Stuck in the middle with family and husband

[coconutta]

I don’t often see family because of distance but when we do go and visit I am always torn between wanting my husband to be happy and keeping everyone else happy.

Everyone being my mum and sister in law who are both very strong minded.

My brother is very much sit back and let his mum and wife decide and this dynamic works well for them as they like to organise and plan everything and are used to that.

My husband doesn’t like this and as it’s my family he expects me to speak up and say we (mainly him) want to do something different be it eat somewhere else or do something else to what they have planned.
I find this hard especially as SIL makes most plans and is quite bossy so mum always goes along with her.
I’m quite laid back I tend to just go along but my husband doesn’t like to go with the flow and is more opinionated and has stronger preferences than me so my family are not used to this and it feels like I’m stuck in the middle of lots of strong minds all with different ideas and I’m honestly happy to do whatever but I find it so stressful when mum and sil make plans and husband isn’t on board but at home I’m happy to go with flow so as my husband has more preference he is used to having more input.

I just like to see my family once in a while but it all feels like such a headache when I’m more like my brother and don’t mind what we do as long as we do something but I feel like cancelling the whole trip as husband isn’t happy with any of the plans and I know how awkward it will be if I don’t go along with what mum and sil have decided especially as they live near each other and are used to doing things together their way.
I really hate this pressure.

I agree with your husband that having the wishes of one person or one side dominate all the decisions and all the activities can be very dreary and its not fair. Cant you guys get together and divvy it up so one day its one lots choice, and then the other lot gets the deciding vote next time?? Its not that hard, and if mom and SIL kick off against it then that says a lot about their attitude towards controlling activities and always directing things. Everyone should have a say.

Well of course he's moaning, I would be fed up in his position too.

In the sort of situation you describe when your DH suggests doing ABC and your SIL says "No, let's do XYZ", why on Earth can you not say "Actually I think I would prefer ABC too." You never know, someone else in the family might make that choice also. Even if they don't you would be putting down a marker that you are not always going to be dictated to by bossy boots SIL.

I think it’s all about numbers.
My brother will do whatever his wife wants to keep her happy, my mum will do whatever she wants to keep her and my brother happy, I don’t mind and will do whatever to keep everyone happy but then husband is not happy but for everyone else that’s the easy option.

Would DH be happier not going? Would you be happier there without him?

I had a similar dynamic. Sort of. Similar in some respects and different in others.

Actually, I can't tell if you think your DH is being difficult or is justified in his views. I had an XH who was a bit of both.

XH likes doing what he wants to do, doesn't like doing anything he doesn't want to do, and generally hates forward planning. When we were still a couple and went to visit my DPs, my DPs would suggest things and want to make plans, especially if something needed to be booked. I think they were partly worried about the DC getting bored. XH would never commit to anything ("maybe" is his stock answer to everything until the very last minute). I was stuck in the middle.

Things that helped...

I started visiting without him. So if he came every other visit then that made life a bit easier.

I would try to identify a couple of things XH did want to do and mention them in advance. Or say "We want to do X. It would suit us to do it on Yday" and then either suggest they come along or not depending on the activity.

Sometimes back up XH. If DPs were suggesting something that suited them more than us, I would say "actually, we had fish and chips last week, we'd really enjoy Chinese this time".

Divorced XH (bit extreme if you don't have other issues!)

My DPs like a plan. They were generally OK with the "we want to do x" approach, because for them it's often more about knowing what the plan is than the actual activity, if that makes sense.

[Edited for typo]

My husband doesn’t like this and as it’s my family he expects me to speak up and say we (mainly him) want to do something different

So he doesn't speak up himself - he wants you to encounter the discomfort? No he is being unreasonable, STOP getting dragged in, tell him if he has a problem with something thats organised - speak up.

Its not just a case "its your family - you have all the contact" - this isnt a massive fallout - this is not agreeing a dinner location; he doesn't get to call the shots from behind your back via your mouthpiece.

This ^ absolutely
give us examples but I suspect that your DH has a point.

Your husband sounds annoying by just criticising the plans (and organisation work) of others. Tell him to make the plans himself he doesn’t like it.

I take the approach that things should be balanced between your family of origin and your husband's. Sometimes, depending on the location of each family, you can't balance it precisely (a week with them, a week with us) but there should be some balance.

Also, it should be balanced with the fact that time off work and school is in short supply. Neither you nor your husband nor your children should be spending significant amounts of rare vacation time being made miserable because you are forced to capitulate to the wants of people outside your nuclear family.

This can be moderated by "big" things like a parent with a terminal illness. But not with a generic "I don't know how long my parents will be with us so we have to do all our vacations with them."*

You are asking your husband to subsume his vacation wants to your sister-in-law's demands, during your visits to your parents. Why should your sister-in-law always get what she wants? Why can't your husband get some of the things he wants?

As for you, you sound like you are so used to pleasing other people that I am not sure you even KNOW what you want to do, since you say you would rather just do whatever your sister-in-law and your mother want, for your own peace. I am worried that life will pass you by and in 20 years you will look up and feel sad and angry that you were so afraid of your mother/SIL's ire that you didn't even get to KNOW what you wanted, let alone to actually DO any of it.

Life is short. Don't get to the end of it and look back and realize that you spent all your vacation time making other people happy by ignoring your own happiness. Your husband matters. You matter just as much as your husband. Your mother matters, but not to the exclusion of you or your husband. Your sister -in-law's happiness is...not your problem, and her happiness certainly does not necessitate you always giving in to her.

If your family live a distance away presumably you've both spent money on this trip and taken leave from work?. I wouldn't want to use my time and money to have my Sil dictate what I'm going to do. Talk before hand and put up a united front. If she wants to go somewhere you don't say' that sounds nice but we are doing x, you're welcome to join or we'll catch up with you later. Either that or go by yourself and let your family call the shots.

Having plans imposed on me for days on end no longer works for me. When I was younger I would go with it. Now not so much. I need to have some control over what I am doing if it’s goes on for days or I am really unhappy.

I make sure I have input on certain things when I am visiting - that’s over when I arrive, how I can leave, access to food I want to eat for longer periods. I also don’t want to be coerced into ‘activities’ and need opportunities for alone time. Probably makes me a joy to be around but that’s my line and I make sure to be agreeable and join in for most of the time.
There has to be balance.

Exactly this.

The purpose of the visit is for you to spend time with your family,it sounds like its occasional and that you don't mind what you do with them and go with the flow.
So,in essence you agree to your SIL deciding and arranging things.
Your DH doesn't and wants to do what he wants to do.
That sounds unreasonable as its so infrequent.
So, either he accepts the visit is for you to spend time with your family doing whatever they decide or he decides he won't go along with that so declines to visit.

The reason SIL always gets her way is because you all let her. It's not that you're all easygoing, you're all doormats and sound insufferable.

I am siding with your husband despite what a lot of others have said. Similar situation to your husband where DH family tend to bow down to one person and no one speaks up.

I tend to be a fairly laid back go with the flow person but when I am with my DH family, FIL dictates every last detail- the restaurant, what time we are eating, what time we leave, whether we are allowed desserts, what activities we are doing.

it’s like being marched around on a boring school trip in primary school.

I once ‘had the audacity’ to get up early while everyone was still sleeping and go and grab a coffee in a local cafe. It nearly started WW3. Fil didn’t speak to me for the rest of the weekend- it was great!

life is busy, short and expensive and I don’t like spending it having plans barked at me everytime we meet.

others have said on here for your DH to speak up, which is interesting because when it’s the other way around the advice is always for the DH to deal with his family.

I think you could make it easier on him when he suggests something different and say ‘yes that sounds good’ if others don’t follow the change of plan say ‘ok well you do that and let’s meet back up in an hour’. Although ideally you would suggest the plan in advance.

If DH is fussy about what he does then maybe he needs to organise it in advance, as in “ Let’s go to d to eat on the Sunday, I’ll book the table for 6pm, and then on Tuesday let’s go for a picnic at x park , it’ll be fun for the kids. Has anyone got any thoughts about the other days?”
Presumably there is a family WhatsApp so he could put it on that. Why is he expecting you to argue when you don’t mind either way? Let him deal with it.

We don’t have a family WhatsApp we only see my brother and wife twice a year and a 2 min call on birthdays, although I speak to my mum weekly.

If we didn’t go along with what sil wanted mum would be put in a very difficult position as they see each other every few days and brother would be upset with her.

At home when it’s just husband and me we do what we usually do and they are used to doing what they all usually do which is just different to us.
Husband was thinking we would eat out as it’s a weekend away but they have decided to put on a spread which he doesn’t fancy.
We are also going out the next day for a day out somewhere quite commercialised with lots of places to eat where they have decided we’ll take a picnic, also not something we do at home as we generally just pop in and eat somewhere so he’s miffed about that.

It’s difficult to explain the real problem but it feels like we just follow them around, stop when they stop to go in a shop but get left behind if we don’t keep up.
Its also that the conversation is always between them and anything we have to say is either talked over or not listened to so even if we said we’d prefer to do so and so mum or brother would say oh well I think sil was thinking…. Or we’ll see what she thinks and as soon as she disagrees mum will just says oh ok well you decide so she does, or she’ll ask my brother who will ask her or he’ll already know and say she’d rather do…. and it’s quite matter of fact which is what he means by feeling invisible or like we’re just tagging along with them.

I don’t think I’m a door mat I just think I am driving for hours to visit family so I don’t mind what we do together as it’s just one weekend but with husband we usually go somewhere with something to do or something going on, go in somewhere for lunch and so he gets bored when they just decide to go for a stroll and chat and take a sandwich which is fine by me but not what we usually do so he is disappointed that we’re not doing anything that interests him.

He want to come and likes going because as much as he moans he forgets after and always thinks we will have a lovely time when it’s booked but I know we won’t, my mum has told me what they have decided we’ll do both days and he is deflated already.
I have been on my own before and just gone along with everyone and it’s been great but I also enjoy spending time with my husband and we do our own thing when it’s just us so it doesn’t really bother me doing something different but I can’t go along with everyone.
The difference is my husband is discreet about his feelings and only complains to me where with sil everybody knows when she’s not happy.

I would step right back from this and say to him, "I honestly couldn't care less where we are going if Sarah is prepared to organise it. If you object to her plans then open your gob and say so, and you, her and Mum can thrash it out between you, but I'm not getting dragged into it"

He can then argue with them or go with the flow. Either way, it's not your problem.

What is your father like OP?
Seems to me that you & your brother have both married strong minded people, and your mother goes along with what SIL wants for the sake of an easy life, because you mention your DM deferring to your SIL.
Your DM feels there is more benefit or less consequences to defer to SIL.

I think there is no way round it: this is never going to be easy. The talking over/not listening to what you two say sounds annoying! I think you could say, for example, "A picnic sounds great, but don't worry about us, we'd like to buy from what's on offer there."

Would DH take himself off to see something interesting instead of a walk and a chat? Or bring a book to read or a podcast to listen to! My uncle always gets the paper out when my mum and aunt get chatting!

Id either leave him at home or tell him to suck it up for a couple of days..

he can’t have his way all the time and he should speak up for himself if he isn’t happy and not expect you to do it when you are happy going with the flow.

Our Dad’s never been involved much, mum and dad split before I turned 2 and brother just a baby so it’s always just been mum.

Errrr, actually it's not just about numbers. It's about people-pleasing. You, your mom, and your brother, are willing to not have preferences so as to avoid setting off your SIL. Your husband has preferences and is made unhappy when he is expected to give up his preferences so he can people-please. Just because the rest of you are ok being doormats doesn't mean your husband has to be one?

I wish he would but he doesn’t want to be left out and he doesn’t want to do what they plan so I get the grief from him while he goes along with it.