Was sex at school less stigmatised in the late 90s?

[blubberball]

I was at school in the late 90s. I see things online now about "body count" and how that can be used by some to shame people (women). I don't know about your school and the general attitude around at the time, but it really seemed like the opposite was true back then. The cool people at school were the ones who had experience. Admittedly my town did have the highest teenage pregnancy rate in Europe at the time. Was this the case when others were at school? People didn't seem ashamed of sex when I was at school. It was the opposite, they were very proud of it and laughed at the inexperienced people.

Generally body count is used in the sense that if boys are dating a girl they want them to have a low body count. Not as in it being something you'd ask someone you weren't dating. But it's certainly used, definitely online, as an insult between strangers.

Exactly: a 'casual thing' at 12? What was going on in this child's life?

I would say yes, mid 90's. It felt like a race to lose it. If you didn't have a boyfriend you were called 'a fridge', this was even at age 12/13/14. There was no question of sexuality, respect or anything else. It felt like being bullied for not having a boyfriend. It really was awful. I'm glad my DC don't experience this pressure today.

I did have a friend who between the ages of 14 to 18 had become pregnant 3 times. She didn't continue with any of the pregnancies. By the time she was pregnant the first time I had moved into another friend group. I wouldn't say the consensus was that she was seen as 'cool' for having this happen to her though.

Hmm...well I was (older Gen Z) and plenty of people I knew were. Though others were having sex from 14 or 15. But I was at a girls' school that was quite focused on academics and with quite a lot of girls whose parents were originally from stricter cultures. So that may have made a difference. I'd have hated to be shamed, hope that wasn't common.

Also I recall a girl a few years ahead of me, she must have been in year 11. She was heavily pregnant and wore a pinafore dress and not a skirt, as that was a better fit for her bump. She was giggled about.

Yes that has improved a lot though I'm sure some people are still nasty.

Your comment reminds me of this song from a very funny musical about 17 year olds! In which a boy is singing about how he's lied about sleeping with someone and a girl is lying about being a virgin.

The more I think of this, in the mid 90's, I actually fibbed and pretended I'd 'lost it' on a holiday romance during the summer whilst we were off school. I was 16. It kept the pressure off being labelled a 'fridge'.

Strict boundaries. Cool to have had sex with a boy friend who loved you. If with a non boyfriend then you’re a slag who is socially stigmatized.

Not at my school. Having a sexual relationship with one long term boyfriend might have been cool. Girls who slept around were called slags or slappers

She is being honest though, not liking it doesn't change that. It is exactly what most people still think - source: the entire internet. Nobody (or very few people) actually wants sloppy seventy seconds.

I left school 1990, single sex comprehensive, but a lot of 6th form subjects were shared with the boys school, and we'd known most of them since primary anyway - small town, rural catchment. Sex Ed focussed a lot on pregnancy (must ask one of the boys one day if theirs did too, or whether it was the focus for us, because we had the pregnancies) and STIs, especially HIV, so everything was condoms, becausewe were all goung to die of AIDS.

Except obviously it wasn't always condoms or any other contraception - there were 3 pregnancies I knew of in my 5th year (year 11 in new money.) One ended in a miscarriage, but the other two had their babies. And scandalously, a girl a few years below had a baby at 13.

It was cool if you had "done it", but not cool to sleep around. I did not get any opportunity to do it with anyone, and didn't even get a kiss. In 6th form, I did get a few drunken kisses at socials, but no one ever wanted to go out with me. I lost my virginity at 18 at uni. I never really cracked the social codes, but it was clear there was a fine line between being cool for having had sex and being a slag for sleeping around. I think the line could vary a bit, according to how cool you were perceived to be, and also whether it was with boyfriends you were officially going out with or one night stands.

The fact that there was the motto "remember - to be sussed is a must but sex under 16 is illegal" does suggest that there were a lot of 14 and 15-year olds potentially considering it in their immediate future.

I did my GCSEs in 98 and in the North West town where I lived most girls had to walk the tightrope between being labelled a ‘fridge’ (frigid) and a ‘slag/slut’.

By year 11 most girls were expected to have at least engaged in heavy petting activities, if not having gone all the way with one or two partners as the norm. But if it got out you’d slept with too many lads, then there was definitely a stigma attached to you. And if you did get pregnant and had an abortion, people talked about it and judged you.

And then of course if you didn’t seem to show any real interest in fellas at all, chances are you’d be labelled a lesbian.

You couldn’t pay me to go back to being a teenager.

What’s wrong with thinking that way? I’d never have wanted a partner who had slept around. People can choose to, but not everyone would want to be with them. 🤷🏻‍♀️

I was also at school this time, there was definitely misogyny, as was mentioned "being flat" and gross comments and questions. I don't think there was quite as much sexual shaming of girls. Maybe a few got called a slapper. But I don't think there was this intense focus on women's sexuality and trying to control them with all this "body count" type of stuff. Nobody said stuff like ran through because someone had sex. When I was an older teen boys were happy to be having sex with girls who liked them and were attracted to them. You would have had to be a very weird dude to say anything like that.

Some men have always been insecure I suppose and worried that another man might have been better than them. Male ego problems. I'm sure women have some insecurities too. Of course they do!

But there are so many worse things to worry about than people who've had consensual, unproblematic, enjoyable sex with a few partners. I think this new misogyny is down to massive male insecurity and wanting to control women's bodies.

There didn’t seem to be much stigma with either having sex or not having sex.

getting pregnant was absolutely the kiss of death. It happened, but you took care of it quietly and didn’t let it ruin your life. We were nice girls from good families. Even if your parents were against abortion, they expected you to go have one in secret and just not make them deal with actually having to help.

my parents made that policy very clear. If I got pregnant I was kicked out and cut off. If I had an abortion, I was kicked out and cut off. I never had to test it, but I did have friends whose parents politely ignored their mysterious stomach ailments.

I dont know if my friend group was perpetually uncool or just unoticed. But i dont think anyone paid that much attention to whether others were having sex. Obvs alot of the guus talked about it.

I knew some people were having sex. But i never knew there to be this whole pressurising people to do it. (Outside of relationships)

I genuinely believed that whole bullied for being a virgin/slag was a tv thing. (Honestly weird too, why are all these people so concerened about whether youre a virgin or not)

I was in high school mid noughties

'Sloppy seventy seconds'

• so does that apply to women only? Or men as well? And what would the line be where someone has slept with too many people- I'm assuming you think some level of dating before marriage is OK?

I wouldn't want a partner who had been highly promiscuous either as I don't have casual sex and it would indicate potential incompatibility. But calling someone 'sloppy seconds' is awful, and even if pp (and you) meant it to apply to both sexes,,it's generally women who get nasty language like that used about them.

And what would qualify someone as 'seconds' anyway? Sex with any previous person?

Culture has changed.

I think that pornography and music has really locked into debasing and degrading women.

That results in less freedom.

I think that I had more freedom than my dd and her friends have now.

Not to say it was perfect, because it certainly wasn't.

But you could get away from things - now they can't.

As I stated in a previous post women find sloppy seventy seconds disgusting too. I don't care whether you hate that fact, you know it's a fact and that's that :)

Already also said under ten was the norm years ago, now it's under 20. The fewer the better for both sexes, obviously. Already all asked and answered. More than that, you're considered gross - both men and women. Reality doesn't care how you feel just bw :)

And stop using chat GPT, it's truly embarrassing for you that you can't just craft a simple response.

Nope, it's perfect and it is deliberate. Shaming people for doing things you find disgusting is a great societal tool, and it works.

So, no sloppy seventy seconds for me, or any normal person then :) The more things change, the more they stay the same :)

I was at school mid 90s to early 2000s and it wasn't cool at my school but equally wasn't openly stigmatised. Those who had sex underage (starting at 14) thought themselves cool, but to others they weren't particularly liked and weren't cool (at the time I would say they were viewed as trouble, in hindsight I am sad for them, they were clearly vulnerable and 'dating' 18+ year old men).

In the sixth form it was the cool girls who had sex, but they were having sex because they were cool and popular and therefore had boyfriends, not cool and popular because they had sex iyswim. Casual sex wasn't widespread and definitely wasn't seen as cool.

I was at secondary and sixth form in the 00s early to mid-late 00s. Sex was cool within parameters. Starting too early was weird somehow and to be too casual was unattractive and got you talked about. I went to a private all girls school for school years 7-11. It was always cool to know boys/ hang out with boys but I don't think as a year group on the whole, we really did very much more than kissing or occasionally a bit of fondling with any of these boys before roughly quite late on in year 10. So around 15 heading for 16.

The cooler girls had boyfriends and the loss of virginity started around then really, as a bit of a trickle that picked up in sixth form. Because we were so nearly legal, beyond a little curiosityw no one cared as long as you had a boyfriend- it was seen as normal. I remember someone a couple of years below me being viewed as REALLY slutty for having sex very young though. Anyone known for boyfriend pinching or being too casual about finding partners was judged. The faster starters were seen as a bit cool and could be a little patronising but it wasn't really much of a thing.

I think the school worried though as we had some very comprehensive sex ed in year 9 re stds and contraception. A friend who joined for sixth form mentioned the schools "notorious" teen pregnancy rate, heard from someone else in our year. This was news to me and I had been at the attached junior school too, and was well aware of loads of school lore! Certainly no one was ever known to pregnant and I think only 1 I know of ever "had to leave" because of it during my era. Only 1 in my year was ever rumoured to have had an abortion. No one really said anything but she was seen as a bit too keen behind her back. Anyone having a baby not long after leaving- that was their look out.

I went to a mixed, private sixth form with the same sort of vibe. A few people had slept with boyfriends in year 11 and they seemed the most grown up but no one cared in a negative way. It was a mixed sixth form attached to an all boys school so we got a lot of jokes etc but no one really judged sex with a boyfriend; we all did it during sixth form and no one cared as long as you were dating them and you weren't cheating. Cheating etc got you a rep - slutty for a girl, untrustworthy arsehole for a boy. I also recall boys with a supposed high body count not being seen as that attractive, either. They were seen as a bit obvious or sleazy. It was certainly a bigger deal to be gay than to be sexually active in a heterosexual relationship. Neither of the gay boys on my year came out til after school (after uni for one of them) and my openly bi friend was teased. She batted it off but it didn't go away until quite near the end of school. One guy is supposedly still in the closet.

We had some sex ed as girls from a nurse in lower sixth but it was less empowering or useful than I'd had before! I also know the MAP was available from the nurse (boarding school) as the girls once all got lectured about it being requested too frequently. It was supposedly aimed at the year above me - they were considered a golden year in terms of achievement etc. But they were legendary for boyfriend stealing, and lots of getting up to no good in various dark corners of the school.