AIBU to think that plumber is overcharging?

[Sam9769]

Plumber not prepared to give me his daily rate but is prepared to give me a quote for the job.
Cost to remove existing bath, wash hand basin and toilet in ensuite and replace with shower, wash hand basin and toilet.
LABOUR ONLY - £3,000.

AIBU - This quote is fine.
AINBU - He is over charging.

I work with lots of trades and no I have never heard any mention of a daily rate, I do wonder OP if you are scuh the expert why it would not be easier to do it yourself?

or you would assume that for a job of that cost to get more quotes would make more sense first before assuming it is expensive (or not)

I'm in the S,E, and 15 years ago paid c.£5k for a similar job. That was " mates rates" and a bargain.

@Sam9769 are you paying for everything else or is he sourcing and supplying? I think that sometimes makes a difference if your supplying they loose money so some make it up through labour cost.

for reference I had my bathroom redone - kept bath and shower in the same place (but new) swapped taps, and shower boarded 2 walls. They removed about 3 layers of tiles and disposed of the bath and old shower. I think it cost me around £3500-£4k about 2022. They were here for over a week, could have been quicker but it was a bit of a squeeze us in job due to the bath leaking

i work in construction project management and don’t tend to get given day rates unless it’s a one day job. It’s not standard to provide day rates for multiple days work in my experience

I think it sounds fine and it will take a lot longer than 4 days!! What’s your DHs experience with plumbing 🤔

Ask him how long it will take roughly .. then you’ve got your hourly rate. I reckon 10 days.

That’s the way most trades look at it. If they finish quicker than expected due to their skill/expertise do they deserve to be paid less? If they take longer should you be charged more?

OP I'm not really understanding what you're upset about. You don't know how long it will take? Maybe ask?

How can you have decided he's overcharging you when you don't know how long it takes to do the work? Are you basing this on your partner's estimate?

I wouldn't want to work for you after this, btw, and I'm almost a tradie.

Well, where I live, this would be pretty cheap. But, get a couple of quotes.

I’ve just had the same thing done in my house no tiling included Yorkshire based £1800 and it took 2 days

We had around 5 years ago now our bathroom and en-suite done. Plumber also did tiling - floor and some walls. Inc materials eg bath/toilet/towel rads etc (not tiles as we bought those) the en-suite was around 3K and the bathroom 4.5K. He quoted for full jobs and not per hour. Both took maybe a week and a half.

We are in Yorkshire.

Idk we were quoted £8k for a new bathroom without fixtures

It is normal to get an overall quote for the job rather than a daily rate.

I would get a couple more quotes and also ask for recommendation from people you know for a reliable plumber.

Also it can depend on whether you are thinking of sourcing the bath/toilet/sink yourself and just want to pay a plumber for the installation or whether they are providing everything. Also check whether they will dispose of the old bath and so on for you or if you need to do that yourself.

I think it depends on your area our medium sized bathroom in Kent was £5000 including parts and labour but excluding actual suite and that was rip out, skip hire, electrics, plumbing, tiling (not including tiles), with the suite and tiles on top we paid just shy of £9k but the professional finish and our relationship with the man just WOW. Fully trusted having him back to do our kitchen. I would shop around and find someone you’re comfortable with price isn’t everything.

You do sound like a nightmare customer.

To come to a client's house takes time. To work out a quote takes time, and the skill and experience that it takes to do a job well comes down to much more than £x an hour.

If you don't like the quote, shop around.

Always get at least 3 quotes and then you’ll know what’s reasonable for your area. He could be overcharging because he doesn’t want to do the job!

It’s quite simple- he’s offered a price and you either take it or leave it. Many trades/services price by the job rather than the hour. Surely that makes sense as then you know exactly what you are paying. I don’t think it’s an unreasonable price and I don’t think you are being ripped off. If that’s too much (in your opinion) then find someone else! I’m not sure why you are so fixated on his day rate?

I recently paid £3.3k for retiling a shower, fitting a new tray and new shower unit. Left a load of rubble in the plughole that I'm still picking out with a special device I had to buy and a poor finish in places around paintwork. A lot of plumbers pluck figures from out of the air. We won't have the mental energy or money to deal with the rest of the bathroom for another year.

You're not completely wrong, but you've gone too far with your expectations too.

He should give you an estimated number of days, both so you can plan and so you can assess value/shop around and compare. The quote should also be clear and detailed as to what it does/doesn't include (but ime this is rare that trades bother).

You're not entitled to know his day rate or a blow by blow breakdown of what everything costs and how much profit he makes or how much he earns. You can guess or infer it from his estimated days though for your own comparisons.

There are a lot of trades out there who have no idea about consumer law and give vague 'the price is the price' quotes that will eventually bite them in the arse now that people can easily get clued up on statutory rights thanks to ChatGPT etc. On the other hand, there's just as many clients who have unreasonable expectations and demands, and have no idea of costs, value, or workmanship. The reality is both sides could improve and meet somewhere in the middle most of the time.

I bet we have another one who demands "someone who doesn't cost the earth"

I bet we have another one who demands "someone who doesn't cost the earth"

In other words, someone who doesn't want to pay the rate for the job. Typical Mumsnet. There's a distinct whiff of 'tradesman, know your place' about a lot of posts here, not just on this thread.

People forget that a self-employed tradesman's rates have to cover all his overheads, not just the time spent on the job. NI, pension, holiday pay, business insurance, time spent on admin, costs associated with his vehicle, tools and equipment, hire of a lockup possibly, and so on.

I have had a lot of work done recently and everyone has quoted for the job. I just decide whether I am willing to pay that amount to get the work done, not whether their hourly rate is cheap.or expensive.
In my experience a quote for the job is the norm, not an hourly rate. Unless for an emergency plumber.
In terms of whether £3k is a lot, in the SE, I would probably expect to pay about that I think.

We had our ensuite refuted about 5 years ago. Replacing shower with a shower, otherwise the same as you. It was just over 5 grand, including materials, so about 3 grand labour. It took about a week with a few hours in the second week finishing off. We got several quotes, he wasn't the cheapest, nor the dearest.

Yeah I wonder if the OP is salaried or paid per hour. It's pretty standard in jobs that require skill and experience to be paid according to your overall work, not how long you're at the job for.

For any significant work in your home like this, you should ALWAYS get 3 quotes from different tradespeople. That way you can gauge whether the prices are similar. I don’t always go with the lowest quote either, it’s one of the factors I take into account, along with how much he/she inspires confidence, shows expertise and whether they have been personally recommended by someone I trust.

What’s reasonable is whatever the market dictates the price will be.

Right now there is a major shortage of trades, and no shortage of work. It doesn’t matter what I paid last year, or what anyone else paid last month, what matters is, what is the current rate locally. £300-400 per day is a rule of thumb, but often these are two person jobs, most will have a labourer with them so £500-600 per day isn’t out of the ordinary. The complexity of the job matters, is it a small room in a top floor flat of a Victorian tenement, or standard room in a new build semi detached.

The only way to tell if it is a good quote is to get at least two others as a guide. If you are unable to get other quotes, then it makes no difference whether you think it’s reasonable or not, it’s the price you have and your choice is take it or leave it.

By the sounds of it you don’t have much experience of using tradies if you haven’t even asked how long the job will take so it must be said, do not pay anyone anything up-front for the work. If they need materials, buy them yourself.