AIBU to wonder if anti-English feeling is mostly about sport

[Batsratscatsgnats]

If you support anyone but England in football or other sports do you dislike English people generally or is it just in sports?

I don't think it does tie in. My friend is originally from London and she voted Yes. My neighbour is from Liverpool and she voted no.

Just to point out that a lot of work has been done over the last few years and the behaviour is a lot better. You are probably more likely to have trouble from other countries than the fans of England. Morocco and the Dutch were fighting each other last week.

Ireland's history with the rest of the UK is particularly painful. I think it stands out as being a very obvious example of colonialism and the same patterns that occurred elsewhere.
Scotland and Wales are more complicated because, for example, the Scottish were as actively involved in opressing the Irish as the English were. But also there was a lot of migration to Scotland from Ireland so you have some very complicated dynamics.

The Scottish clan chiefs owned a lot of the land in highland Scotland but there was a convention that the members of those clans had the right to farm and live on that land. Unfortunately this convention was never legally codified, so when it became convenient there was no legal protection for the normal crofters when said wealthy landowners wanted them to go. However, English landowners were also involved in the Highland clearances. The unifying factor is Wealthy Landowners. This also followed on the heels of a potato famine in Scotland, but this was actually viewed as a humanitarian crisis, and the English/British government put resources into not letting Scottish people starve to death. So the treatment was not the same as that later meted out to Ireland (often by the same officials). The difference was purely based on the predominantly Irish Catholics being seen as lesser than the Scottish.
The British were also oppressive to the clans/viewed them including the clan chiefs with suspicion after the Jacobite uprosing and banned kilts etc. But this was also a suspicion shared by many in the lowlands such as Edinburgh. Plus, wealthy landowners were always exempted from the ban. After the ban was lifted it was highland aristocrats who took up wearing and promoting it. So it became associated with Scottish gentry. The class differences within Scotland, and the fault lines of the Jacobite rising are far more complicated than posh English aristo versus put upon Scottish peasant.

Scotland was also as much a part of the British empire and British Colonialism post the act of union as the English. Before the Act of Union they attempted to colonise part of South America themselves but this failed...

It's not that the Scottish don't have reasons to feel resentful. For a long time they have voted Left but been stuck with right wing governments because the rest of the UK votes for them. I would be annoyed if I kept voting not to be punched in the face but my friends voted for us all to be punched in the face so I kept getting punched in the face. But Scottish history within Britain isn't as simple as one of colonialism and isn't really comparable to Ireland's experiences with Britain either.

That’s true. I was in Paris a few weeks ago when PSG won the European Cup and it was carnage. If fans of an English club had destroyed big parts of a city we would have never heard the last of it and probably be facing a ban.

If you mean the Clearances, the landlords were Scottish.

If you're harking back to Culloden and that idiot Stuart claimant, most of Scotland was happy for him to lose.

I always find these posts quite funny. You would have to know not a single thing about history to ask this question. I don’t think anyone hates individual English people but by God you were the “current USA level of fucking up the world” of a time not long past and no I don’t dislike individual Americans either.

Most English people I know totally get this so I’m always quite surprised by the minority who don’t get where this comes from.

Thank you for this. I think it is extremely telling that an original wider question is being turned into an English/ Scottish debate rather than facing the wider issue.

I was dining on the champs eleysee in 2002 when Turkey won a match. It was a bloody nightmare but we had to accept it. Chairs and tables flying everywhere in celebration of their win.

I mean the PP trying to downplay Scottish imperialism against Native American groups as just “loving your own family more…”

Exactly!

Ah thanks. I agree that was an odd take.

Didn't Rangers fans go on a rampage in Glasgow a few years back?

Not all Scottish football fans are cuddly tartan wearers.

Some Rangers fans support England!

Yes that's true.

They're still Scottish though.

🥱

They are ONE team and it was idiots. They were embarrassing.

I'm Irish and it's more jokey here mostly imo, I don't dislike English people at all. I would definitely shout for you lot against the USA 😂

They, with Celtic, are the biggest team in Scotland by far. And they have a decades long track record of terrible behaviour.

Obviously the vast majority of Scottish football fans do not behave this way at all. But similarly, the vast majority of English football fans do not cause trouble either. As a PP said, much work has been done in the past decades at cleaning up English football, and it's been mostly successful.

I can recall several incidents where football fans in other countries have booed black players in foreign (to them) teams and shouted abuse, e.g. ‘Monkey!’ at them.

IIRC the football authorities never took any action, let alone any effective action. Though hardly surprising when the main interest of FIFA and their ilk would seem to be moneymoneymoneymoneymoneymoney….

I voted to get out. Too many brainwashed twats stopped it from happening and now we'll most likely be landed with Reform at the next election, thanks mostly to the English.

C'mon Belgium.

No one bothers with Rangers now. However, of those who do, I have a few friends who are season ticket holders. Decent people.

I'm Celtic.

I haven't criticised England fans btw.

😂

Me too.

If you cant appreciate it then maybe you should give up watching football.