AIBU to hold the line on school and not listen to upset teenage rants

[Windywho]

Im afraid my AIBU is around the how much shit do you take from your clearly unhappy child.

So to give the backstory first; My DD17 has Dyspraxia and ADHD but is likely more Audhd (she doesn’t want to consider autism and we go with that) Her behaviour is pretty good in that there is no smoking, drugs, she does an activity once a week, her grades are only ok (capable of much more but it also could be worse)

For the last number of years she has been capable of incredible rudeness, intransigence and just generally being difficult. Usual teenage stuff ramped up, but challenging to be around. She spent years being pretty rude to her younger sibling, who she now wants to engage with, but the sibling doesn’t want to engage with her.

She doesn’t have a great group of friends - she’s can be a lovely girl so I don’t think this is her fault, just one of those things - hasn’t found her tribe yet and i know this massively bothers her. She lacks confidence, and this is particularly around how she looks. She has dyspraxia which makes make up and hair and sometimes self care a challenge and there are times when I have had to point this out. I’ve tried to be as kind as I could but it seems like any comment is treated like a knife to the heart so now I say nothing and she gets upset when her outfit / make up doesn’t turn out as she wants. It’s a lose / lose really. I feel so sorry for her, and know this can’t be an easy way to feel and I go out of my way to connect, help, love her whatever way she needs. There has been therapeutic help in the past but she feels she doesn’t need it. I think she really just needs some belief and confidence in herself.

We don’t demand a lot of her but the one red line I have is school. If you are sick you can stay home but otherwise in, and in on time. The school, although high achieving, are very lax on this , she has 17 late notes this academic year (ireland not Uk)

Well this morning she wanted to skip the first two classes as her ‘tummy was sore’ It wasn’t, she just didn’t want to go in as they were free study classes. I said go in and this escalated to a massive argument - we hate her,belittle her, treat her like
a baby, this should be her choice, bullied her two years ago, isolated her, make fun of her appearance etc etc etc

After an argument and then trying to deal with this calmly, I left the house as she clearly just wanted to fight and she sent 8 messages, all quite abusive about how she hates herself , we’re awful etc etc.

AIBU to just hold the line here and not listen to the rant that invariably ends in her crying as she is clearly upset.

I regularly take the usual teenage abuse from all my kids but when do you get to go enough is enough. ?

I’m not moving on school attendance and this is what the argument started about

I think that what you have said here is the nub of your problems. You are thinking about your daughter's future success - judging that against how she is performing at school now and thinking that she is falling short. The awful truth is, if she fails at this stage because you are pushing hard for her to keep up in school and be a 'normal' teenager, there is a good chance that she will breakdown and not have a successful future.

Yes, I am being harsh and I'm sorry if I'm being hurtful - I have seen this scenario far too many times and know from experience that parenting ND teenagers is difficult and sucks everything you have and that you feel you have to keep some sort of control over a scary and chaotic situation.

Now, what can you do? For a start, take a deep breath and don't worry about the future for the time being. Try to get through each day without scenes and rude texts so that everyone can try to de-stress a bit.

You need help and support. If school is not helpful, maybe try your local educational psychologist (in some places it's impossible to get hold of them, I know). Also, think about therapy - for you, for your daughter and probably for your family. I think you need to talk about your concerns for your daughter's future, the fears you have that she won't succeed unless you keep pushing her feet and I think she needs time and space to talk about the pressures on her.

I think you are living in a pressure cooker situation and need to find ways to de-stress yourself and your daughters. You need to come to terms with your daughter's conditions and accept that they may limit her - especially at this stage of her life and education. She may need a few more years to mature enough to be the young woman you want her to be. She is probably all too aware of your opinion of her, which is not helping her self esteem.

Please seek help and good luck to you all ♥️

Do you have access to her timetable so you can see when she really needs to be there for lessons?

Are you tarring all teenagers with the same brush? My DD would never speak aggressively to me or anyone else, her group of friends are lovely people, very respectful.

I’m 41 - adhd and ASD. I was NEVER on time for school, towards my last year or so hardly bothered to show up !! Failed all my exams and ended up at the local chicken factory at 16… fast forward to now - I have a job I love ! Been at it 20 years, never late, very punctual and pride my self on being so because I love my work - school for me was such a bore and physically painful to sit through, that’s the thing with adhd and other spectrums it’s not just as easy ‘to just be on time’ it can be debilitating, maybe to support her you would benefit from reading up on what adhd is and the unseen symptoms that you could try to accommodate her with which would maybe in turn improve your relationship.

Ah that is good to hear. Not our experience unfortunately, our daughter is very rude when she’s upset about something (lovely the rest of the time.)

I was a tyrant for my poor mother in the 90’s as a teenager. I’m just lucky that DD is the opposite of me as a teenager. It’s not exclusive to today’s generation.

It is painful, it is not easy, but I agree with the OP. Some things should not be viewed as optional, good timekeeping is one of them.

I just wish everyone else thought the same.

@PensionedCruiser I am not sure I can support that way of thinking. Not every ND teenager left to their own devices will find a path to a secure future.

There is no academic pressure on DD. She wants to go to Uni, is very capable of it and we support that.

She isn’t doing particularly well in exams and the only commentary from us is that if she wants to reach her goal she will need to work harder.

The world will not totally bend to accommodate neurodivergence. Most ND people will need to find strategies to cope, jobs that suit and partners that understand. All that is a big ask and allowing my teen to just opt out at 17 is not going to help her reach her goal.

I have done, that’s why I support her in lots of little ways to try and organise herself. She’s been away on camps for periods to help grow her independence etc etc.

I’m glad things worked out for you but I know that, for my DD, she doesn’t want to go straight to the workforce and I think a few years to mature would be helpful.

Do you bully her, belittle her, and make fun of her appearance? It seems like the school thing isn’t the main issue in your relationship with one another.

However, she’s almost an adult and I don’t think missing some free study periods is a hill to die on.

No, and when we drill into this it’s one or two instances when maybe we’ve disagreed with her or had to pull her up on something. We are talking singular instances years ago that are still being brought up.

We are pretty gentle parents

I take your point on the classes though, I need to have a more open dialogue here

How does she get to school OP?
Just wondering why she’s late all the time?

I do think flexibility is important, especially when there is neurodiversity in the mix.

It’s a 10 minute walk @Grapesandorange !

I just wonder with audhd if this is just the wrong fight and a different approach might see your daughter find school easier and start to thrive

dd changed school that was very much punishment and rules to one that is incredibly kind. She’s gone from ‘this is her problem, she can’t do that’ to ‘she did amazing on that and we really appreciate the effort she’s putting in’

She is happier but also she’s taken a massive leap forward academically. I’m not suggesting you change school but maybe read into adhd paralysis and burn out and try to agree a routine with her that will help her push herself forward

you say she went in to school at then end - how did you then address that with her after school?

You misunderstood if you thought I was advising you to leave her to her own devices - I was advocating finding outside help to support everyone through this rough patch. Some ND young people are not as mature as their peers, so there might be a mismatch between ambitions and capabilities at the moment. I had similar issues with both of my children and they went on to graduate with a first and a 2:1 (after indifferent Scottish Highest). But not the same year as their peers. An extra year made all the difference and that's where the external advice and support helped enormously.

So is it that she has difficulty getting up/getting organised and leaves home too late?
Or that she leaves on time and takes the ‘scenic route’ to school?

Is she in 5th year @Windywho?
Or still in Transition year?

I'd agree, for a younger child

But at my DS's school, by aged 17 they were expected to take some responsibility for their own studying, so students had some flexibility around attending study periods. And yes this was a high achieving school, preparing them for university study

This is a difficult one and I see where you are coming from. But I do think you are being a bit too rigid.
School is a weird environment for many young people and especially so if they have known problems.
She has reached the age where she does need to be allowed to make decisions herself and to feel that you respect these, even if you do not agree with them.
I used to say to my teenage girls: " I trust you to make the decisions that are right for you, but I am here if you need help or if things go wrong."

This has become a battle ground for you both now and it will be hard to pull back from this. You say she is a good and decent person so she deserves to feel you have faith in her. She will make mistakes, as we all do but she is not taking drugs, mugging old ladies or getting drunk. She is just trying to make choices that help her get through the day with her problems.

You may find that moving on to college will feel like a better environment for her and if she wants to try and up her grades there then that is fine. She does not have to everything in the prescribed order. She has to do it all in a way that retains her motivation and self-respect.

I think you need to gently pull back on this and let her make some of her own decisions. She is almost adult now. I know you are trying to do your best for her, but entering into this battle may not be they way to go.

How about: "I really think you should go in to school today but you may have good reasons not to. Could you explain those to me and we can see if there is a way forward?"

She has endured years and years of an environment that must be challenging for her, day in and day out. She is getting to a point where she will be feeling she needs some choices. I can understand that.

This is interesting. Can you tell us how you did at school and what you’ve achieved in life? (Sorry that sounds kind of harsh and I don’t mean it that way at all.) I have a similar dilemma as OP and I think the problem is that I’m approaching it from an angle of having gone to school on time without a fight, got good marks and subsequently gone to work on time without a fight and done well in my career/had a happy marriage. Do the people who turn up late and drunk to school turn out all right and have happy lives? Is it better to be more hands off? I’d be completely horrified because it’s so far from the way I was brought up and the way I am - but I don’t want to make things worse and at the end of the day my daughter is very clearly not like me…

Does she actually want yo go to uni? At 16 I wanted to work and if not go to college for an art course, but nope I had to go to the VI my parents chose.

I couldn't stay home as my mum was there so I would set off and spend the day walking around town or take a train to another town.

Obviously I am not your daughter, but if she is at home you know where she is.

Maybe allow her some time at home but without her phone.

Give her the option of reading or chores if she stays home.