NAMALT. Really? Dig deep and be honest with yourself. AMALT

[NoEggs]

I love my DH. He’s a great guy and we’ve been happy for many years.

But
He’s not perfect. Doesn’t do the laundry. Defaults to letting me make stuff happen etc. etc.

Now even if your partner is a paragon I would argue that the species ‘men’ will generally default to slightly bloody useless.

AIBU?

Could you elaborate more on why you think these above traits (relentless obsession with detail, refusal to see the bigger picture, presumption that safety is always better than other options, relational aggression, sense of superiority to men, lack of ability to play straight, lack of ability to say what they mean and tendency to slyness and martyrdom ) mean women are a greater force for evil?

I personally think most people are in the middle as you said. I agree there are many bad women, and I'm sorry you've come across so many.

But you yourself admit that men tend to be more at extreme ends, and are more likely to rape and murder. Violent crime is overwhelmingly committed by a subset of men.

Why do you think that lack of ability to say what they mean, relational aggression, sense of superiority to men, preference for safety, lack of big picture thinking etc are more harmful than those things?

If you just mean all men are a bit flawed, well yes they are. I’m not perfect myself. Are you?

Yes, this.
I am not sure what you are trying to say OP-do you mean men are all inherently evil/awful? or do you mean they are flawed human beings and some have selfish tendencies, because we all have those.

My H and I are far from perfect but he is not selfish - he does all the cooking, did more than his 50% of the child care and does loads around the house. I didnt have to nag him. for that, he just does it.

Perhaps it makes you feel better to think that AMALT

I always think this when I read thread like this slating men as one homogenous group, who Mothered all these pathetic men?

Perfect. 10/10, no notes 🤣👏

If these things happened in my house it would be dealing with it all. I don't understand why having a penis means someone would be more capable at ringing a builder or plumber?

I hate threads like this. It’s pure misandry.

Imagine a thread where this wasn’t a woman denigrating all men, claiming to be “more perfect”, but a white person denigrating all black people in the same way. Everyone would be rightly appalled by the overt racism and the thread would get deleted in minutes.

People, like the OP, who believe they and their group (whether selected by sex, race or religion etc) are so much better than their counterparts tend to lack self-awareness; and have a smug sense of superiority that is insufferable to others.

"Sexists of both gender are tiresome."
I agree with @GaIadriel

Yes. I’ve generally understood NAMALT to refer to overt misogyny and perversion rather than to domestic laziness.

I think the Epstein files and Gisele Pelicot and Grok porn and the sheer scale of online misogyny and perversion have illustrated that ALOMALT (a lot of men are like that). Probably not all, but I think the proportion is much higher than a lot of us estimate, and a lot of men are deterred from behaving in the way they want to purely by law, not by moral character.

So often, when a man does something awful, we hear people say that he seemed so nice and normal. Wayne Couzens’ wife said that she noticed nothing wrong before or after he killed Sarah Everard and they had a lovely life together. But he was watching brutal pornography and planning the savage kidnap, rape and murder of a complete stranger. You can’t ever see inside a man’s head, and I think a lot of women are naive about what might be going on in there.

YABVU. There are some amazing men and awful women.

Impossible to generalise in this way. My husband is more ‘perfect’ than me!

I feel pretty hopeless about men as a species but I have to say that my husband and my step dad are both very decent men and not in any way useless! My DH works hard but is also a very present father and helpful husband in terms of doing chores, mental load and being very supportive of me. My step dad is now a devoted carer to my mother and wonderful grandfather.

i honestly think they are in the minority but it gives me hope that men can be decent when I have seen so much to suggest the contrary.

My DP was primary carer for his kids for years and then fairly much solo carer when his ex moved away. So he's able to organise school admin, make dinners, clean the house and do the laundry.
He's also not great at these things. So he does enough to get by but they aren't probably done to the standards I see my some of my SAHM friends maintain. He's terrible at noticing stuff that needs doing but will cheerfully do anything if prompted.
Personally I think it's fine. He has other attributes. If there's a zombie apocalypse then there's no one who'd be better .. he's resourceful and practical and seems to know an incredible amount of random useful stuff.
Ultimately it's a bell curve isn't it. Some men are good at this stuff, some men are terrible and some in-between. Are women probably "taught" or socialised to be better? Probably. Hence many are. But it's never all of them either way.

Completely agree
Me and DH play to our strengths same as you guys
I do everything with kids ,I got up in night to feed and change babies ,he didn't because he goes to work .
I do washing ,he does bins
I do school stuff he mows grass
He earns money
I stay home and look after disabled adult kids
I buy all presents for both families including mother's day for his mum
He walks the dogs
We share money ,we both buy groceries
We just work together for the best needs of the family
It's who ever can do it best, just does it ..end of
Don't have any issues particularly..
Well we don't agree about politics,I've posted before about him being to far left for my liking..but as long as we avoid that subject all is good in the family 🤣

May I also ask, do you think women are more likely to feel superior to men than men are to feel superior to women, then?

He sounds super!

It depends on what exactly you mean.

I am male and I do most of the laundry and other housework, but I am also a serial killer so it's swings and roundabouts.

I guess you have to be really good at cleaning, DNA evidence is a bastard to get rid of.

But do you pass your KPIs

I dont think that poster is saying you must have a penis to ring a builder or plumber.

She is saying that her and her husband work as a team and she does the things around the house she feels comfortable with and he does the things he feels comfortable with. She also mentioned that she's ill and probably hasn't got the energy to deal with household crises like that.

Therefore they work together in partnership rather than one person doing it all. I am not sure what's so wrong about that? of course, if you are single then everything falls on you, that can't be helped but if you live with someone its perfectly reasonable to expect tasks to be shared, no?

I agree with you @NoEggs

I've worn a groove around the block as I am old and I never cease to be disappointed by men.

I'm married and have stopped trying to get him to do anything beyond default to lazy bastard as I'm sick of the sound of my own voice.

Unfortunately, I agree. I think it's coded into most of them. There are good ones. But I think they're in the minority. 25% or less. I've never had a partner/boyfriend that was a good one. One of mine was harmless (as in not violent, a drunk, dangerous) but as far as adulting in the way women do? No.

Agree with this. I do/did lots of the child/life/school/house admin and domestic stuff but equally DH probably does 100% of the DIY, probably more dog walks than me, more general garden maintenance and some ‘blue’ jobs such as taking stuff to the tip etc. He will always help with chores if I ask.

We don’t really keep count as we’re a team and I can see that he’s not sitting around on his backside doing nothing. There are definitely good men out there.

I guess I’m more of the man in our relationship if we’re just looking at housework.

I always thought NAMALT was more about rape and violence personally so no I 100% think NAMALT. But I would never use ‘NAMALT’ if someone is sharing their story of rape or abuse. That would be pretty fucking shitty. It’s a shitty, dismissive phrase really.

Out of interest, what attracts you to MN then? It's well known to be heavily dominated by women, and odds on that most of what you read and engage with here will be from women. If I felt that way, it wouldn't be my choice, given the plethora of online spaces dominated by men.

Whatever side you are on, can we just all agree that your individual experience with your own spouse will not form a general truth about the entire population? Yes, even if you are old and wise, and yes, even if you had many-many spouses. Your experience is your experience (with individuals who have nothing to do with the behaviour of other individuals of the same sex).

What is that Gary? Are you you pretending you have a PhD in the field of "how women truly work" again, because your wife is nagging you to fix that shelf you promised 6 months ago and you can't take the pitch of her voice? Oh, sorry Sarah, are being a mindless, chauvinistic pigs because the last 3 of the overgrown man-children you dated turned out to only see a potential sex partner in you, and lie about it? These are unfortunate experiences, but your experience is not a general truth, not an objective reality.

As other pps said before me, extremes who think either is better than the other are tiresome and just sad.

My DF worked a very high pressure City job but always made dinner, was home in the evening, went to every parents' evening. It always makes me roll my eyes when people say a man has such a big job he can't contribute. He got up at 4am every day so he would be able to get home on time.

But my ex was like that - when I texted him to ask him to do something, MIL would reply instead and passive aggressively try to make me feel unreasonable!! (eg 'oh I'm so sorry, I can certainly try to come round and do X for you if would be helpful')