Parenting Professor says that she supports smacking children

[ThisAmpleCritic]

Quote:
Prof Ellie Lee, a family and parenting researcher at the University of Kent …supports the use of smacking, said: "It would be great if we could just be nice to children and think they would just be nice back. But the reality of it is, is that in order for children to understand the rules of society, and to learn how to behave in a way that is moral, and that is good, we have to have boundaries, and boundaries have to be backed up."

AIBU to think this is a disgusting attitude and her credentials should be challenged? Children deserve protection from
violence and aggression from their caregivers. Why should they not be given the same rights as adults, who are free to test boundaries without fear of physical assault?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c2eyke83yz9o

I agree.

And there comes a point when children hit a certain age where no amount of telling them not to do something is going to have any effect on their behaviour.

Without fear of consequence then children can pretty much do as they please. I am obviously not saying that the consequence should be violence but in some situations, there are no outcomes that act as enough of a consequence to deter teenagers.

I’ve seen mothers on here in absolute desperation with their 15/16 year old son’s attitude/behaviour (including aggression and violence in some cases) and shes being told not to let him leave the house, to take his phone off him and not give in to him and set firm boundaries etc and it’s ludicrous. Some lads of that age are over 6ft and I imagine if he’s screaming at his 5ft 3” scared mother it’s not to easy as “just not giving in” to him.

I have two sons and I often wonder what lies ahead.

They are currently 12 and 8 and they are as Good as Gold but I’m under no illusion we will possibly have issues ahead of us.

Thankfully my husband is a secondary school teacher and has worked in various inner city schools in quite deprived areas so has a lot of experience with managing/communicating with aggressive and violent teenage boys, so I’m hoping this will be a potential advantage.

Me and DH have never raised a hand to our children, and we never would, but they know that their dad won’t tolerate any kind of crap. We both make it very clear what our expectations are in terms of their behaviour and there will be consequences as needed, but that’s easy to do at this age.

Even though he’s never given them any reason to be, I do think there is a small element of fear in them of how their dad would react if they did something really bad and I’m hoping that will keep them on the straight and narrow.

You say this, yet none of my local schools have a need for metal detectors. Yet where we lived in England every school had one.

To a certain extent, teens are always going to be a bit of a law unto themselves. You would hope (ha!) that if they’ve been used to firm boundaries but kind and respectful parenting yadda yadda in the early years then they will continue in the same vein and many do, but some just go off the rails and it isn’t the fault of the parents. (Then sometimes you get children who are lovely despite their parents, not because!) That’s why I always take with a huge pinch of salt the declarative sort of statements common on here ’OP, your kid sounds awful and he will have no friends ‘

I don't smack and never will smack my children, and I would never advise someone to smack their child.

But I also grew up rurally and know that animals are far less naval-gazey about ordering their young, so I think that the truth is probably more nuanced than "a single slap will disorder your child's brain patterns forever and they will have attachment disorders and become violent".

Seeing lambs and calves and kittens and puppies and chicks biffed, pushed, headbutted and knocked around suggests that most animals resort to getting physical when needed (usually, it has to be said, with a physical issue, since verbal rules don't exist in nature either). I also had the normal low-level sibling on sibling rumpus, and am a totally non-violent adult.

How did you discipline your children? Clearly you managed without hitting them.

I'm going to go out on a limb and say violent children (unless it's due to a neurodevelopmental condition) probably come from households where they are exposed to violence.

Yes, I think they do.

I also think that if anyone can give me a direct consequence that will deter a child from some unwanted behaviour immediately and a young child (under 5) can understand I will be impressed as I haven’t seen one yet!

I smacked my children when young. It didn’t alienate them. It enforced boundaries. It certainly didn’t lead to poor GCSE results.

Hmmm. My parents hit. This is what they knew as parenting. It stopped when one of my siblings hit back. It's an aspect that parents don't always think of - one day the kid you are hitting will simply hit back and when that kid is bigger than you well ......

I never smacked my children when young. They had great exams results and now have good jobs. So you didn't need to hit your children, you chose to. Maybe reflect on why you wanted to hit a small person who loves you?

Or you just had different children who reacted well to softer methods?

I haven’t really managed. I have 2 kids age 3 and 7. They can be very very very testing and I find parenting fairly depressing at times as there is basically nothing that will stop them fighting and attacking each other. I’ve tried every conventional or recommended method and they simply do not care. What would you advise?

Oh I’ve WANTED to hit mine many times! They might love me but they sure express it strangely sometimes!

That is her view and she is entitled to it. Just like parents in England are entitled to spank (or not) if they choose.

Absolutely. Look at female lionesses swiping at their cubs and doing warning snarls. Physically reprimanding babies in nature is entirely normal. Obviously we are humans so different standards.

I need this unicorn method too

I mean eating your babies is also normal in nature so not sure what point you’re really trying to make.

That’s not normal at all among mammals.

We aren’t animals and we shouldn’t behave like them. The problem is, until we’re at the point of having enough language skills to understand and negotiate and reason (so I’d say three and a half as an absolute minimum) you’re powerless.

A lot of parenting methods recommended do rely on some kind of physical force if not chastisement.

I do think that many kids find a quick smack far easier to deal with than rambling on and on about kind hands and big feelings and how we don't push Timmy because it makes Timmy feel sad and mummy feel sad and we don't want that do we ad nauseam. And that overexplaination can feel quite emotionally manipulative at times.

It would interesting to see the difference in the attitudes of children in say the UK and some East Asian countries where smacking (not absolutely not beating) is allowed. From my experience of working out there:
a) Children are far better behaved
b) Their attitude to school is far better
c) Petty crime is almost zero
d) Women are safe to walk the streets alone after dark - including jogging alone
e) No-one is afraid of 'gangs' of children
f) Underage drinking, smoking, drug taking is v v low too

I am not convinced that the smacking ban has worked in the UK, children need to learn boundaries and for some nothing else seems to work at all so a study comparing the above would be very interesting indeed.

My parents smacked me and it doesn’t bother me at all. It was always a light smack designed to shock rather than hurt.

I'm not convinced that alternative punishments are 'nicer' than smacking to be honest and they are far more calculated and therefore potentially more damaging. What are you left with as a consequence? Cancelling a much anticipated play date or outing, or looked forward activity at home with a parent maybe. Most kids would prefer a quick smack i suspect!! They have to really care about something for taking it away to be effective, eg a comfort toy. Seems cruel. No TV or something is ok, but if they watch TV to self regulate I'm not sure that's the best thing either.

It can easily become more than a one off smack.

Without that option what I think you often get is verbal smacking. eg as I witnessed in a National Trust garden a woman closely face to face with her child saying ‘ you have ruined my life and you are ruining my day’ . Things like that happening.
Banning a smack does not stop a child from being abused. They just get abused differently.

I don't understand why a parent would think smacking a child is acceptable. Why do they think humiliating a child would work? They're more likely to fear and hate you if you physically hurt them. Unless you're a cat of course.

There is a thrashing. Then there is a short smack. Then there is a tap barely a smack.
Sometimes a child will cry as much over a tap and a short smack not because it physically has hurt them. But they know they have upset their parent, because they have been told no, because they have done something wrong. And have learnt it.