to be seriously concerned about the illegal surveillance cameras and flags on lamp posts?

[Kije]

That's it, really. I live in a semi-rural area. No racial tensions locally, that I'm aware of, at all. The local small market town and surrounding roads are covered, and I do mean covered, in illegally posted flags, all over lamp posts - sometimes three deep. They come down (the local council sometimes stirs themselves to take them down) and are replaced within a few hours. It's been like this since late last summer.

And now the same charming people who are trying to intimidate what they like to call 'pathetic lefties' have put up dozens of surveillance cameras on the same lamp posts, aimed in all directions in a clear attempt to intimidate local people who'd like to take the flags down. The mob who do the flags have said on their own FB site, it's to 'protect their property' (eg the flags they've illegally stuck up lamp posts, it's essentially littering). The obvious take-home is, they think this is their town and they aim to create a chilling effect for anyone who dares to discuss this on local social media, or take the flags down again.

The flags are illegal: the cameras doubly so, I'd have thought, given privacy laws?? Or at least, I'm assuming surveillance cameras mounted on public property and aimed at pedestrians and drivers have to be done by a legitimate authority.

I look at what was happening in Belfast (and elsewhere) last night and honestly, I'm terrified for our country. We seem to be sliding into lawlessness and vigilantism, and blatant intimidation of anyone who speaks out against it.

Oh fuck off. I am not being paid to give you legal advice. You can read the links for yourself to see how they cover various aspects of the situation. You'll probably get away with your flag shagging antics for some time yet, precisely because of the apathy and defensiveness of the general public, but you are definitely running a risk of contravening various laws.

A fine legal mind indeed.

Dingy doesn’t equal offensive though.

Ive never flown a Union Jack or St George’s Flag in my life, and I’m not about to start now, and as my first post said I wouldn’t like the vigilantism aspect of the cameras either. But some of the reactions here are bordering on hysteria.

Because the Raise The Flag campaign is organised by far right thugs, one of whom has been charged with murder after brawling in a bar fight.

https://hopenothate.org.uk/2025/08/22/operation-raise-the-colours-organised-by-well-known-far-right-extremists/

https://www.stokesentinel.co.uk/news/stoke-on-trent-news/lamppost-flag-flying-group-raise-10988277

Nice bit of casual misogyny chucked in there.

When asked a simple question, most people would just provide an answer.

It appears that you are unable to provide an answer, which is fine to admit, but just throwing insults instead says more about you.

Again. It's not the flags per se it's the intentions of the people putting them up. As you well know.

I have felt intimidated in Loyalist villages in NI even though I knew it was not me personally they wanted to intimidate.

I can provide an answer but it's quite dull and I'm not convinced the questions are being asked in good faith.

Flags are "banners" under section 132 highways act and hanging them without consent is an offence. Cameras aren't banners etc but they may include "letters or marks" falling within this section.

If the cameras overhang the highway, they need consent and failure to obtain such consent is an offence under Section 178.

If the cameras film areas beyond your domestic boundary you need a lawful basis for processing and storing the data and you need to abide by the rest of the obligations of data controllers under the GDPR. Failure to do so is an offence under GDPR and can lead to fines.

So it isn't simple answer, but there is an answer. It's kind of besides the point though as the Council could just take them down and would do so if enough people asked them to, I am sure.

And yes, the OP is right to be worried about this kind of thing stoking tensions and intimidating people, which was the question in her OP and lots of people asking "but why?" is passive aggressive dog whistling and I'm tired of it.

So you’re happy to tar everyone with the same brush because of the behaviour of one man (who I’d never heard of) now?

Aren’t PPs arguing vehemently against anyone they even (generally wrongly) suspect of doing that?

So far on this thread, we’ve had vast sweeping generalisations, smearing of whole groups based on the behaviour of one man, and confident but unevidenced assertions on the worst case motivations for many people PPs have never even seen, not to mention racist name calling (gammons) but we’re the bad guys, right?

Oh and insults instead of answering polite questions.

Again. It's not the flags per se it's the intentions of the people putting them up. As you well know.

How do you or I know the exact intentions of the people putting them up? Or are you making mass generalisations again based on the behaviour of a few?

@CornishDaughteroftheDawn Yes if I lived anywhere where I had seen any evidence of people being hostile to immigrants, yes I would indeed feel intimidated to see the flags. Which is the case in parts of England right now. Flags being flown for a village fete- cute. Flags flown for political and potentially hostile and /or racist reasons - intimidating

Oh I wondering when we’d get to ‘dog whistles’ - that popular method of attempting to shut down the conversation.

Even the government is starting to admit there is a problem now. Is the BBC ‘dog whistling’ too?

But PPs are reporting being triggered or upset just by the flags. They are not reporting evidence of intimidation in all of these areas.

It's not really much of a conversation is it? Just lots of disingenuous questions.

You are being obtuse or naive, I'm not sure which. I have read your posts and I realise you cannot change your position. I get no enjoyment from the back and forth and don't plan on engaging any more with you.

They’re basically thug apologists, that sums it up.

Cameras put unlawfully on lampposts to survey unlawfully attached scruffy flags.
The cameras are there, so that the flag shaggers know who’s head to kick in if anyone is unlawfully and covertly recorded removing said shagged flag.

Fucking peachy eh

Plenty of social media about it.

I don't think it's always necessarily racism. Sometimes it's just people making a statement that they're proud of their nationality and not ashamed of it.

It's a pretty common thing nowadays for the woke to apologise for being British to anyone that will listen. People that were never slavers apologising profusely to people that were never slaves for events that happened hundreds of years ago. Often apologising to people whose home countries are still amongst the worst offenders for modern slavery and advocating to give reparations to corrupt governments etc.

You lost me at 'woke'.

Presumably, the same people worried about the legality of the flags would also be very concerned about all the posters on here talking about sticking 'adult human female' stickers on the tube etc. That's classed as fly posting/criminal damage.

There are “Anti-flag” groups springing up now called “Lower the flags x town/city”

Maybe try and set one up?

This flag raising is just copying American flag culture. There is a video of one of the instigators of flagging in Birmingham openly admitting it wasn’t about culture but was about wanting people out.

England has never had such a culture apart from special occasions like Royal Weddings and The World Cup.

just imagine if the offended here - and everywhere - had never responded to the flags. Put flags up themselves, even. Why not? I see them flying outside curry houses, libraries and all sorts of places here. Just imagine the confusion of the people you call knuckle draggers, as it dawns on them there is no agenda to ban national pride, and in fact maybe others ‘love the country’ as much as they do. The sting would’ve been completely taken out of them.

Sigh

What’s the point? They go up, they go down, tensions rise. They go up again. It confirms their paranoia that they ‘can’t even fly their own flag now’. Just leave it.

Your version of national pride has nothing to do with mine. Why do you think you own it or are fit to define what that is.

You’re not.

White British born and bred btw, as clearly this is important in your argument