Parenting Professor says that she supports smacking children

[ThisAmpleCritic]

Quote:
Prof Ellie Lee, a family and parenting researcher at the University of Kent …supports the use of smacking, said: "It would be great if we could just be nice to children and think they would just be nice back. But the reality of it is, is that in order for children to understand the rules of society, and to learn how to behave in a way that is moral, and that is good, we have to have boundaries, and boundaries have to be backed up."

AIBU to think this is a disgusting attitude and her credentials should be challenged? Children deserve protection from
violence and aggression from their caregivers. Why should they not be given the same rights as adults, who are free to test boundaries without fear of physical assault?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c2eyke83yz9o

Discipline (or lack thereof!) in schools is a whole other ball game!

I mean I’ve never done what you have described, nor have I seen it. It doesn’t sound normal.
Picking up a child and carrying them away is the normal reaction. If you’re doing something that looks like physical abuse it probably is.

And given that I didn’t do that because I knew how my DD would respond, do I sound like someone who routinely physically abuses children?

Clearly not. So if I’m saying - my toddlers would have kicked off to the extent restraining them could potentially have hurt them, then maybe just accept it. I don’t doubt some toddlers will whinge but cede defeat. Mine fight you tooth and nail; literally.

That doesn’t answer my question. If it’s fine for parents to do it, why not for teachers?

Because it’s against the law in England, and parents have different responsibilities towards a child than a teacher or other childcarer does.

There is definitely a time where children lack the emotional intelligence to understand why you took them away from X (ie why their behaviours were unacceptable) and so your initial goal at that stage of development is not for them to understand that. Your goal then is that they understand that if you say stop or no, you mean stop or no, and no reactive behaviour will change that it wont be happening or is stopping now.

You want them to be conditioned to understsnd that what you say, goes, even if they don't get why.

At that earlier stage of development, you will have to employ some distraction techniques. So it isn't just taking them away from inappropriate activity X, you lead them towards appropriate activity Y. Literally because there is no point trying to get them to be understanding about why they can't do X. They are just kids. You are just laying the foundation of your dynamic at this stage and "no means no" is one of the first real rules

While I don't agree with smacking and have never hit my kids I don't think it does make children withdraw from their parents. My husband was smacked by his parents and he has a brilliant relationship with them.
Going back to the 80s and earlier it was pretty common to smack your children if they misbehaved. Not everyone from those years has a bad relationship with their parents or has gone low contact with them

That’s the goal, totally. Children have other ideas though. I mean, if you say no and mean it and they ignore you there’s not really a lot you can do, if removal from the situation is impossible or impractical, which is frequently the case for me unfortunately.

That doesn’t mean I favour smacking. I just want more honesty about it. That it we’re not going to use physical force then we are reliant on our children’s cooperation and agreeable demeanour and toddlers aren’t famed for that.

I do agree with you about this but don't think the culmination of a situation should be smacking.I work with so many people who can't negotiate, discuss or problem solve and it's a skill.It's also a skill to know what's non negotiable and parents need to parent although that should never mean physical punishment and I speak as a woman who grew up in a physically violent family.

Why is it illegal?

Without being rude @followtheswallow, I find your comments about not manhandling a child to remove them from a situation bizarre. A few years ago I had to physically carry my
kicking and screaming 6 year old child away from an attraction because he was misbehaving. It caused a lot of stares and was unpleasant, but it needed to be done. He wasn’t harmed, but I had several bruises. It’s just part of parenting.

A tap on the bum is fine imo.

Because it’s deemed to be abusive.

However, in England it is within the law so parents are free to continue if they see fit. If the law ever changes they will be required to stop. It’s no more complicated than that.

It actually doesn’t matter what others think of their parenting. We do not all have to agree.

Because it’s deemed to be abusive.

Exactly. You could’ve stopped after that sentence.

If it is abusive for a teacher to do it, it is abusive for a parent to do it. Society has every right to judge abusive parents. As a PP said, the law needs to be changed so that the over-arching culture changes.

I don’t think you’re being rude; I just genuinely don’t think you realise how much force it can take to restrain a child who is really fighting back with every fibre of their being.

I have seen similar comments over the years many times on here ‘just strap him in the buggy’ type things and in my DS’s case that would have meant wrenching his limbs, pressing down down hard on his middle and in all honesty really being far rougher than I am OK with.

Your post is contradicting yourself.
It became illegal for teachers to strike children, before that it was absolutely commonplace for schools to cane or belt children. The reason it became illegal is because it became socially unacceptable therefore people’s opinions are relevant, particularly when the safety of children comes into it.
Other areas of the uk have made smacking children illegal and this is literally due to people having an opinion on the matter.

No doubt you might parent in ways I don’t agree with and wouldn’t choose. Maybe you allow more screentime. Maybe you don’t permit sleepovers. That’s completely fine. It’s your decision as a parent how your children are brought up.

I’m not telling you that you MUST spank your child, but that you CAN, if it’s the right choice for your family. 👍

There’s something in this. I am of the gentle parent persuasion. I only have one child, it’s just what we’ve done. Co-sleeping, etc…

My kid can be hard work, doesn’t do as he’s asked. He’s great fun, but attracts attention when we’re out, in good & bad ways.

He has many friends from different cultures, and the parenting involves smacking. The kids all are normal kids, of course.

But I have noted their polite behaviour, manners & helping at home. They have no choice! They fall in line with their parents easily.

And they openly tell me how they’re disciplined. They tell DS he’s lucky! I don’t judge their parents at all. But we don’t hit in our house.

THIS is the perfect example of parents choosing to parent in different ways and it not being an issue!

I just genuinely don’t think you realise how much force it can take to restrain a child who is really fighting back with every fibre of their being.

Did you miss the part about my 6 year old? Presumably he is much bigger and stronger (and hot-headed!) than your two year old.

I don’t know, I don’t know your six year old. I imagine possibly yes, but in a perverse way it can be easier when they’re older because force is less likely to result in an injury. If you imagine forcing a Labrador into a car and forcing a chihuahua- one is a lot more wriggly. There is more to grab of the Lab.

And to be fair I wasn’t just or even mainly talking about removing them and walking away with them. I was talking about removing them from somewhere and holding them with you to prevent them going back (‘time out.’) If you have multiple children and you’re somewhere like a party or event and one kicks off this is apparently how you’re meant to deal with it but it’s easier said than done.

Yes. My dd broke her car seat in half to escape from the seatbelt like Houdini (I'd used a restraint clip so she couldn't undo the seatbelt). She was 5. I now know she was in fight or flight mode. She couldn't flee so she fought with everything she had. It's impossible to restrain a child like that. And often dangerous, to them and to you.

I never smacked and DD does do like she’s asked(99% of the time) and is described as a kind, polite and beautifully behaved child by teachers and other adults, even as a teenager.