AIBU to feel at a loss with my son's behaviour?

[Django1988]

I have a 5 year old boy who has been a handful since 18 months old. He has a sister 2 years older.

He constantly craves attention and will do anything to get it. Our main issue is that he’s horrible to other kids, he pushes, takes their things, spits at them, doesn’t let them go down the slide at parks, throws their things, winds them up on purpose etc this can be my friends kids or strangers.

He will wind us up as a family, it could be 8am and we are already fed up. It could be hitting us, kicking, grabbing our faces, pulling hair, covering our eyes so we can’t see the tv and won’t stop after being asked repeatedly. If we move away he will follow.

I’ve just been to the park with 2 friends and their 4 kids. He upset 4/5 of the kids. He pushed one kid and he fell in to another, he took a toy off 2 of the girls and ran away with it then threw it in to a bush, he jumped on top of one of the other girls and wouldn’t get off when she we shouting and another girl was trying to pull him off. He was leaning against my friends tent and she asked him not to, he carried on doing it until she had to get firm with him and then I had to intervene (I was taking my daughter to the toilet at the time) I told him every time he was unkind to his friends I would throw away one of his treats in his lunch box, I ended up throwing 2 away. He then pulled everything about of the bin (this was my bad, he is motivated by food and I didn’t know what else to do at the time, I was at my wits end) I took him home and left his sister there with my friend. It won’t teach him though, we always have words before we go anywhere, he knows if he’s unkind to anyone we will come home and we always do. I don’t know what else I can do. I don’t think it’s fair on other kids and people to have their day ruined by my child who can’t play nicely. I’ve even caught him jumping on a baby at a soft play, again we came home.

He just wants to wind everyone up and he’s spiteful at times. There isn’t a trigger as far as I can see. He was upset the other day as my daughter and my friends kids didn’t want to play with him because he’s mean and honestly, I didn’t know what to tell him, he is mean. But at the same time I don’t want him to be excluded.

He’s horrible to animals, he will throw sticks or stones at dogs, cats, ducks etc. We looked after my friend’s kittens for a week in February and it was pure hell. He wouldn’t leave them alone, he’d pull their tails, drag them by their legs, a lot of the time he would just want to cuddle them but wouldn’t stop when I said they had had enough. I couldn’t wait for them to go home.

He has friends at school luckily and there’s been a few incidents where he has been rough or grabbed their faces/squeezed them etc but he is getting a lot better and didn’t have any incidents last term. He’s doing well at school academically and meeting all his targets, he has patience and is great at persevering with things. He also loves a cuddle and can be very loving at times, but a cuddle nearly always ends up in someone being hurt/irritated.

We have sent 2 referrals for an EHCP at school as they think he may have Autism/ADHD. These have both been rejected. We are putting a third one in, in November time and he has been referred to speech and language for social interaction/communication, he is already under SALT for speech sounds. Sometimes I can see that he may be neurodivergent but other days I can’t.

We have done 2 parenting courses, a 4 week one and a 10 week one. Both were brilliant and gave us some great strategies which we use. One of them is 10 minutes play every day to make sure he has enough attention. We do a marble jar, positive reinforcements, praise for being/praise for doing, we try not to use negative language like no, stop etc and say hands are not for hitting etc

We’ve tried time out (though the parenting courses advise against this)
We take his Yoto player away, say no to pudding (I know we shouldn’t but I don’t know what else to try)

I can handle him at home as it’s just us he’s terrorising but I feel like every time I go anywhere with him he’s always unkind, my heart sinks when I see other kids coming to the park.

I know he’s looking for a connection or dopamine hit, I just wish we could find a way to help him get this in a different way. It’s the start of the summer holidays and I’ve already been in tears.

Apologies this ended up longer than I intended!

If anyone got this far and has any advice, I’d really appreciate it.

My daughter is very chilled and sweet, they are like chalk and cheese. She does wind him up sometimes which makes situations worse

OP 10 min play time with a parent per day is nowhere near enough. What game can you finish in ten minutes? At his age he needs lots of attention from you and if he's not getting it then he will act out because that is the only attention he does get. I see it all the time in my own son, when he's being an aggressive infuriating toad, I can guarantee that I've not been giving him enough time and attention for the preceding few days.
Also people are saying "punishment doesn't work" but you haven't done punishment. Or, consequences. When he leant on your friend's tent he gets one clear calm warning then he gets physically removed, by you not by her. Same with hitting, stealing toys etc.
Also when you are giving your child a lot of attention and play, you have a lot more leverage because they have something to lose. The threat of walking away/not engaging or paying with them is often enough.
My first is also much calmer/easier than my second. But then our entire world and routine revolved around the first, and I was a much nicer calmer parent because I had more time more energy in the tank. I have to work a lot harder to make it up to my second. When I do, he behaves so much better. When I don't for a few days, we have gradually worsening behaviour til we reach biting and hitting.

I was wondering if a “reset” Mat would work. So a specific small mat or blanket so it’s portable. Kind of like a time out, but not. Poor behaviour and you go there with him, let him calm and then the kind hand reminder, move his chances marble so he has a visual clue to how many left until you go home.

You must be shattered.

Perhaps more engaging in play with him along with the other kids. Sadly not the opportunity for you to catch up with the adults.

DN was very like this, when they visited DH would stick with them like glue and keep them engaged with game/play/book/activity and it worked.

That’s like saying homosexuality didn’t exist because it wasn’t permitted. Or brain cancer didn’t exist because it wasn’t diagnosed. It was there, you just didn’t see it.

Smacking can stop bad behaviour immediately. But if a child has issues (like trauma, or neurodiversity) they are expressing through acting out, hitting them doesn’t help long term.

Look at this another way - since corporal punishment reduced as a parenting method, we can clearly track that mental health outcomes have improved in the UK. Many forms of violent crime have steadily come down, child abuse has declined, child murder rates have declined (most murders committed by parents of course), domestic violence has come down and suicide rates have reduced.

It’s not hard to track that if you have a kid who is angry and struggling, and you work with them rather than beating them into submission, they are probably more likely to turn into a decent functioning human being rather than an angry bully who starts smacking others as soon as he is big enough. No method is perfect but there is a huge body of evidence to support that corporal punishment is one of the least effective methods of discipline.

@Django1988 when / if you see a doctor do mention the pain tolerance. It’s a red flag for autism which a professional will be aware of.

The sibling who is two years older and who does not appear to have behavioural challenges is a strong indication that there is precisely FA wrong with OP’s parenting.

Thank you xx