To feel slightly sad for Labour and Keir?

[Wellwhatnowbellaboo]

Aibu to feel sad for Labour's results so far ? I've not historically been a Labour voter but I think Keir has done a good job on some things but on others he was never going to be popular...and no one would be ! I like that he's the first leader recently to appear to have a moral backbone and consistency (if he truly wasn't informed about Mandelson I might add).
How do you feel about the state of play particularly if you've been lifelong labour and did you swing to a different vote this time round ?

@Trippys

The sensible thing is to do all of what you want to do as part of a package (ideally that package also goes in the manifesto for democratic legitimacy). Then you are not targeting anyone, you are streamlining the state to get the debt down and put things on a good footing and reforming and streamlining things. Lots of people would have held their nose and swallowed their medicine knowing we are all in it together and other people are taking theirs. Labour had years to prepare for this and they knew their inheritance would be bad (what did they think would happen with the Covid spending that they supported to, obviously taking aside the fraud stuff, but lots was spent on support that they pushed for) but they didn’t put the work in and really think about it. They were going to win the election anyway and they have a massive majority but no real mandate - if they’d put together a sensible manifesto that touched on some of this stuff, they might have lost a bit of their majority, but they would have legitimacy to push stuff through. It’s failure to prepare.

Instead, they’ve done a makeshift job, where they don’t really know what they are trying to do, need to raise more money so target each group in term with no overarching reason why they are doing it, which makes opposing everything easy. They’ve also handed pay rises but got nothing promised in return in many cases.

Lots of this is just incompetence and bad politics.

Nah - he’s a mega loser who welched out on almost everything he promised… I didn’t think he would be great but he has certainly surpassed my expectations of being one of the worse PMs really. BUT - at least we got to put the extra VAT on private schools, right? That’ll teach them! 🤣🥴 - I don’t feel sorry for him - he’s a clown. And everyone is laughing him.

I agree with this.

People want all the things, but they all think someone else should pay.

Boringly, most things require time and money (improving the NHS, local SEN schools, processing asylum cases quicker, affordable homes, decent affordable care for the elderly).

@Castellio- they could easily have designed a better policy than this - don’t forget that the ultra wealthy are still getting a 20 per cent rate of IHT, so they haven’t even totally solved the fairness issue! They just took an off the shelf policy from the Treasury and did no thinking about how it fits together. They then defended it on the basis of inadequate modelling. It’s the sheer incompetence that really annoys me.

Similar here. I voted labour and my priority was for them to reduce the amount spent on benefits. They have since removed the two child cap and made a u turn on reducing pip and sickness benefits. So they have lost my vote.

You’re having a laugh, all of us thinking any of the Labour shower have done anything to remotely benefit the working majority in this country.

Don’t worry girls - the grown ups are in charge…

I totally agree. When I think back to the 90s and how New Labour prepared to be in government, it’s like night and day. I know things are different today but WTAF did this government think would happen when they got into power???

Most of what they have done either makes little sense, or makes little sense when packaged up and communicated to the electorate.

I agree with this. He backs down to his backbenchers and advisors who keep telling him that the biggest issue voters care about is child poverty. It really isn’t as evidenced by how unpopular the removal of 2 child cap has been.

Yep.

He bends the knee to everyone except the angry and disenfranchised electorate.

I think the issue is the quality of the labour MPs. Most appear to treat parliament as a 6th form common room where being popular is the most important priority. Look at the debacle over the FWS Supreme Court judgement. Bridget Philipson is terrified to implement the law because it isn't trendy with her back benchers and she could lose support for leadership positions. Self interest over the law and women's safety. She deserves to lose her seat, next time.

If the MPs were sufficiently experienced they would know that the UK benefits bill, including pension is completely unaffordable There is no way around this but to cut spending.

35k for entitlement to winter fuel allowance is accepted as reasonable but they squandered such political will to get there. They could have done similar on pensions, no entitlement to triple lock if pensions income over 75k (an example). Who would complain about that?

If they reduce spending and invest in Defence which is essential it boosts uk economy so it's a win/win.

There are measures which are popular with the majority of the population, just not the back bench MPs. The rot started with Alistair Campbell who wouldn't allow MPs to be free thinkers.

I was a labour voter and really supported Starmer initially.

However, what's obvious I'd that he's a man of zero integrity.

He did many things he had no mandate for.

He pretended to care about antisemitism when it benefitted him to get the top spot, then switched to pandering to it when it suited him.

He's dishonest. The free designer clothes, mandleson etc.

He's given favour to friends.

He's just a thoroughly horrible man who's policies have been broadly hated.

I'll never vote labour again.

Same. I was a committed Labour voter- but stopped when Corbyn came to power. I had such high hopes for Starmer. I thought I'd be able to return to my natural political home.

No. Fraid not.

The frustrating thing is though that they have tax experts advising them, and they totally ignore their advice. Ask the IFS or Dan Neidle’s Tax Policy Associates for a fair way to tackle the exploitation of the Agricultural exemption. Easy. But no, they don’t consult them and just do their own half baked thing instead. Same for growth policies. All ignored. Do they want to succeed or not? I’d say not.

I had such high hopes for Corben, but that wasn't to be

100%!!!!!

@Castellioabsolutely! It’s absolute madness. I think they must have rushed the agricultural exemption through without thinking about it, thinking that they could solve the issue AND raise money (because everything they have done is just raising money for the next hole, rather than thinking how it all fits together - yes, they are in a fiscal hole, but they could have done what Tony Blair did when he got in and largely adopt the last government’s spending plans for a year, make clear that you won’t do anything big immediately and then put together a big programme that fits together as a whole - you wouldn’t have had the big mad Budget debacles either)

Yes I do feel sad

I though Starmer gave speech earlier

The knives have always been out for him within the party and I very much doubt they are feeling sad too

I have no respect for Keir at all and wouldn't trust him to open a tin with a tin opener. He’s got what he deserves.

Of course I'm done with the Labour party, after a lifetime of voting for them and its Starmer who is the problem. The first things he did as soon as he got into power was punch down on women and pensioners, pretending that men can be women and taking away the winter fuel payment. That alone i won't forgive, but add to it his greedy consumption of clothes, holidays and event tickets all for free, his ignoring of growing antisemitism but worst of all, his support for Mandelson. Disgusting. He's a mealy mouthed greedy misogynist who prefers flying around the world than actually governing us boring old Brits. Believed by many to be the worst P M we've ever had-which is something when you look at the recent P Ms we've suffered under. He's managed to alienate nearly every group in our society, so no, i don't feel sorry for him.

And there's the biggest problem with the Labour party right now, more concerned with Palestine than the UK. Feeds right into the left's antisemitism.

Starmer's a complete weasel and I hope he disappears up his own fundament.

I think Labour's every move is being smeared by the right wing press and idiots are falling for it. Starmer is fundamentally a decent human being but our increasingly stupid and vapid population want a narcissistic entertainer rather than a grown up at the helm. Labour have made mistakes, not least on their stupid obsession with gender ideology. It amuses me that some of Reform's loudest supporters will be most shafted by a Reform government. It's 'Leopards won't eat MY face!' all over again.

It's not sad. He is as defiant as ever. I thought this country was meant to be a democracy.

Yes, for a supposedly Labour politician he's the worst elitist ever, he certainly doesn't like working class people or women. Or older people. Or small business people. He really only seems comfortable amongst the elites of the world, the ones who give him free designer clothes and wine and dine him as he jets around the globe. Anywhere but the UK and us plebs.