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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Stop being grabby and entitled and using false arguments to try to turn your mother into your servants

803 replies

Youlittlenightmare · 15/04/2026 02:58

Posting in AIBU for traction, not because I think I'm wrong - I know I'm right in fact :) But this is where many of the grabby, problematic mumsnetters turn up to have a whinge and make false arguments. So this is for all of you.

And let’s be clear, if you're a grandmother who genuinely loves caring for your grandchildren, good for you. This thread is not for or about you. If your own mother happily provides childcare and truly enjoys it, lovely. This thread is not or or about you either.

This is about dismantling a stubborn and deeply illogical belief that if a grandmother declines the burden of childcare, she somehow forfeits the right to see her grandchildren.

No one is owed childcare from their mother. End.

It does not matter whether she had help when raising you, other people’s sacrifices are not items on a balance sheet for you to cash in later. Older women are not public utilities, nor are their remaining years a communal resource to be allocated by their adult children. They are human beings with dignity, autonomy, and the absolute right to say no for any reason whatsoever.

They have already done the work. They raised their children. Their duty is complete.

But what is especially irritating is how often two completely separate things are deliberately conflated with the dreary refrain of “Well then she can’t expect visits from the grandchildren.”

This is a logical failure.

Childcare is work. It is labour intensive, draining, time consuming, and often physically demanding.

A family visit is not work. Bringing your children to see their grandmother, spending time together, sharing conversation and affection, that is family life. It is a relationship, not a work shift.

To collapse those into the same category is a false equivalence.

If you dislike your mother so much that visiting her feels like a burden, like work, then of course you definitely do NOT want her to shoulder the burden of your job of parenting. That would be quite mad, imagine wanting your children under the care of a woman you would prefer never to spend time with.

If seeing her is a chore and you consider it a job then asking her to work for you (generally for free) is absurd.

If she wants to see you more often than you can manage that is QUITE another matter, just see her when you can, like normal people do.

But if you love your mother, you will want to see her because she is family, because you enjoy her company, because relationships exist for their own sake.

That bond is not, and should never be, contingent on whether she performs even more physical labour after decades of already doing exactly that.

These are the three coherent possibilities - you visit your mother with the children because you love her and enjoy being together. Otherwise known as normal family life.

The second possiblity is that you do not want a relationship with your mother, in which case you would neither visit nor expect free labour from her.

The third possiblitiy is that your mother freely chooses to provide childcare, which is her decision alone and not something anyone is entitled to demand nor contingent upon anything else.

What is not logically defensible is weaponising access to grandchildren as punishment because she refused unpaid work. That's coercion dressed up badly in sentiment.

It's not complicated - family connection and visits are a relationship. Childcare is labour. These two concepts are not interchangeable, and one should never be made conditional on the other or compared to the other.

And finally those of you who claim the relationship with her grandchildren will be stronger if an exhausted older women is forced to do your job of parenting - maybe. Maybe not. Nobody has the slightest idea of how kids will feel about their grandparents or parents as they grow up and a lot of grandmothers would gladly relinquish a "closer" relationship with their grandchildren if it meant they could put their exhausted feet up after a lifetime of labour, or go out when they want as they want doing what they want, without first running it past their dictator daughters.

So, all of you who keep trying to confuse what is actually a very simple concept with this nonsense - just stop now.

If you are demanding child care from your mother and trying to couch it in any way as anything she "should" do because "reasons", trying to conflate famly visit with her doing unpaid work that she did for decades already - you're an awful person, and are perpetuating the misogyny of treating women like commodities to be shared.

Stop throwing a tantrum, get on with parenting your own kids and visit your mother, or don't. For many of you, not visiting would be doing her a favour.

I am an older woman who is happy to agree to the intensive labour of free childcare a couple of times a week because I choose to. An older woman who would instantly tell you exactly where to go if you ever asserted your entitlement or attempted to tell me what I "should" do with my own precious, irreplaceable and limited time on this earth. An older woman who will decline childcare if I want to, when I want to and be treated respectfully regardless.

Signed - an older woman who is sick of your entitled bullshit. We see you.

Stop it.

OP posts:
Mangelwurzelfortea · 15/04/2026 12:38

Happyjoe · 15/04/2026 12:36

I have read these threats on MN for a few months actually! It's a real shame.

Hmmm. I wonder what the reaction would be if I started a post about entitled grandparents who show next to zero interest in their children and grandchildren suddenly expecting them to move closer and help out with cleaning the house and so on now that they're old and infirm. Which also happens (as I know from first-hand experience).

AstonScrapingsNameChange · 15/04/2026 12:38

So much ageism and misogyny on this thread 😞

'Bloody boomer grandmas, know your place'

🙄

Zov · 15/04/2026 12:40

AstonScrapingsNameChange · 15/04/2026 12:38

So much ageism and misogyny on this thread 😞

'Bloody boomer grandmas, know your place'

🙄

I noticed that too. You can see who the entitled ones are on this thread - who think granny should be looking after the children whilst mummy is at work. Wink

ValhallaCalling · 15/04/2026 12:42

This is clearly rage bait.

No sane person rants for pages about bully dictator daughters. I bet her daughter can't stand her and she's pissed she doesn't get to see her grand kids much as a result. I certainly wouldn't want to visit someone this hostile!

CautiousLurker2 · 15/04/2026 12:42

Mangelwurzelfortea · 15/04/2026 12:38

Hmmm. I wonder what the reaction would be if I started a post about entitled grandparents who show next to zero interest in their children and grandchildren suddenly expecting them to move closer and help out with cleaning the house and so on now that they're old and infirm. Which also happens (as I know from first-hand experience).

I mentioned this above - you know, for balance and to point out that it’s not that black and white. But OP was very scathing about the idea of nuance in this discussion.

MyLuckyHelper · 15/04/2026 12:42

Youlittlenightmare · 15/04/2026 11:38

176 likes/agreements so far. Lovely :) haven''t bothered reading any replies since page 2, because as I said then there is no rational or reasonable argument that can be made against what I said and everything was covered in the original post.

No point in letting those who are deliberately lying, or grossly entitled, get a rise from me - so I won't :)

The reason for posting was simple - you're not getting away with abusing your mothers like this, decent people see through you and everyone around you is thinking more or less what I am thinking whenever you start to flap your entitled gums.

And I want you to know that.

I am delighted to see such overwhelming support for my commonsense, fair and reasonable post.

It seems the majority sees through the dictator daughters' manipulative emotional blackmail and attempts to make false comparisons as just what it is - vicious coercion dressed up as sentiment.

Good. Attached a screenshot of the upvotes, let's see if it gets through.

Ciao - and thanks for all the support. Might check back tomorrow to see if the likes continue to climb :)

Edited

I'm not sure how a rant on MN is preventing people from 'getting away with' abusing their mothers?

IsEveryUserNameBloodyTaken · 15/04/2026 12:42

thefloorislavayes · 15/04/2026 05:32

Humans are what anthropologists call cooperative breeders. Unlike most species, our children are dependent for an unusually long time, and historically mothers didn’t raise them in isolation. Survival often depended on support from other women, especially grandmothers. There’s evidence from multiple historical populations that the presence of a maternal grandmother increased a child’s chances of survival.

It’s been suggested that women evolved to experience menopause partly so that older women could shift their focus from having more children to supporting the next generation. This is often explained through the Grandmother hypothesis.

Humans are unusual in that women live for decades after their reproductive years. From an evolutionary perspective, that’s not random. One explanation is that older women increased the survival chances of their grandchildren by helping with childcare, food gathering, and general support. In that sense, their role didn’t end with their own children - it shifted.

So across most of human history, raising children wasn’t an isolated task. It relied on a wider network, especially other women in the family. That’s part of why humans have been able to successfully raise such dependent offspring.

So the idea that parenting is, or should be, a completely self-contained, individual responsibility is actually very modern. For most of human history, it wasn’t optional - it was how families functioned.

That doesn’t mean any individual grandmother today is obligated to provide childcare. Autonomy still matters. But it does mean that expecting some level of support, or feeling the impact when that support isn’t there, isn’t “entitlement” or a “logical failure.” It’s a reflection of how human family systems have always worked.

Trying to separate family relationships from practical support as if they’ve never been connected ignores both biology and history. These things have always been intertwined - not as a transaction, but as part of being a functioning family unit

Fascinating.
No I’m not being sarcastic, I genuinely enjoyed reading your post.

Differentforgirls · 15/04/2026 12:43

ValhallaCalling · 15/04/2026 12:42

This is clearly rage bait.

No sane person rants for pages about bully dictator daughters. I bet her daughter can't stand her and she's pissed she doesn't get to see her grand kids much as a result. I certainly wouldn't want to visit someone this hostile!

The OP hasn’t ranted for pages. Others have though…

Weregoingtothefuckingmoon · 15/04/2026 12:43

Zov · 15/04/2026 12:40

I noticed that too. You can see who the entitled ones are on this thread - who think granny should be looking after the children whilst mummy is at work. Wink

My parents have never looked after my DC whilst I worked. Whilst another poster on here defending the OP has been clear on her thread that she relied on grandparents for childcare as she does not believe in childcare from outsiders. I think it is simply a case of selfish people have short memories to suit their lifestyle.

DontOpenTheFourthDrawer · 15/04/2026 12:44

ThatFairy · 15/04/2026 12:30

Helping out ageing parents isn't really the same as looking after excitable, crying, messy, noisy young kids day after day to a schedule early morning till evening, taking to and fro to school and nursery, though

No it can be far worse. If you've ever experienced dealing with an adult with dementia you would know its far, far, far worse than dealing with a toddler

CautiousLurker2 · 15/04/2026 12:44

AstonScrapingsNameChange · 15/04/2026 12:38

So much ageism and misogyny on this thread 😞

'Bloody boomer grandmas, know your place'

🙄

Indeed - and no acknowledgement of PPs (mine) that reference very engaged grandads because that doesn’t fit the narrative that mothers are evil and their daughters (despite also now being mothers) are the victims of their older, selfish, ungenerous female parents.

Littlebitpsycho · 15/04/2026 12:46

I agree. I am very close to my mum, but she made it very clear as soon as I was pregnant that she wasn't going to be providing any childcare whatsoever.

I was perfectly ok with that. I chose to have a child, it is my responsibility to arrange and pay for suitable childcare should it be required.

It hasnt affected our relationship at all, and my mum and my DD (now 14) have an excellent relationship too

Corvidsarethebest · 15/04/2026 12:47

I mostly agree with this, because women are expected to go on caring and providing for their whole lives. I've told my children I won't be doing huge amounts of hands-on childcare (even if I change my mind!) so they don't expect me to be the solution to that. I would always support them, though, in terms of babysitting, being interested in their lives, money, emotional support and spending time together as a family including their children. That's all I want to offer as I found being a mum quite hard and so don't want to spend my older years doing it if possible. That said, I know people who have unexpectedly taken in teens during a family crisis and loved it! I would never say never.

I see us as a family unit for ever. I might buy in paid help though, as I don't want to do it all myself, just as I want them to get outside carers for me and not be wiping my arse. That's one reason I have financial goals, to give myself and them a break from being endless carers at all points in their lives, which most men never experience.

H3342 · 15/04/2026 12:47

I agree with you 99% - the only thing I would take issue with is

It does not matter whether she had help when raising you, other people’s sacrifices are not items on a balance sheet for you to cash in later

I feel it does matter whether your parents had help. This is the time to show how it benefited you and how you want to pay it forward to your children. Taking and then not passing the experience on is incredible selfish..

The caveat to that though is that we won't retire until 67, our mothers often were retired at 60. Those 7 years make a hell of a difference in stamina and health. So at nearly 70 when you retire I totally agree you may not wish to do any childcare and your children using this as emotional blackmail is vile.

ProjectHailMary · 15/04/2026 12:50

ThatFairy · 15/04/2026 12:30

Helping out ageing parents isn't really the same as looking after excitable, crying, messy, noisy young kids day after day to a schedule early morning till evening, taking to and fro to school and nursery, though

No, it’s much less fun.

MsJinks · 15/04/2026 12:51

Strikes me there’s a lack of communication causing some issues. I’m not sure how many young ones are actually saying ‘screw you, and don’t call me when you’re dying on the floor’ nor how many grandparents are saying ‘not a chance, can’t abide having the kids, but I will expect proper family care when I’m struggling’ I mean really, is this how the actual conversation ms go, or is it more a fumbling around and go home and then stew about it and work out what they meant in your opinion?

I think maybe if each were more honest then both sides would get a snapshot of the reality - maybe grandad could say he’s worked 50+ years and is so tired - or if a bit younger then they’re worried about their pension or don’t think they can commit. The parents could lay out how bloody hard it is and how they need their earnings, or not dip out of a career etc.

I will add a couple of things though - I’m not sure who these grandparents are who had their gran care and mainly mum not work - I’m 60 and my mum worked full time from my age 7 with my grandad sometimes picking up after school though it wasn’t long until I could use a key. They were both working when I had kids but also could never have managed the several I had ha. I never had parent childcare but managed to muddle through with clubs and nurseries- I did help with care later as why would I not as I had the space at that point.

I also want to say that I think childcare is harder today - mine could (and did) play out - when a friend had one of mine after school it was basically a snack and they went out to play till I collected. I have babysat myself but it seemed they could just all play in the house or the garden and I didn’t have to check screentime or cut food up or follow diets etc etc. I have my grandkids occasionally to help out and it seems more intense - though I love having them too. I am also a lot less energetic- I do work but can’t imagine I’d be able to childcare instead and not drop with exhaustion.

I do think lately there’s a bit of an entitlement culture - encouraged by some parents eg/ never expecting them to pay their way or wash their clothes till they’re a 100 or just saying you’d have the grandkids always - kids have to learn to become adults as part of them being your child, not just have mum/dad do everything. But I think a bit of nicer discussion and understanding could help smooth some stuff over here.

Don’t break a family just cos one doesn’t do what the other wants - it’s pretty sad that.

ProjectHailMary · 15/04/2026 12:52

CautiousLurker2 · 15/04/2026 12:44

Indeed - and no acknowledgement of PPs (mine) that reference very engaged grandads because that doesn’t fit the narrative that mothers are evil and their daughters (despite also now being mothers) are the victims of their older, selfish, ungenerous female parents.

The OP is a grandma. She didn’t mention her husband or any grandfather doing anything, did she? Is she a misogynist?

I think you’ll find that older women are far more misogynistic than younger women. Look at the number of older women who’ve posted on this thread complaining that their daughter in law doesn’t facilitate their relationship with their grandchildren rather than directing their criticism at their sons.

Mangelwurzelfortea · 15/04/2026 12:56

ProjectHailMary · 15/04/2026 12:52

The OP is a grandma. She didn’t mention her husband or any grandfather doing anything, did she? Is she a misogynist?

I think you’ll find that older women are far more misogynistic than younger women. Look at the number of older women who’ve posted on this thread complaining that their daughter in law doesn’t facilitate their relationship with their grandchildren rather than directing their criticism at their sons.

Sons almost never get criticised on MN - it's always the daughters/DILs in the line of fire.

Gillthepill · 15/04/2026 12:58

Very eloquently expressed OP.

Flowersforyourchocolateprettyplease · 15/04/2026 12:58

rainingsnoring · 15/04/2026 11:46

Unfortunately, I don't think your rant will change anyone's behaviour @Youlittlenightmare. You just sound angry, resentful and pretty silly. You could have conveyed the same message in a much better way.

Of course, there are some parents who are selfish and entitled and some grandparents who are selfish and entitled. Most people can identify these people. At the end of the day, those who enable them (the kind but exhausted GPs and the kind but exhausted sons and daughters) need to learn to draw their own personal boundaries too.

No she doesn't, weird that's your take.

Velumental · 15/04/2026 12:58

saraclara · 15/04/2026 10:45

I didn't make it clear that my use of 'you' was intended to be plural and inclusive of your DH.
You were talking about the effort of all of you going to MIL and having to spend the full day there. So I tried to offer suggestions to make it less painful. I believe I even mentioned your DH as potentially being the one to have that conversation with her.

I'm not sure why you needed to say "of course.." as more usually pick ups and drop offs off children cared for by grandparents are fairly brief. So while it's nice that you hang around with her afterwards, I'm not sure why you expected me to assume that you did

Edited

She watches them in our house, I couldnt exactly chuck her out 😂 sometimes she's in a rush to beta the traffic but generally she hangs around for a bit. Honestly the positive thing with my mil is she has a husband and a life of her own and a very spoilt and overlyd pendant younger son who only moved out when he turned 30 so she still takes him grocery shopping etc, he lives near us so she leaves ours and calls in at his yo complain about my shitty housekeeping and that I won't let her feed the kids entire bags of pick n mix 😂

We annoy each other but under it all we're amicable and if she needs elderly care I'll provide what I can but not because she's babysat, although at least impart because she does on my kids
She can be an arsehole to me but she makes them feel safe andoved and does her best to understand our parenting choices etc. so if she needs her arse wiped in her 80s I'll wipe it.

ThejoyofNC · 15/04/2026 13:05

Differentforgirls · 15/04/2026 12:29

Don’t think there is such a thing.

Oh there is. Same people who don't allow anyone near their newborn for the first 6 years of their life and even then only want you to come round to clean up for them. Oh and don't you DARE ask to hold the baby, but you better be willing to babysit as soon as you're summoned.

Differentforgirls · 15/04/2026 13:27

ThejoyofNC · 15/04/2026 13:05

Oh there is. Same people who don't allow anyone near their newborn for the first 6 years of their life and even then only want you to come round to clean up for them. Oh and don't you DARE ask to hold the baby, but you better be willing to babysit as soon as you're summoned.

Edited

Yes I know but I don’t think there is a “British” culture as such. People in the country I live in don’t carry on like that! My friends daughter recently had a baby. I got sent photos from the hospital and her bed and the baby were surrounded by family.

Now I’m getting photos of the baby’s first “girls day” surrounded by her mum, her two grans, her great Aunty, with her great cousins, her actual Aunty (friends DIL) and it’s lovely.

I don’t get all that stuff you mentioned, same as you. It’s unbelievable.

Vivi0 · 15/04/2026 13:27

Youlittlenightmare · 15/04/2026 11:38

176 likes/agreements so far. Lovely :) haven''t bothered reading any replies since page 2, because as I said then there is no rational or reasonable argument that can be made against what I said and everything was covered in the original post.

No point in letting those who are deliberately lying, or grossly entitled, get a rise from me - so I won't :)

The reason for posting was simple - you're not getting away with abusing your mothers like this, decent people see through you and everyone around you is thinking more or less what I am thinking whenever you start to flap your entitled gums.

And I want you to know that.

I am delighted to see such overwhelming support for my commonsense, fair and reasonable post.

It seems the majority sees through the dictator daughters' manipulative emotional blackmail and attempts to make false comparisons as just what it is - vicious coercion dressed up as sentiment.

Good. Attached a screenshot of the upvotes, let's see if it gets through.

Ciao - and thanks for all the support. Might check back tomorrow to see if the likes continue to climb :)

Edited

Never in my life have I seen any poster take a screen shot of the reactions to their post, and actually post it on the thread to show they are “right” 😂

You seem like an absolute nightmare from the way you conduct yourself online; can’t even begin to imagine what you’re like in person.

MyOtherProfile · 15/04/2026 13:31

Youlittlenightmare · 15/04/2026 11:38

176 likes/agreements so far. Lovely :) haven''t bothered reading any replies since page 2, because as I said then there is no rational or reasonable argument that can be made against what I said and everything was covered in the original post.

No point in letting those who are deliberately lying, or grossly entitled, get a rise from me - so I won't :)

The reason for posting was simple - you're not getting away with abusing your mothers like this, decent people see through you and everyone around you is thinking more or less what I am thinking whenever you start to flap your entitled gums.

And I want you to know that.

I am delighted to see such overwhelming support for my commonsense, fair and reasonable post.

It seems the majority sees through the dictator daughters' manipulative emotional blackmail and attempts to make false comparisons as just what it is - vicious coercion dressed up as sentiment.

Good. Attached a screenshot of the upvotes, let's see if it gets through.

Ciao - and thanks for all the support. Might check back tomorrow to see if the likes continue to climb :)

Edited

Fascinating. I wonder how many of those were bouquets which are sometimes given as a sign of pity.

I also wonder if we are dealing with some kind of personality disorder here. This level of self belief and inability to hear any other opinions is quite revealing.