AIBU to think some people on here are way too obsessed with not being seen as racist?

[BadWordlePlayer]

I’m posting in AIBU because this has been niggling at me for a while with the tone of so many threads lately, but it's really blown up following the bodycam footage of the Henry Nowak case.

There seem to be loads of posts these days where people are basically showing off how not racist they are, or how much they hate racists or the 'far right', or jumping in to call something racist at the slightest thing. It feels performative, like they’re desperate to signal their virtue and make sure everyone knows they’re on the “right” side. I get that racism is bad, obviously, but it sometimes feels like it’s taken over to the point where common sense goes out the window.

Henry Nowak shows how dangerous this mindset is. This poor 18-year-old student was stabbed multiple times by Vickrum Digwa, who then lied to the police claiming Henry had racially abused him. The officers took that accusation at face value, handcuffed Henry while he was lying there bleeding out and saying he couldn’t breathe, and didn’t treat him as the victim urgently enough. He died in police custody essentially. The mindset of those officers sounds exactly like the over-the-top “must not be perceived as racist” attitude you see in some threads here. They sidelined a dying boy because of a racism claim (which turned out to be a complete lie). That’s not just sad — it’s dangerous.

This isn't a left wing / right wing post and I’m not saying racism doesn’t exist or that we shouldn’t call it out when it’s real. I also hate the phrase "virtue signalling", but I can't think of a better one than it. This constant virtue-signalling and knee-jerk reactions make situations like Henry’s more likely, not less. People (including police) become so paralysed by the fear of getting it wrong on race that they get it horrifically wrong on everything else.

Am I being unreasonable? Or has anyone else noticed this shift on MN and in general?

When the racist white reform support man raped that Sikh woman because he hated Muslims there was relatively little press and outrage about it.

I heard about it ages ago, I follow certain social media news accounts which make sure they spotlight things like this but outside my immediate social circle almost everyone I spoke to about it was unaware until the verdict was passed the other week.

Yes! Akala is brilliant and spot on as usual! .

So interestingly I have lived in Glasgow, Liverpool and London and worked with young people in all 3 places, so I’ve seen first hand the differences in how a working class Black or mixed race boy in say London is treated compared to a working class white boy from Liverpool or Glasgow.

eta: even when I worked in London I saw the differences in how white teen boys involved in crime were treated compared to black boys within the same borough.

I had a white mother tell me how shocked she was at how harsh the criminal justice system was to her (non-violent) mixed race child because she had (violent) white sons who had done far worse and not been treated as badly.

She said for the first time in her life she understood the extent of racism.

@OneTealShaker What are you talking about? The so-called “silent majority” is shouting from the rooftops at the moment. It hasn’t been as fashionable to be racist as it was in the days of Enoch Powell.

They shout so loudly, because they are trying to convince you they are the majority.

They aren't, and neither Restore nor Reform will ever form a government in this country. Sane people are the actual silent majority.

How much impact is any of this “talk” having?

I am just finishing his book as recommended by my brothers and it’s excellent even as it challenged my own views on things (we certainly are not completely politically aligned.) But I appreciate people who read extensively and have readily accessible and auditable sources to back all of their claims.

I don't think racism or xenophobia are necessarily left/right things. Some of the worst racists I know vote Labour (looking at you, MIL!), and some of the least racist are Tory voters.

I agree with this.

If someone tells you they've been stabbed, surely the first thing you do is check it out, ffs?

Exactly, it’s unfortunate some people just laugh at both statistics and qualitative research nowadays and instead go with whatever anecdotal evidence suits them.

They talk about a “two tier system” favouring Muslims, but when you try and tell them Black males are treated more harshly than white males, white females and black females for the same crime they will not hear it despite statistics consistently showing this is the case.

https://www.crimrxiv.com/pub/js8s1mt8/release/1

Same as when you talk about how a Black or South Asian person with the same qualifications and experience on a CV is less likely to get called for interview than even a foreign born white person they will disregard that too despite the body of research that proves this.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-46927417

My post above was meant to reply to this. Quote fail lol

There has always existed a pervasion of racism throughout the criminal justice system, and ethnic minority groups have always been portrayed as as more 'crime prone' than others; so the government has been resistant to treating knife crime in London as a public health matter.

Most people recognise that knife crime is not a racialised issue, but one predominantly based on socioeconomic issues. That applies in London as much as it does in the North East.

People are clamouring about two-tier policing and I'm happy they are now aware this issue.
Pretending it's an issue that sees white people being overpoliced, however, is what makes their argument ridiculous. There are no statistics that supports this at all.

The police service was absolutely woeful in handling the victim; because they are, as usual hideously reactive, instead of treating him with dignity and compassion

Exactly, the police behaved terribly and also incredibly foolishly, but nothing to do with them being left wing “virtue signallers” - as if! Believe me many PoC can report instances where police did absolutely nothing for them to address racism when they reported it - and they hadn’t stabbed anyone!

And people also forget racist stereotypes are not the same for every ethnicity. If the perpetrator had been a Black man it’s likely they would have been quick to believe the victim. So let’s not spin a tale that police are these racial justice warriors ffs.

I agree @AmethystDeceiver

The Reform bots are back, it seems.

People are clamouring about two-tier policing and I'm happy they are now aware this issue.
Pretending it's an issue that sees white people being overpoliced, however, is what makes their argument ridiculous. There are no statistics that supports this at all

Exactly!! Absolutely no stats supports this so I’m flabbergasted at how far this false claim has got and wish there was more pushback in the media using statistics to show the real two tier policing.

But no doubt reform et all will exploit the heck out of this tragic case and any other exceptional cases to make their point that it is a thing.

Shoosh… one must not report reality and facts. I mean, I don’t read reports of immigrants (legal & illegal) everyday committing violent crimes.

There is no housing crisis as immigrants don’t even need accommodation. Same with healthcare, they don’t need it because they’re so wonderful and better than us British proles.

Immigrants bring us their wonderful amazing food that is so much better than our British slop.

All immigrants are wonderful hard working people with no problems and who just want to make life for British people much better. They are here to show us the light and save us from ourselves.

We need more immigration.

Big brother is great

Big brother is watching

All hail big brother!

It's because many people who think they're woker-than-thou are hugely judgemental - you see it on here every day.

So many people are just waiting to be offended, and if they aren't offended, it spoils their day. There's a kind of person who thinks that if they spot something which might - however nuanced - be interpreted as racism, ageism, sexism etc it gives them Brownie points. Ugh...it's exhausting and very irritating.

It's creating an environment of hypocrisy, fear and virtue-signalling. The contention of this thread is that this ultimately distorts behaviour and leads to the police putting an disproportionate focus on racism in some circumstances.

The logical thing, in this instance, would have been to arrest the brown guy in the the turban, because he was, in fact, a murdering bastard.

As an alternative phrase, 'earnest stupidity' would cover a lot of it.

surely it would have been better if they had quickly assessed the situation and not automatically taken the word of one person though? They could have checked the condition of both of the people involved rather than just the one standing?

Why does not wanting to automatically assume the minority person is correct become lets go back to old fashioned racism?

👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻

The woman imprisoned for her racist tweet was ludicrous and demonstrated a two tier justice system imv

also what isn’t said is that the countries that many immigrants come from are extremely corrupt - it doesn’t bode well if you bring huge numbers into the country. I’m sure it’s part of the reasons our immigrants want to move here and don’t want to move back

I watch a lot of horrible things but passes this video was a step too far. When the police officer refused to believe he’d been stabbed, manhandling him, in the last moments of his life when he needed compassion the most, even death row inmates were given more decent treatment before they died. I cannot imagine how it feels to know that my loved one died under those circumstances. Poor sweetheart.
Those daggers aren’t illegal in Ireland for religious reasons.

They absolutely should have arrested him from the outset and not the guy with stab wounds lying bleeding out on the ground.

If i accidently mowed down and killed a pedestrian who for example staggered out into a road drunk i would anticipate being arrested pending investigation for death by dangerous driving whilst investigations were carried out and until clear evidence showed the actual course of events.

This is no different, an arrest is not a conviction, and individual judgements and one word against another are irrelevant.

Even if this had been a case of racism by Henry, Vickrum could still have easily been found guilty of manslaughter via carrying a bladed article or excessive force. A good reason in itself to arrest him and begin investigating.

Completely agree, outrageous behaviour. He was clearly not a threat, no need for handcuffs at all. And then in his statement the father says that the attacker, as they were led to believe, was never handcuffed- even as he was taken away. And in the police station was taken to the kitchen to choose his food. The contrast in how the victim, and the attacker, were treated is too much to ignore.