AIBU to request a service charge is removed before service?

[Globules]

Went to a lovely restaurant yesterday. We began by ordering at the table using the app. We expected to pay before recieving our food.

The app automatically added a 12.5% service charge to the order. There was no option to remove it.

So I went to the bar and ordered. The server put the order through the app I'd just used, therefore the total was the same. I asked her to take off the service charge. She seemed surprised, but did so.

Inside I was thinking I haven't had any service yet, how can you charge me for it now?

The server poured the 2 drinks at the bar. I carried them to our table. Another server carried our plates of food 3m from the hatch to the table.

There was no other interaction with servers at all. The servers were pleasant enough, but 20 seconds of announcing food was all it amounted to.

The food was really tasty but nothing service wise to justify the £7 service charge they asked for upfront, before you'd even experienced the service!

I understand the outrage at the service charge being applied at the point of ordering and paying but surely it makes sense to add it then, as if you’ve paid up front you don’t get another change to pay it after?

Not that I really agree with services charges. A tip should be just that - a little token of appreciation. A couple of quid. Not the 12.5% that gets added on. It’s really frustrating going places and the bill is higher than expected. The advertised price should cover it all. If I’m in a restaurant, how on earth are you expecting me to get the food and drinks I’ve ordered if you’re not bringing it to me?! It’s part of the experience surely.

I'd be interested to hear about what happens in countries other than the US.

When I was in Baden-Baden in February it was a relief to see no service charge or tips added. I just rounded up the amount I paid if I had good service, the same as when I lived in Germany 20 years ago.

Tips in many places get pooled too

They don’t have to though. Legally, if a tip is given to an employee directly they can keep it.

Literally every single restaurant adds a 12.5% service charge.

This is nonsense. Loads of independent restaurants don't add a service charge. Nandos doesn't. McDonalds doesn't. That's 2000 restaurants that don't add a service charge for a start.

I generally don't mind when service is added to the bill at the end of a meal when you've been served. But I think places have started to take the piss sometimes with the automatic ones. There's a pub I go to where a perminent street food venue operates. You go up to the counter and order and are given a buzzer to collect your order. Before you pay there's a screen to add 5%, 10% or 15% service. It is optional, but there is no service at all!

Nah, it's annoying. Go back to tips at the end of the meal - and I always tip. Service charge, which I presume goes into the companies big pot is taking the pee.

I'm sorry, what?

A service charge on a bag of crisps?!

Is it optional?

I just rounded up the amount I paid if I had good service, the same as when I lived in Germany 20 years ago.

It's the same in France. No service charges & no emotional blackmail to leave a tip although generally we do leave a little cash if the serving staff are pleasant.

I don’t generally tip and I always ask for the service charge to be removed, I pay the advertised price for what I’ve ordered, I’m not paying people extra to do the job they’re already being paid to do. I’ve worked in hospitality, tips were nice but I wasn’t relying on them.

I'd be interested to hear about what happens in countries other than the US.

There is no tipping culture in Japan, it is simply not expected.

I don't know about Spain in general but in Seville last year we found that there was no way of adding optional service when presented with the total on the payment machine at the end and servers seemed surprised that we were trying to do so, so it certainly seems it isn't expected there either. We could leave a tip in cash but given an increasingly cashless society they don't seem to consider it necessary to facilitate it via machine.

Service charge includes the chef cooking and bar and waiter staff serving you. You were being tight

If you order a packet of crisps alongside your drink at the bar they are adding 12.5% on top?!

They are all getting paid for the job they choose to do!

Same in Spain. If your bill is 58 euro, you'd probably leave 60 (until recently, where we went at least, most people paid cash, and many restaurants didn't even accept cards, but I think that's changing now, especially as it's often hard to take cash out of a machine without paying a fee), with no sniping from the 'must tip at least 10% but anything less than 15% is stingy' crowd.

I expect that, in the UK, automatic service charges have been introduced because almost everyone pays by card these days, so tips were probably falling.

So they add them on automatically, knowing that most people are too 'British' to ask for it be removed, even if service hasn't been great, which is usually the case. But shouldn't they be aiming to provide good service as standard, as a basic expectation of doing the job they're already paid to do?

It was our first time there. It's a very lovely seaside location. This restaurant is on the beach, with a stunning view. They're exceptionally busy and don't take bookings. I imagine that having customers paying upfront cuts down on table turnover time.

We're definitely going back. The food was the best we'd had in a very long time.

Explain how? They are already being paid to do exactly that job.

Do you tip everyone else you encounter in your life who performs any sort of service for you?

Whatever people working in hospitality are saying the prices have gone up already. So I’m paying more for food and drinks and my 12.5 % service charge is more now as my total has increased. So guess what? I eat out less. I’m ok, I’m not starving but restaurants are struggling because in this equation there is no compromise- I pay more but they want to get more, it doesn’t work like this if we are aiming for a compromise.

I have. Lots of them. And the point is that if they do it’s on the final bill. Ordering from an app you pay upfront, not at the end. It’s different.

I completely agree OP. I tip generously for good service……..poor service - no tip.
If there’s something they’ve done well I tell them openly…….if something is wrong I tell them discreetly- no need to shout, yell and cause embarrassment. And I never leave a negative review.

But there are lots of other workers that work just as hard for minimum wage that don’t get tipped. What makes your daughter and her coworkers so special?
If we don’t push back on the now we are going to end up the same way as the USA where tips of 25% and more are demanded. It’s bloody ridiculous. Just do your job or find one that pays better.

It tends to be quick convenient places where otherwise you order at the bar. They are fine and the app makes it much, much easier for solo diners with nobody to keep their table when they go to the bar (important as you have to leave table number) or people with mobility issues. It’s not ann issue requiring snobbery.

How? The restaurant still has to pay all the costs and minimum wage. Service charge just goes to the employees. Makes no difference to the business.

We insist it is removed if we are paying by card - purely because there’s no guarantee it goes directly to your server

We go to an amazing restaurant every Christmas Eve and incredibly we end up with the same server every time. I can’t even explain how great he is - recommends wine based on how good it is rather than it being the most expensive, recommends various menu options to us and our kids that we wouldn’t usually have considered.

We pay our bill in full via card and give him cash extremely discretely so he can pocket it directly. He also told us that the card payment ‘tips’ don’t go directly to him at all and are split.

And, like a PP said, the app means even LESS service is given.

The service charge for the robot delivery to the table...on a par with service charges for crisps.

I'm happy to pay for good service, but it's now expected. That's what's frustrating.