirement. I put 25% of my salary into my pension to give myself security in the future. I don't want to have to work until I fall apart! They also emphasised the importance of picking a degree that had a career path, not picking for passion. Don't pick something you hate, but don't pick for passion, unless your passion has a direct career path!

I am a civil-structural engineer and I love my job. I'd promote it to any young people with a STEM mind. It'd diverse, engaging, and moving with the times! It's no high flyer in the salary world, but it's comfortable. I live frugally and save hard.

I earn fuck all considering the years of education, training and toil I've put in (BSc, MSc, PhD - all STEM). That's mostly my own choice as I've chosen to spend the 10 or so years post-doc in academic roles (research fellow) to keep a work-life balance. I earn around the £50k mark, depending on the project. I could earn much more (multiples) in the private sector but it's not the life for me.

(edit -typo)

Salary isn’t (generally) how you become rich (as opposed to comfortable).

High salaries: mainly you get these in private sector roles in law, private equity, tech and venture capital and some other branches of finance, science and engineering related professions. Salaries of £100k plus nor uncommon, potentially up to £200k. If you get decent bonuses you could take home £20k on top of salary. Having a science degree helps. Having good connections helps even more.

But to be really wealthy you really need to start your own business and sell it, or get options on the way in.

Dental hygienist. Have GCSEs and a degree in dental hygiene from university 20 years ago. When I started 20 years ago I was on about 45-50k a year which was amazing. I’m now on 50-55k a year and in constant pain from the job. Wages have totally stagnated in my area. I’m self employed so no holiday or sick pay or employers contribution to pension. If my diary is quiet I hardly earn anything. My private pension is pittance. I’m not sure how long I can keep doing this job with the constant pain. But I have no other qualifications. So what started as a great career 20 years ago will likely ruin me and I’ll end up at best in a minimum wage job that will pay my mortgage or I’ll have to sell the house and go on disability benefits. Either way sadly I’m screwed and life is nothing like what I expected when I first went into dentistry.

I’m probably a bit unusual because I don’t have a degree but have a lot of qualifications relevant to my sector, a senior corporate career, and earn £160k. Also have bonus, car allowance, good benefits, healthcare, strong cover for things like death in service etc.

My parents are the best and always very supportive but they came from very, VERY, poor backgrounds and, while they ended up quite well off, they had no clue about things like university so I was very much left to my own devices. I started uni at 16, and dropped out within 6 months. Hated my course, the university itself (parents felt I was too young to move away so my choices were limited), and was generally too young compared to my classmates who were all able to drive, go to pubs etc. so I felt very isolated.
I was a really bright child, skipped forward a year, and think I’d have done well if I’d had a bit more guidance academically.

So good salary, nice life, enjoyable work etc but that’s not how I got rich.

I got rich by getting on the property ladder asap. Bought my first property at 21. I’m 41 now and have four properties, no mortgages, and plenty of investments.

Also very fortunate in meeting my now husband young (when we were both early on in our careers and broke!) and benefited from his high earnings and inheritance too, so we’ve been able to build a very happy and comfortable life together.

How to become rich ?

When I went to uni, it was stated that a person with a degree should earn more over their career, than someone without a degree.

I agree that this probably still stands true now.

I also propose;

Never turn down an opportunity from an employer
Try it & see how it goes, because it can lead to better opportunities.
If there are few opportunities, look fir a job elsewhere

If an employer offers free courses, complete them all, because they help with transferable skills
I have completed many courses during my career; technical, ITIL, Health & Safety, First Aid, fire safety.

If an employer offers volunteer or charity fund raising days take part, because you may expand your circle of friends & contacts. A good opportunity to network.

Pay into a work pension

Whatever salary you earn, always save some for emergencies & the future.
Always keep a close eye on your finances

Do not invest "all your eggs into one basket"
Diversify your investments

Dh and I moved overseas to earn more. The dual benefit of salary and paid accommodation, utilities etc means that you can save and invest quite a lot of money. We lived overseas for 25 years, came back, bought a house for cash and retired at 53. However, you do need to be flexible and prepared for the challenges associated with living overseas.

£150k (ish) working in front office technology in a bank. Masters degree + 40 years experience. Still working at nearer 70 than 60 because its fun. Not especially rich because DH worked in academia (which is much less well paid) and accumulating money doesn't interest us.

Thanks for these responses- an interesting mix here. And agree that rich is quite a subjective term- as I said in my OP I know I’m really lucky to do work I love- but I think my dc would like to be financially well off, able to afford the lifestyle that’s calling her (travel, penthouse flats, etc!). Honestly, I’d like a bit more financial wealth myself, because my biggest source of worry is money. But I’m also finding it interesting to see what others are earning and how they got there.

I’m a solicitor who works for a regional office of a large commercial firm. I earn £95,000 gross per year plus bonus (which realistically is 10% of salary). I’m currently mid level seniority.

Law is a very well paid and varied profession, if you get in at the right level. It’s also intellectually demanding and is one of the few jobs that still has a bit of status around it. The downside is it can totally dominate your life, is extremely stressful, and depending on your firm, you can start to feel like you live to work.

The salaries at the city firms and, in particular, the London branches of American corporate firms are spectacular but they own you body and soul.

A word of warning though, AI has already seen a significant contraction of junior / entry level roles and I can only see that getting worse in the short term.

Private contractor for the government (police and military).

Completely unrelated BA degree.

First made 6 figures in my mid-twenties, and have continued to do so since, currently on circa 180k a year.

It’s extremely busy and demanding, but I enjoy it. I’d travel internationally less frequently if I could, however this isn’t really an option.

I am a lawyer, not a solicitor. I have no qualifications except my GCSE’s. I had supportive parents but no private education or tuition and did not attend uni. I have worked my way up doing a very niche area of law which provides a salary of £45k plus bonuses each year. I love my job and I love the workload, but I do question where I go from here if I ever find myself needing to move on. There are less than 30 people in the UK doing what I do, and I would guess 30 of them have qualifications and a background to fall back on. My name is very well known in this area but that’s not to say that would require an additional person in their team

I have a BA, PGCE and numerous technical certifications related to the job I now do which is cyber security. Work exclusively from home for an American company so pay at 70k is good for what I do and the level of responsibility I have (none!) Had a lot of support from parents in terms of interview coaching to get early job roles and they supported me through uni. Although I'm old, so loans were tiny anyway. If I could be bothered with the stress I could earn much more, but I can't so am hoping to just plod along for another 6 years and then retire.

90K FTE but I have just dropped 25% as the role is so demanding. I’m now on about 68K with 19 weeks off a year (I have to take full weeks off rather than part weeks due to the nature of the work). BA, PGCE, NPQ are my qualifications and I have accreditation in my new role which is a requirement of the job but basically means I haven’t messed up and have completed all my training in this field.