To wish parents appreciated their kids’ education more?

[MayasJamas]

Another meet up with middle class parents last night, another inevitable diatribe about how the education system teaches kids nothing but how to pass exams.

As a teacher, I bite my tongue. I truly wish parents could see what young people are actually learning. How the world works (scientifically, sociological, ethically). How to question what they read and hear. How to draw, write, speak, listen. How in English, even in GCSE lessons, we regularly discuss the deepest of human issues: war, love, injustice, misogyny, kindness, religion, prejudice.

I completely agree that the GCSE system is flawed and too much pressure. I have a Y11 child myself and it is too much. But it seems to be a middle class hobby to slag off everything that schools and teachers are trying to do. It’s ironic because, generally speaking, these privileged children are the ones who will benefit most from the education system their parents deride. They’ll go on to study subjects they enjoy at A Level and uni, to have rewarding careers in whatever field they choose. They literally couldn’t do that without education. Generally speaking, teachers and schools are also trying to make those opportinities available to all. I teach underprivileged kids who want to become brain surgeons and journalists and politicians. Education will help them to do that.

But no. ‘It’s just a memory test’. ‘They’re not learning anything relevant to real life’. I don’t want a medal btw, but AIBU to think parents are quick to shit on the system that is actually (on the whole) enriching the lives of their kids?

Oh ok. We don’t. Different extracts and themes. So they can’t memorise answers at all. Ways of writing, sure. But not the actual thinking part.

Just don't encourage them to get in massive debt to pursue a job that doesn't exist unless you are from a rich background, have contacts, are a nepo baby, can afford to study more and so on...

Teachers do many working class kids no favours at all when they have a 2.1 in humanities from the university of bognor Regis, over 40,000 pounds if debt at 7% interest per annum and no 'contacts' who care that they were vice captain of the uni debating society...

Yes, our system today does offer opportunities to people, but in the past, even working class kids were entitled to grants... And there were no 9250 pound tuition fees... Now I feel many from poorer backgrounds are being really conned at 18... Often by teachers who live in a middle class bubble.

Of all the irritating tendencies on this site, few strike me as more arrogant and out of touch than this idea that if you don’t like your kids school you should just home educate. I wonder why everyone isn’t taking this option. It’s almost like most parents have someplace to be during the day that would prevent them from doing so.

Did you enjoy the refreshing breeze as the point whooshed past you?

I’m sure your other point was lovely. This statement however was asinine.

I absolutely agree!
It's like there is no other option considered or offered to young people now except going to University & getting into debt.
And many don't really understand the debt or the impact of it because it's so normalised to take it on & just brush it off as if it were nothing.

We are definitely doing our young people a big disservice at the moment. They are, as you say, being conned into thinking that a degree, any degree, from any university is worth it. But, actually, is it??

It teaches them to use legible writing and to present their work clearly. They'll likely write for the whole of their education years. Writing neatly and clearly is all about concentrating and taking pride in your work. Why is it something you don't seem to value? Aside from handwriting, which is a vector to educational content, they learn so many other things. Education is a whole, not isolated parts.

As I pointed out before, it's for writing exam scripts legibly and at speed.
Cursive writing is generally quicker than printing.

At GCSE and definitely at A level students have to write a lot in a short space of time and it needs to be legible to the person marking it.
The education system hasn't caught up with technology yet and students still have to handwrite a lot so of course they need to learn to do it properly even if they will use keyboards & type in their adult life.

They need to write fast at present after the last set of changes made on the whim of one person, but many argue our exams are very outdated and should be much more coursework-oriented, or open book.

How applicable is 'rapid factual recall, formulaic response generation and rapid handwriting' to the modern workplace? Answer: not at all.

The exams we have currently are pretty unhelpful really.

I don't condone the exam system and agree it's outdated & puts way too much emphasis on recall.

But it's the one we have at present and the poor kids have to be able to write neatly and quickly to do well so learning to handwrite is still included in the school curriculum & is necessary.

I’m really interested in this.

I was permanently exhausted and on edge as a kid due to millions of extra-curricular commitments during evenings/weekends/holidays. My overwhelming memories are of being stressed/anxious, and I didn’t feel protected by adults and able to say no. I eventually shunned them more and more as I got older and almost completely stopped at uni, even though my degree was incumbent on performing.

My own kids (10/13) have a couple of fun hobbies, they also like performing and youngest plays football. They are allowed to veg out a lot more than I was, and I don’t nag them to practise. DS1 AuDHD and no qualms about pushing back!

I think it’s that the exams are so do or die. Why does two years of work come down to two/three hours? Why not continual assessment? I grew up in the US and much prefer how they did it. And don’t even start about A levels and the ridiculous conditional offer rigmarole! So it’s maybe not the teaching but the system that puts a child’s future in to how they perform over a few hours over a few short weeks.

Whatever the original reasons for it, it’s going to be hard to revert due to AI, which will probably always be one step ahead of any anti cheating technology.
ETA: unless continuous assessments are in the form of tests and exams.

This is usually said by low achievers so I wouldn't pay too much attention to what they say.

But the education system is fairly broken and it’s wrong to suggest otherwise. There’s been a huge teacher shortage for many years and schools are heavily reliant on supply staff. It’s so bad at my DC’s secondary they sometimes have three classes taught by one teacher in the hall, and not even the same subject either. You can’t say that isn’t categorically broken.

MFL is being axed in many schools due to teacher shortage which is a travesty. The curriculum also needs an overhaul and has for many years- why are the same texts being taught at GCSE as I was taught 20ish years ago? Gove made a total pigs ear of it.

It’s broken at HE level too. I’m a lecturer, it’s a mess and has been since the 2012 fee reform. Students are foisted off on PhD students or part time temporary staff. They often don’t get the education they pay 9.5k a year for.

I have been so impressed with DC’s secondary education. After a disappointing time in primary school (although there were some outstanding teachers) I was amazed at the extent of the extracurricular offerings - all for free. DC does a different activity every day after school, plus nearly every lunchtime. His teachers encourage discussion and debate in the lessons, and he has had some amazing rewards for his work, like trips out and afternoon tea!

I agree with you. Education is a key to success, especially for working class children, it gives them the ladder to freedom as outside experiences aren’t always possible in their everyday life.
Maybe it’s different when they have the opportunity to educate through life experiences.

How applicable is 'rapid factual recall, formulaic response generation and rapid handwriting' to the modern workplace? Answer: not at all.

Actually this describes perfectly the skills I needed as a City law trainee. And the skills I need from my juniors…

when I left school I couldn’t write a cv, couldn’t cook, couldn’t sew, didn’t know what a credit rating was, didn’t know anything about doing taxes.. but I could join my handwriting and tell you all about parallelograms. It’s really come in handy this parallelogram season. School in this country is awful and all my teachers were too.

my children’s school have lovely teachers but the rules are absolutely ridiculous and don’t get me started on joined handwriting. Their writing “doesn’t count” if it isn’t joined. I’m 35 and still don’t join my writing

The cooking and sewing should be learned at home, so much is expected from teachers that should could from parents.
It’s worse nowadays, children don’t know how to use a toilet starting or use a tissue for snots.
Parent’s need to teach children how to run a household and budget, obviously this isn’t available for all children, neglected children.
Teacher’s have far too many basic social skills to teach these days, miles away from the curriculum.

Whatever about speed, I found my children’s handwriting to be far less legible after they adopted cursive. It used to be very clear but not anymore. They are teens now and I worry the poor legibility will impact on exam results.

NZ?

These days are behind me, but I would give y11 parents a bit of a break for now. They are seeing their kids stressed before GCSEs which have a ridiculous number of exams. They will see the masses of rote learning for some subjects and be questioning it. Certainly from my kids’ experience, the English and history exam prep was so formulaic, with little chance for creative thinking. But that’s not the teachers’ fault.

It is a stressful time for kids, teachers and parents at this point in the year.

fwiw my kids loved school, had great teachers and still miss their schooldays.

Whose essays are they memorising?

Pp must be from new Zealand