AIBU for thinking who TF does she think she is?

[CFornot123]

Aibu for thinking this is overstepping the fcking mark

Long story so will try to condense and keep to relevant details.

Been with ‘D’H for 13 years (married 6). We have 2 DCs aged 4 and 3. He’s 38, I’m 31. He has been bestfriends with a woman, let’s call her Jane, for 25 years (since they were teens) and there’s never been any romantic history between them.

In general she’s not really my kind of person. She’s quite blunt and a bit rude, uses racist language (I’m Asian) like it’s a casual word and tbh is a bit of a bully. However, knowing she means a lot to my husband, at the start of our relationship I made A LOT of effort to be friends with her and she was even one of my bridesmaids when we got married (the theory being that if she’d have been a guy, she’d have been a groomsman so wanted her to feel involved in the wedding as she Hs best friend). We were on maternity leave at the same time, both had baby girls at the same time (she’s married) etc. but around this same time (so 5 years ago) she stopped engaging with me, started ignoring messages, every plan I made with her she cancelled and then we weren’t invited to her daughters first birthday. Throughout all of this she maintained contact with my husband and they met up regularly for coffee. I raised concerns with H at the time and he brushed it off as “it’s just what Jane does, she’s a bit flaky, don’t take it personally”.

I’ve not spoken to her now for about 4 years, bar the odd hello if she happens to be at a family/friends event (a lot of shared mutual friends/large friendship groups). But she frequently meets up with H for drinks, dinner, brunch, they have regular video calls.

H and I have been going through a lot recently (we relocated from California after spending two years there for his job, I quit my corporate legal career to basically follow him around the world for his high paying role and have moved 10 times in the last 10 years) due to stress with house moves, redundancy and, me trying to figure out what career to do around the kids following a career in law (I’m a high achiever, degree from Oxbridge) and taking a back step. He works very long hours, lots of traveling as we moved to be closer to family as the girls are starting school soon so I said no more following him.

He met up with Jane last Saturday (they’d both been invited to their mutual friends wedding - I wasn’t) and when he came home on Sunday, he asked me to “make some time in my calendar to meet with him on Friday afternoon” (like I’m a business associate…). He told me today that he “discussed me at length with Jane” and THEY had decided that WE don’t communicate in our marriage enough. SHE also, in her expert opinion as a mental health nurse, diagnosed me with a borderline personality disorder based on everything she’s heard and seen from my husband over the last 13 years and that he should gently suggest I go to the GP. For context, like (so it seems) every other woman in their 30s I’m undergoing an ADHD assessment (VERY different to BPD).

So my AIBU - wtf has DH been saying to her about me that has led her to diagnose me with BPD after not speaking to me for 5 years? And who TF does she think she is?

We had no falling out, no cross words were said, I simply stopped making an effort with her and suggesting meeting up because she never made an effort with me and somehow that’s my fault and she hates me enough to say I have BPD?

Frustratingly H said she’s sent him to information to read up on about it.

So far I’ve not reacted or responded to H. I told him that I needed some time to process the conversation we’d just had and I’d discuss it with him when I felt ready

Because she is probably in love with your husband probably having an affair with him which started when she ended contact with you a few years ago and now trying to discredit you. How dare he treat you like that and then arrange a meeting as if you were at work how dare she make an assumption about you. Meet with him and severely tell him off and question their relationship. Wish you well

It's possible that you were invited to the wedding and your husband made your excuses. Are you particularly close to anyone who was there? Can you get any insider information on what is going down? Don't give your power away to him or Jane. He should be supporting your journey to your autism assessment. Being naive is a sign of autism and a shit would take advantage of this. Do you have family support? How are his family with you?

If you do anything for him, that’s normal.
If he does anything for you that’s him bending over backwards to devote his life to you.

When he’s away with no one to consider but himself, that’s not time to himself.
When you stay at home supporting the entire family, that’s… you getting everything you want and him providing it for you, I assume.

based on everything she’s heard and seen from my husband over the last 13 years

This is your problem. He is disloyal to you and tells her everything that could paint you in a bad light. His primary relationship is with her, not you. He doesn't respect you or what you say.

He will portray you to everyone as the unstable wife until he's ready to leave and receive their sympathy.

OK, OP. You've had a conversation with him and it clearly hasn't helped.

What is your gut feeling? What do you think you need/want to do next?

He is abusive.

This is DARVO. Instead of answering a question he is putting it back to you.

1. Deny: The perpetrator flatly denies the abuse or harm occurred, often gaslighting the victim to make them doubt their memory or perception of events
2. Attack: The abuser then attacks the victim’s credibility, character, or behavior, sometimes involving the victim’s family or friends, to deflect attention from their own actions
3. Reverse Victim and Offender: Finally, the perpetrator positions themselves as the true victim, portraying the original victim as the aggressor, thereby reversing the roles and eliciting sympathy for themselves

He is scum, OP, he really is. And, you need to show him this thread. Jane is a homewrecker who is desperate to split you both up. She wants him and she is gaslighting him and you. And he is letting her. You are his wife, and the woman who bore his children and he dares calling you cold and not having his back, all while he goes and tells your private info to the Other Woman who is master manipulating a situation where she turns him against you for her benefit. She's a homewrecker and absolute trash, and he is scum for choosing this cheap and manipulative woman over his wife and mother of his children. He needs to be told he must cut off his 'friendship' with the OW. He must choose. His family; his wife and children, or her. Show him this thread and he really should hang his head in shame and how he has been manipulated to turn against you so she can get him.

Never show your thread ever...This is your safe place to talk.

I’m wondering how positively her own professional body would regard her “diagnosing” someone in this way? It’s one thing to use your skills to offer support to a patient in the moment, it’s another thing entirely to interfere in the assessment and care of someone else’s patient remotely when you have had no face-to-face contact with them in years.

Quite. I travel for work and DP does not. I’m always very grateful to him for holding the fort with DD feel like I’ve been on a little holiday!

The OP’s husband is crafting a big false narrative. The OP is mentally ill… seeing friends after work when away with work isn’t really time to himself… etc.

I fear the OP’s husband married an intelligent woman, but has belittled her, mistreated her, made her financially dependent, and is now trying to convince her she’s mentally ill.

These kinds of men hate women, and are perpetual victims. They’re insecure, defensive and incapable of real closeness - which is why the arm’s length relationships with Jane appears closer and more significant to him than the relationship with the wife.

At least the OP is only 31, and can rebuild her life away from this awful man!

Sorry OP, I’m sure you’re processing a lot and this is hard to hear, but you sound sensible and grounded and I’m sure you’re can see all this for what it is. You’ve put up with it for obvious reasons, but this post shows you’re not really willing to play his game anymore. Bravo.

Whatever you do, DO NOT SHOW HIM THIS THREAD.

about two months ago I questioned him on his relationship with Jane (based on an incident last year where he lost his job in California, took the next flight out to the UK and spent 10 days in the UK, meeting with her to discuss his prospects and options, leaving me and my two children in the US alone with no answers).

@CFornot123 He did WHAT now?

flabbergasted.

fwiw, I think while you need a bit of time to process what’s just happened, time APART seems counterproductive to your relationship. You’ve got stuck in different paths that are running parallel to each other but not together

you guys need a break together. A few days away just you and him to reconnect and begin to build the trust back.

Agreeing wholly with this. Very well said Chlorpool 👌

I feel like you couldn't 'win' in this scenario as if you'd been upset/ angry (as you rightly may be) then you'd have been accused of being over emotional, now it's the other way.

He's going to be critical regardless.

I think time apart is probably best as you may find you're a lot happier not thinking of him as your partner/ spouse and get the courage to end the relationship and have a happier life.

At the moment, he is being awful, as is Jane but you're the one getting the blame. They are just trying to justify their actions.

You've sacrificed so much for his life and wants... don't sacrifice any more!

So if he thinks you both don’t have each other’s backs then you both agree the relationship is not working.

I think you know VERY little about your husband. You are not a team. He’s used you for years for domestic chores and a glorified PA it sounds like. There seems like there is very little intimacy between you.

I agree with PP who have said he is likely getting this intimacy from Jane which is why he isn’t bothered by the state of your relationship. I can guess it started around the time she stopped responding to you. I imagine if you looked at his messages and emails it would be an eye opener. The fact he rushed to her when he was having a hard time with work showed that their relationship didn’t cool while you were abroad. If anything distance made them yearn for each other more.

Now they are slowly creating the narrative where you have mental health problems and that’s why your relationship is failing. Perhaps they have plans to be together long term.

Either way you cannot trust this man. He does not have your best interest at heart. I don’t think you even love him anymore but change is scary. Start compiling evidence of his financial position and pensions. Make sure you have it all before having any more serious conversations. It wouldn’t surprise me if he’s got a plan for divorce although at the moment he has it so good he hasn’t bothered.

i guess it depends on whether she thinks her DP’s intervention is coming from a place of genuine care or whether there is a more sinister/self serving backdrop to this and only OP will be able to make a judgement on that. My comment was assuming that the former motive is most likely.

Of course neither husband nor Jane are qualified to diagnose anyone with anything but surely we’ve all been in the situation where we learn about conditions and suddenly the behaviour of someone close to you makes complete sense. As in, “oh my goodness, that’s what autism is! I bet that’s what grandpa had as it totally explains his need for order and his aversion to particular noises”. In no way a diagnosis but a lightbulb moment nonetheless. And I said if this intervention has been attempted in a supportive way then it might be worth looking into even if just to rule it out or to bring it up with a qualified professional.

I have known two people to have BPD and I’d say it took a very long time for them to receive the support they need because at the height of it they were excellent at masking, unable to acknowledge and reflect on their own behaviour and unable be fully transparent with health professionals. Reading this post it sounds a little bit like a few people have cut OP out over the years (I don’t think this is usual, I’ve never been ghosted by a friend) so I wonder if there’s a lot here we’re not privy to, either because OP can admit to it or she genuinely can’t see what’s going on and needs the help of a loving husband to get there.

But if the husband is actually just a bully/idiot/narcissist and has nothing underpinning this idea other than a desire to gaslight OP which is always possible then she needs to know and LTB asap. Getting him to be very clear about what she’s done to warrant this intervention would be a good way to get clarity on this.

Again I do think Jane is a non character in this story. Whether husband is a good guy or a bad guy she’s just being his friend.

The best update for you would be your husband says he is done with the 3rd wheel in his life and is going to spend his life with you and his children.
He has not woken up to what having a wife and family means to him.
Where is his love for you.

I don't agree she is just being a friend. A friend wouldn't ignore the OP for years. A friend would be asking the husband why he was spending 10 days with her rather than being with his family. A friend would listen but not diagnose and tell the husband to go and be truly open to a discussion with the OP with the true hopes of making the marriage work.

I say this kindly, but you are not going to be able to deal with this on your own. Your husband knows how to frame any argument you will put forward in such a way that it twists back onto you. And you don't know how to get out of it without trying to justify your existence. It's pointless. Actually, it's worse than pointless because if you continue, you will end up believing that you are either crazy and/or completely at fault for whatever is going on.

The only way you're going to get any kind of resolution is to get some sort of marriage counselling. But even then, it requires a degree of honesty and cooperation on both your parts, and I don't think your husband is willing or able to give that.

I wish you well, but please, don't try to sort him (or you!) out on your own. And please don't be so emotionally manipulated that you don't use this time to ensure you and your children are going to be in a good position should everything fall apart. Make an appointment with a good divorce lawyer, not necessarily to start proceedings, but to learn about what steps you need to be taking to protect your assets and children. And book a marriage counsellor yourself (don't let him or Jane do it!). Then demand he attends with you. And demand that nothing is off the table for discussion, including Jane.

He sounds incredibly selfish and like he has no respect for you. He is putting this friend before his family which you don’t do when you love someone. If someone spoke about my husband the way this woman spoke about you, I’d be furious and cut the friend off. Not only is he staying friends with her but he’s actively agreeing with and supporting the awful things she’s doing. I’m angry for you, it’s disgusting.

Even then, I wouldn't trust him (or Jane).

White people can't use the N word in an ironic way. It is extremely racist and Black people use it ironically because they are the victims of it. Explain this to Jane.

Jane isn't the problem. Your husband is.

She sounds like a bitch and she clearly doesn't like you, but that's fine. Sometimes people don't gel. She doesn't have to like you.

Your husband does though. For her to diagnose you with BPD at arm's length, he's been chatting shit about you to her for years. She's the one he turns to when he needs comfort or advice, and he sees the things you do for him as just normal and expected.

I'm so sorry, but Jane is just a symptom. The cause is your husband and the lack of respect he has for you.

umm I know hindsight is a marvellous thing but (and i am white british) any prospective partner would have had to choose between a friend who casually uses racist language and me and that would have been before we married or got together.
Then this "“it’s just what Jane does, she’s a bit flaky, don’t take it personally”.

He has been choosing Jane all along OP. I mean you could give him an ultimatum but why bother?

You could treat this discussion as an opening along the lines of, "I'm glad you bought this up...I've been quite worried about Jane myself. She seems to be letting her mental health job influence her ordinary life too much - she shouldn't be diagnosing people she hardly knows from a distance like this. Do you think she needs professional guidance? She seems to be worryingly close to you, so you might be able to suggest it? Anyway, I think for everyone's sake, it's time to distance yourself..."