Is this a form of abuse?

[Chocolatebuttons88]

I don't know why I want to label this. It probably won't make me feel any better, but I'd like a label all the same.

So, I won't go into all the details, but here are the salient points.

I have a child. I had this child on my own. I then got into a relationship when she was very young. I was with my boyfriend for 3 or 4 years. We never lived together, and my DD never called him "daddy." I have always been truthful with her. I didn't ask this man for any money or help. He would see my daughter (for example, on days out), but provided nothing in terms of day-to-day care. She now has very hazy memories of him.

I finished the relationship almost four years ago for a whole host of reasons.

He couldn't accept this. He spent two years harassing me. I took this to the police several times, and nothing was done about it. He was never violent with me, and so it was decided that they wouldn't pursue it. The harassment included postcards, letters, emails, gifts, turning up at my house and the school, and sending voice recordings. Hundreds and hundreds of them. Maybe over 30 hours of voice recordings were sent to my email. Eventually, he gave up. Or so I thought. I didn't hear anything for a year.

Then, and this is the worst bit, I got a call from the police saying he had acknowledged my child, and he was now on her birth certificate as the father. I am not in the UK. Here, a man can put his name on the birth certificate without the mother's knowledge or consent. My daughter and I are British, but she was born here. Overnight, her nationality changed. He then filed for visitation rights.

By this point, he hadn't seen my daughter in over two years. And he knows he's not the father. But there's absolutely nothing I can do about it. I have to now fight through the courts to get him off. I'm doing this. I put the wheels in motion the moment I found out about it. It will take a long time. Years. In the meantime, the custody/visitation case keeps being postponed by my lawyer, hopefully until we can get him off the birth certificate.

OK... that's enough details. I could go on and on about everything I've had to do to fight this man, but it would make for a long read. My case is good. I have lots of witnesses. I am paying more money than I can afford for a good lawyer. I think I will win. A DNA test will be ordered by the court, and that should be the end of it. However, what I keep coming back to is the idea that this is a form of abuse. A form of staying in control. He is from this country. I'm not. He probably thought I'd lie down and take it. I don't know what his reasons are because I have not spoken to him and will never speak to him again. What I want to do, once I've sorted out my own case, is try to stop this from happening to other women. It's a kind of state-sanctioned abuse in a way, isn't it? What can I do to make people more aware of it? I know he won't be punished for what he's done. He can say he's acting in good faith, he thinks he's the father etc. Men here are allowed to do this. The very best I can hope for is that the birth certificate is rectified, and he can't do it again.

I suppose I want answers. I want to know if this is something the women in this country should know more about. Should I keep fighting after my personal fight is over?

Please be gentle with me. I'm still living this.

has he ever done something like ancestory dna? If yes, then if your daughter also did this, it would prove very soon he is not related to her.

Yes, I'm contesting at the same time. We had to move really quickly. It now means that the visitation case has been postponed. The next visitation hearing is in May, so we'll have to ask to postpone it again. There's a limit on contesting. 5 years. I put the wheels into motion the same day. I also got a will written up to say that I want her to go to my brother in the event og my death. I'm so scared that something could happen to me before this gets sorted, and then she's his. I know my brother would fight just as hard as I'm fighting, but it doesn't bear thinking about. I've had to tell the school. They've been really good about it. Amazing. I have good people around me. But I think my friends are a bit bored with it now, which I understand. But I live it every day. Every day. The legal system here is infuriating. I understand. He is being given the exact same rights as I am. That's the way it is. Under the law, he's the father. I could be a mother trying to stop him from seeing his child. So, they look into both sides very carefully. But I daydream about running him over. I know that's not right.

There are also inheritance laws here. She is now his next of kin and would inherit everything upon his death. There's no way out of that for him now. The law doesn't want me to stop that for her. By contesting, I'm depriving her of her right to inherit. Hence, she has to have her own lawyer. The whole system is unbelievable, and I'm so angry about it. I'm so angry.

I should point out that the average person here wouldn't know this was possible. The doctor, the school staff... all the official people I've had to tell... none of them believed it was possible.

I suppose the system is banking on the fact that most men wouldn't do this.

Honestly, I could go on about this all day.

You've all been so kind. Thank you so much. It feels good to know that people out there care.

It's illegal here to do it.

I've done it. I did it back in the UK. I have DNA tests proving he's not the father. I can't use them, though. They don't count for anything here. My lawyer has put it in my file as supporting evidence. BUT, the judge can ignore them. Here, only judge-appointed DNA tests count.

If the judge requests DNA, I'm fine. It's over. But it's the getting there that's so painful. The threat of him potentially getting access to her in the meantime. The cost is ridiculous. And I won't get that back. I don't really care about the money at this point. It's annoying, but it is what it is. I think what I care most about is that he won't get in any trouble for this. He will never suffer like I've suffered and like my daughter has. She doesn't fully understand, but she knows I'm stressed and sad.

Oh, you poor thing. What an incredibly stressful and frustrating time for you I feel rage towards this arsehole on your behalf!
Sorry, I haven’t read the full thread, but couldn’t you cut your losses and move back home?
Good luck x

I think it’s coercive control abuse as well as stalking and harassment. However a country that has a legal system that allows any Tom, Dick or Harry to put themselves onto a child’s birth certificate with no DNA proof of paternity doesn’t sound like a country that are going to help a woman in an abusive situation unfortunately. Absolutely shocking.

I don't really know where home is back in the UK. I wouldn't know where to go. I think I'd find it hard. I have no family over there. I could sell up here, but it wouldn't get me very far in the UK. My daughter is bilingual, she's settled here, we have friends, I have a business. I don't want to be forced out of our life here because of this man. But then I sometimes think, will he ever leave us alone? When I get this sorted, what next? What's he capable of? Maybe I could go back, change my name by deed poll. He'd never find us. But I'm also scared to start again. It's daunting. Since he did this, he hasn't contacted me. He hasn't been to the house, called, or emailed. I didn't find out about it until a couple of months after he did it. But on the day he did it, I later worked out, he left two roses leaning against my front door. It's like the stuff you'd see in a film. I hate him so much. I also blame myself a lot. Nobody liked him. My friends all told me they didn't like him, and I ignored it. So, I blame myself a lot. There were so many red flags looking back. SO many. I don't know what I was playing at.

This sounds awful, it is definitely abuse, seemingly backed up by the law of the country you are living in. I hope it is resolved as soon as possible and you can get on with your lives.❤

Sending hugs sympathy. My ex is rhe father of my children but numerous uears later he is still intense in causing endless issues. It is all carefully below the threshold of police to take it serious. Low level stalking. Reporting me to social services and police, causing issues via school or on social media etc. He will do one strategy for say 6 months then move to something else. It is abusive as us your situation.

I don't have time to read all messages in thread, so excuse me if this has already been suggested; Can you put the name of your child's biological father on he birth certificate retrospectively to displace this stalkers name?

Don’t blame yourself @Chocolatebuttons88 who could ever imagine he would ever go this far or even that it is legal!
What kind of idiotic legal system wouldn’t insist on a DNA test at the very beginning to ensure whether he had any rights over a child? The law in the country you are in seems very misogynistic!
I hope this nightmare ends soon for you or your ex dies soon and leaves lots of money to your daughter :)

Just read back, ignore my post, you don't (understandably ) want your child's biological father on the bc.

That's just it. The police won't do anything about roses on the doorstep. Or presents. Or postcards. He knows exactly what he's doing.

The voicemails were bad. Tens of hours of messages. The police took it seriously, but the courts closed the case. I really thought I'd get somewhere.

I've considered pursuing it in civil court. But it would cost more, take more time. And maybe I wouldn't get anywhere. Maybe here they think it's romantic.

I'm sure they see stuff that's a lot, lot worse. And so, it doesn't seem like much to them. It's not illegal to leave flowers on someone's door.

This is not your fault it is all him.
Don't feel guilty but use your anger to try and get a change in the law when it is all over.
I think I know which country it is too and I think most people will find it unbelievable.

I was in a similar position 26 years ago and I didn’t want to leave. I really didn’t. I was very happy in the country that I’d settled with my daughter in but we had no choice.
It was very much a now never a moment so we had to leave to avoid exactly what you’re describing, although in my case he was actually the father but still.
People would be surprised, really surprised in which countries these kinds of laws exist

In the UK, it’s about the intent, the flowers themselves are not problematic. It’s the fact that the flowers are there to intimidate you and remind you of his existence. Somebody needs to make that point to the local police.

What are you doing about yours and your daughter’s physical safety?
He sounds unhinged, and violence and/or kidnap don’t sound off the table. Are the police at least aware or helping you to protect the two of you?

I've done what I can. The school is aware, and they've installed cameras and issued strict instructions that no one pick her up except me. I'm very grateful to them for how good they've been. Other than that, I make sure my door is always locked and carry pepper spray. It's illegal, but I don't care.

It's actually very sad. I don't let my daughter play in our little garden. I have eyes on her all the time.

I've become quite paranoid, yes.

I've been to the police at least five times over the last four years.

In your position OP, as much as it pains you, I would return to the U.K., get as much space from this lunatic as possible.

The police/judge dismissing the harassment, is that according to the laws of the country or personal/institutional bias/sexism? Once you prove he is not the dad, would that count towards harassment/be seen as criminal behaviour?

I don't think it would count. He is quite within his rights to say he's the father. He can just argue that he believed he was. There's nothing to prove he isn't. Well, there is! I've got DNA tests to prove he isn't, but nobody seems to care!

It is a system bias.

When the harassment case came to nothing, I appealed, but the judge still closed it. I can now pursue it in the civil court, but I've got too much else going on. I'd need a different lawyer for that. I've already got two. Three, including my daughter's (but I don't have to pay for that).

I will still use it in my case when contesting paternity. Although he didn't get charged with anything, it still happened, and if he carries on stalking, the case would be reopened. But he hasn't stalked me since. No letters, calls, or presents. Nothing. He put his name on my child's birth certificate instead and filed for visitation. He knows what he's doing. He left those roses at the door, but I have no proof they were from him. He's bright. He's manipulative. With the visitation request, everything is on there - the money he'll give, how it will be paid, and which centre will be used for supervised visits at first, how many days he wants, every other weekend, 50% of the holidays. Everything. You can't imagine how terrifying it is.

I remember him telling me about an ex. How she finished with him, and he couldn't find her afterwards, that she'd done a very good job of hiding. That's what I feel guilty about. How did I ignore such a massive red flag? I was stupid. Really fucking stupid. He's very vengeful. His humour was always off. I think he's probably ill. But at the same time, I don't care if he's ill. The results are the same. I have no sympathy for him.

Post-court case, can you see this paranoia and fear continuing still? You might win the court case, but what next? He sounds unhinged but clever. You are right, he knows exactly what he is doing leaving flowers next to your door. To the outside eye it looks harmless, but it is terrifying you. And starting to affect your daughter - it starts off now not being allowed to play in her own garden, when she gets a bit older is she not going to be allowed to friends houses? To walk to the shops without you? To hang out in town without you? I’m beyond angry on your behalf that he is creating this kind of invisible prison for you both. Clearly you will have to move away because this is no life for either of you. Change your names etc. You shouldn’t have to but it looks like that’s the hand you’re being dealt

Yes. It's the fear of the unknown. At the moment, he's behaving. His lawyer has no doubt warned him that it would damage his case if I went to the police again. But what's going to happen after all this? Will he ever give up? He'll probably move on to someone else at some point. I wouldn't wish him on anyone, though.

It would be such a big ordeal to move, though. My house and business are here. Our friends. Our animals. Everything we know. I keep looking at little houses not far from where we are. But yes, he'd find us. What I have doesn't equate to much in the UK, but it affords us a decent life here. Maybe it would be enough to buy a little house somewhere. I don't know where. I don't have any friends in the UK. I don't even know anyone.

I'll have to have a good think.

Implantation of the law is a joke - just like U.K. companies house which is a joke 🙄
The law allows this but this man creature has abused it and surely there must be some recourse for you after the paternity claim is settled. It could be abuse as he has done this to abuse you, or lying on an official identity document or the that the man is insane, surely there must be punishment and a way to prevent this man from doing this to others.

Speak to the lawyers about local laws is the start I would say. Maybe even go to the newspapers again get legal advice.

This sounds like an absolute nightmare for you to live through and I hope that everything works out. I can totally understand why you want to highlight the underlying issues to make others aware. I think I know where you are and I remember being quite shocked when I heard some of this a few years ago. It seems very odd that quite archaic notions of male power can underpin the law in a westernised country.
You might need to do something anonymously though as you might also not want to stir things with this creep up.
I do think that the first person you need to protect from this kind of thing is your daughter as she grows up, bring her back to the UK, it has it’s faults but this is a major issue.

Yes, I've just been having a quick look on RightMove. Maybe if I got my act together, I could find somewhere to live in the UK. It's doable. It would be a massive headache, but I could do it.