Niece being a spoilt madam

[Aprilmaymum]

I have five DB. Yes five and they are all lovely. . Eldest DB has one DD and she is the oldest of grand children for DF. She has always been the apple of his eyes being first born and she knows it. Never bothered me until recently when one of my DB who has been estranged from DF for last 5 months told me the real reason. My DF had told me it was over a loan he had given him. My DB has now told me it was due to his treatment of his children. Not ill treatment but his constant exclusion of his children over DN. I knew what he meant straight away as I have also had the same treatment with my DC. But as my children are all younger have just ignored it. For example if he had planned a visit DN would turn up and complety spoil their visit . If they arrange to go out DF has to ask DN if she wants to come to and of course she always says yes, then she will ruin there trip. . He will always buys her gifts leaving his children out. For Christmas all his GC received five pound each. She got new trainers and 25 pound voucher. She couldn’t wait to tell her cousins this. As I said mine are younger and so they didn’t really understand but his being a bit older they were upset. It isn’t the money side of it but the unfair treatment he feels that finally made him go no contact and the effect it was having on his children. Obviously there is more but I don’t want to owt myself.
my DB is right that this difffernt treatment has turned her into a spoilt madam and I am tempted to speak to my elder brother about this. We are mainly close as a family and I know one of my other brothers did mention to my DF a few years back about his favouritism but nothing changed.
Not sure what I am asking but should I speak to my DF or DB about this. The worry is my niece is starting to become unliked by her cousins and it will end up with a huge fall out.

Growing up my father spoiled my brother because he is his son, he never applied this to his other two daughters. We have just accepted that he is the favourite child. Now we are all in our 40s-50s, my father only favours my sister’s son and it’s obvious to all the other grand daughters! My brother has stopped speaking to him and it’s really upset him, even though his other daughter hasn’t spoken to him in years?!!! You are never going to change the granddad’s mind. He will continue the same behaviour. The cousins will grow up and decide to no longer visit grandad because of it. The favourite grand daughter will get a boyfriend and stop visiting too. It will be all his fault. I personally wouldn’t bring my kids over to experience that kind of behaviour as it’s damaging for self esteem. I’d keep them at home. If he asks why they don’t see him, tell him the truth! Because you never treated them fairly and spoiled grand daughter in front of them!

Thirding this.

It is a pity that it has come to an estrangement over this.

We all always knew that my Mum favoured my firstborn, but it just became a family joke and was talked about openly at home. It never came to an estrangement; it was just treated as an unfortunate grandmotherly quirk. Those less in favour were fine with it as we always levelled things up behind the scenes. I do not think they have been permanently scarred!

Are you saying a 17 year old asks for teddy bears and holds her grandfathers hand when out?

this is very unusual behaviour, is she nt of does she have additional needs?

You need to speak to your father first and explain what is happening and how his behaviour towards his grandchildren is impacting now

He needs to understand that at 17 she knows exactly what she is doing and isn’t bothered by the impact she is having on her cousins. Your father needs to stop accepting her behaviour and needs to spend quality time with all his grandchildren and that’s means not including his eldest grandchild

the easiest would be that each family arranges some outing and grandparents are invited but it’s that family only

Then I would speak to your brother and explain the impact his daughter is having and he can stop this by saying to his father no dad xx won’t join today as it’s younger grand kids only

Reading the initial post I had an uneasy feeling about your father and his granddaughter. Reading your update cements that feeling. Screams of grooming and worse. I hope I’m wrong.

are any of the other grandchildren girls?

This 17 year old girl walks around holding her granddad's hand and asking for teddy bears, all to spite children? WTF?

I wouldn't bother if I were you. It will change absolutely nothing. If your niece is your father's favourite he's not going to change his feelings by being told off about it. The best you could hope for is some changes in overt behaviour to minimise the impact on other DC. So, maybe ask him if your DC could go out with just him because the dynamic is difficult with niece being so much older, or something.
Your situation is actually very common. GPs form tighter bonds with some GC then others due to a host of reasons. The good ones don't let it show so overtly.
Some families just accept it and focus on their relationship with their DC, which is far more important to sense of self worth than an unfair GP. Some do what your brother has done. Which is fair enough.

Wow, I've had two daughters who have been 17 and countless nieces and this is SUCH immature for that age. I find it strange someone her age would do things like that. I'd have probably told her to grow up and stop being so self centred and spoiled if she'd behaved like that on a day out.

Quite. The massive drip feed is very worrying. Thus does not sound even remotely normal behaviour from either party

Agree, it sounds like DF is grooming her.

I, and about a half dozen other posters who spotted it, wouldn’t. No 17 year old in a healthy relationship with their grandfather holds their hand. I would be very worried.

Personally I'd have 2 conversations - one with brother and one with father.

Tell both you know that the fall out was actually because of differential treatment of niece and brothers kids. Yours are younger and not upset by it as yet but you won't be letting it get that far. If he doesn't start treating all of them equally you'll be following your brother in cutting contact with your dad. With your dad this is a clear conversation to warn him if you don't see change immediately. With your brother this is to let him know how far its got and that you'll still want to maintain your relationship with him but he may end up being the only one talking to your dad.

I agree I'd leave out nieces behaviour entirely at this point. It will only get your brothers back up. Focus on your dads behaviour.

Yes, I'm hoping the hand holding is maybe a cultural thing. I didn't even hold my dad's hand past 6.

I agree the problem is your dad. You should have a word with him and say you are also going to keep your dcs away from him as you think his relationship with niece is unhealthy, he’s encouraging her to be badly behaved towards her cousins and before everyone in the family hates her, you’re going to keep the children away from her and him until she’s had chance to grow up a bit.

She holds her grandfather’s hand when out on little trips, at 17?
Actually I can’t even picture these days out at all, with a girl of that age happy to be there in the first place, let alone in the company of a horde of much younger cousins!

Everyone here is blaming the grandfather but my God it’s the little madam’s own parents I’d hold responsible. They brought her up in this behaviour.
Granddad could almost be forgiven for placing her apart in his affections really, she having been his little princess for many years before the other grandchildren came along, and perhaps the more lavish gifts seem to him to be merely adjusted for ‘inflation’ as she has grown up.
Whatever the magnitude of DGF’s responsibility here, it ought not be regarded as the heart of the problem, I think.
It’s her horrid, braggart behaviour on the privileged basis she enjoys which renders that favouritism so toxic, and this is her own household’s issue.
Maybe the lot of them are entitled ingrates, with added manipulative tendencies.

Her parents have created the attitude in this girl, where a better regulated child would deal with her granddad’s material affection with a good deal more grace.

Also speak to your brother, her dad, is he concerned? Does he even notice the behaviour? Stress to him the problem is your dad treating the differently and setting up resentment with the other cousins, you could say you think it’s unfair on DN as your dad is making the other cousins hate her.

suggest he comes over /for a day out with niece and your family but crucially, not invite your dad. See if she behaves better when she doesn’t have the grandparent spoiling her. Speak to her as a young adult, is she planning to go to uni next year? Has she got a part time job? Talk to her as one of the adults not one of the kids.

Following the most recent OP update, think I would be keeping my kids away from DF for now and pay closer attention to what is going on with DF and DN. That is not normal behaviour. Does DN have special needs?

At 17 deliberately making younger cousins cry and laughing she is being a Madam I would be tempted to say something like grow up to her. Basically she is being a bitch and she is almost an adult.

A 17 year old is holding her grandfather's hand and asking for teddies to upset younger children who want the teddy?
I don't think that's quite 'spoilt madam' territory. There's something much weirder going on.

I’d be having a word with my DB to point out that whilst she might enjoy Main Character/Favourite status now, one day the cousins will be grown up and eventually your DF will be gone and she will have marked her place as persona non grata with the cousins and likely excluded from their relationships . Is that what your DB really wants for his DD?

And to add, there is a favourite grandkid in our family - first boy in family for yrs and arrived a good few yrs before the other GDC. BUT he is a lovely boy who has passed on his toys and lots of love and compassion to his younger cousins who all idolise him while knowing he is a bit of a ‘special’ status with the grandparents. Because the people raising him are decent!

Shes 17?! I thought youd say 8 or 9 yrs old. She is malicious if she is wanting baby toys just because younger family members want them.

Thanks everyone for your thoughts. There is no grooming going on. No additional needs either. She only reaches for his hand if he is holding one of the other grandchildren’s and she will then smile at them as they get upset then let go. It is all for attention etc. I am going to have a chat with my DF first. Thanks for all your comments

I have a 17 year old and know a lot of her friends. None of them would behave like this, never. There is more to it, either extreme developmental delay or grooming. so please don’t close your eyes to it.

Do have a talk with your dad, but ultimately you might need to be cruel to be kind to him, he’s the adult in this, and he’s failing his niece as well as his other grandchildren by encouraging this. I’d tell him if he’s not prepared to change, you’re going to have to keep your children away from him. If that means you only see cousins without him, family days out happen without him, if it means your dcs don’t have a good relationship with him, so be it. But you won’t allow them to be second class citizens in their own family.

Do try to get your brother and niece to meet up without grandad about.