Really don't like dogs being in virtually every cafe now

[Wishididntseemsogrumpy]

I know another one, and yes this is quite trivial really.

Last week we went to a gorgeous new cafe, sat down, and within a minute I realised a large dog had appeared and was licking dds outstretched hand (she was delighted of course) then we had to get up and go and wash before eating, only to see the dog licking her hands again. Argh. Then it turned around and was wagging it's tail into me (I'm unfortunately allergic to fur and would rather not have to have fur on my clothes) - we werent even that close to the other table. It's just so annoying and I know I can ask it's owners to keep it away from us but seems a bit cruel to the dog and I jolly well shouldn't have to, they should be keeping an eye themselves without me having to have an awkward chat. Manners are meant to make everyone feel comfortable and not force people into seeming unreasonable because they don't want to get involved with the animal.

Then this afternoon, different cafe, on my own this time and got the fright of my life when all of a sudden a dog snarled and snapped at a child a few tables away, who of course screamed and was very distressed, someone could have had a heart attack!

I am going to have to be more mindful of places which don't have dogs in future I think.

And I imagine I am probably going to be told I am being unreasonable. I just want a coffee in peace without slobbering or snarling dogs

I love dogs, and have taken dogs into dog friendly cafes. I have also walked out of dog friendly cafes when other people have brought in big dogs that were jumping up and barking. Choices are important. It's good to have some places allow it, other places don't, and to be able to choose where you want to go accordingly

Totally agree with you @Livpool. It is a massive false equivalence. Children are tiny humans learning how to navigate the world and they have a right to be in public spaces with their parents. Using a thread about dogs to take low blows at innocent kids, especially on a parenting site is really poor form.

Can we please get back to the actual topic of dog etiquette now? Does anyone have examples of cafes that get the balance right? Perhaps with designated dog-free zones or clear rules that work for everyone

it is pointless having a companion animal that you will just leave at home alone all the time.
Plus, many dog owners take their dogs on holiday with them. You are not allowed to leave them alone in holiday accommodation.

Again, dog owners having dogs in dog friendly places are doing nothing wrong.

IMHO part of the tension in the UK is that we really lack the set up tthey have in places like the US. They have dedicated dog parks as standard, which we just don't have here. Because we lack these specific facilities, dog owners, parents, and anyone just wanting a quiet coffee gets squeezed into the same small cafes, which inevitably causes friction among different personality types. If some cafes are to allow pets, maybe clear sections and rules would help?

Our local pub/restaurant allows dogs into the pub area (where there are some tables and meals served) but not into the dining room area. The menu is identical in both sections.

That pub sounds like they’ve actually nailed it. Having the exact same menu in both sections is a great idea. Nobody feels like they're getting a lesser experience just because they want (or need) a dog-free space, win win. It’s a shame more places don’t adopt that split room model; it seems like such a simple way to keep everyone happy and avoid the friction.

Where I live there are lots of cafes (3 have outside pavement space) a few have gardens. When my friend had a dog in a pushchair I think she sat outside. To be fair to the dogs most of them have been well behaved.

There are a couple of privately owned dog park facilities near me, but I don't know how well they're used - and of course, there's a fee to use them.

We get a load of dog walkers using what is supposed to be a (football) playing field for children up at the back of the estate (with a shrub/tree area behind).

Many owners do clear up, but we have the usual problem of some owners not clearing up properly - problematic on a football pitch - or chucking the bags into nearby gardens and hedges.

Then there are those who - when their dogs defecate on a grass verge think it's okay just to leave it.

We have an increasing problem with owners actually picking up and packaging the waste but then chucking it on the tarmac path leading from the football pitch to the road and then just driving off. (People from other areas of the town are actually driving here for the purpose of walking/allowing their dogs to defecate.)

There are hedges either side of the path, so I guess that they're taking advantage of the screening.

I heartily agree with you, @Wishididntseemsogrumpy

Agree with this - I went to a place in Eastbourne in the summer that had dog and no dog zones. They are the new smoking in many ways.

@Gonnagetgoingreturnsagain a dog in a push chair is the most stupid thing I have ever heard of. How ridiculous

The dog did have issues with its legs.

I've seen a few pushchairs round here, only for elderly dogs where their little legs cannot keep up with the owner. It seems like a way of overcoming the problem where the dog still has a good quality of life but has slowed up.

https://gigigriffis.com/dogs-allowed-in-restaurants-north-america/#:~:text=USA-,Not%20very%20dog%2Dfriendly.,with%2Ddog%20dining%20in%20winter

Yup, nailed it there. Best of both Worlds and keeps all potential customers happy.

A bit like the holiday cottages on, say, a farm, where they have a few cottages in converted barns, and they have 1 or 2 that are dog-friendly and 1 or 2 that are pet-free. Makes complete sense to be amenable to ALL potential customers, and not choose one and alienate the other. We holiday a lot in the UK and I've seen a lot of listings like that where the listing for one will say "pet friendly" with a weblink to their other saying "pet free alternative" or similar.

A dog in a pushchair is the equivalent of a person in a wheelchair. There is nothing stupid about it at all.

That’s really frustrating about the football pitch. It also perfectly highlights the issue. When there isn't enough dedicated, fenced off space for everyone, different groups end up competing for the same patches of grass.
It’s especially unfair on the kids when a space meant for their sports becomes unusable or unhygienic. . It really reinforces that we need a better national standard for public space planning, rather than just leaving it to private companies to charge a fee or expecting everyone to squeeze into the local park or cafe and make do.

Dog pushchairs are massively useful for various reasons. They benefit dogs who are injured or elderly and struggle to walk long distances but still enjoy being outside. They can offer a safe place to cool down on a hot day out rather than having to leave the dog at home to suffer the heat alone. They are helpful when socialising puppies who are too young to have completed their vaccinations, and they can be a useful way to contain multiple dogs on days out when you're sitting down to eat.

Pity he didn’t do a big blow off just to tip off their day. 😉

@BunnyFrock

Trouble is, this is a rarity. So many untrained dogs around now.

Nail on the head. I don't mind a well trained/behaved dog. We used to have our own dogs when I was younger. But since Covid, I absolute detest all the untrained/out of control dogs that seem to be everywhere - shops, cafes, supermarkets, shopping centres etc - with oblivious owners that don't have any control and seem barely aware of what their dogs are doing, often on those stupid long extendible leads even in enclosed places, with the owner concentrating on something else.

There is an elderly lady that takes her dog out in my local park. Her little dog is also very old, and is in a pram. She wheels him to the park, and gets him out for a sniff about an a little run about with his ball, then wheels him back home again.
Dog prams are great for dogs that can not walk far. They still need to get out.

Same. These threads make it sound like dogs are out to get them all, they must be very unlucky, cursed, or just walking shit magnets.

We had similar with our local league football team (professional not part time) where the manager said he and the other coach had to walk around the training pitch picking up dog shit before the team could start training. Eventually, fund raising among the fans and local sponsors raised enough money to put a fence around the pitch and then there were howls of anguish from the local dog owners that they couldn't access the pitch anymore (which wasn't even public land!). They seemed entitled to expect to be able to use someone else's land as their dogs' toilet! Amazing!

I don’t mind the dogs but it should be the same rules for dogs and children. If they play up, take them out.

I agree @Frequency if a pushchair helps a puppy or an elderly dog get out and about safely, it’s not harming anyone.

I have to admit, it can lead to some really nice moments too. I’d definitely have to do a double take if I leaned over expecting to see a newborn, only to be met with a very hairy face and a wet nose looking back at me! It’s actually quite a sweet surprise once your brain catches up, and as long as everyone has space to move, it seems like a great solution for those dogs that needs it.

There was a dog on a lead in John Lewis's beauty section yesterday, having a big bark.
Quite a few eyes rolling, but the owner seemingly oblivious. 🙄
I was on my way out, so it didn't bother me.