Are we setting autistic children up to fail?

[JandJay]

I say this as a mother with 2 autistic children.
my youngest is 8 but my eldest is 25.
Thinking about my eldest at school there was so much understanding and kindness, exceptions were made for him and he was accepted for his differences.
At work there is no such thing and life has been tough for him.
Our daughter is also autistic, she’s only at primary school but has the same understanding and supportive approach at school which makes her feel accepted right now but I can’t help thinking it’s only autistic children that have that support and understanding and once they are adults they are not seen as the vulnerable children they once were and have a very harsh reality when they held to the expectation of everyone else as adults.

I used to think it was good that we had SEN in schools now, especially as I was undiagnosed and had a terrible school experience, i’m not saying that was better but being an autistic adult is hard, are we not just shielding them from the reality of adulthood?

i have ASD before I was self employed I did get “reasonable adjustments” but to be honest I still struggled. Self employed is the way to go if you’re autistic and lower support needs.

School is for teaching and work is about productivity and lining the pockets of the already rich!

I think finding work can be difficult for everyone but employers aren’t as lenient about making the workplace fit the person as schools can be.

I think it really helps if they can avoid trauma during education and make it through with some qualifications.
And schools aren't always that kind and amazing. Many children really struggle. I would be pushing for more understanding, if anything.
Being able to be in an environment that isn't harmful, and being around people who respect your needs means you know how much that benefits you and you can look for those environments as an adult.

A few months ago in discussion with my son’s teacher she said ‘he was uncomfortable but we managed to keep him going.’ She was very surprised when I thanked her and said ‘life is uncomfortable and we need to support (son) to get used to that feeling, he’ll never get anywhere if we allow him to learn it’s ok to avoid it.’ She was very surprised as many people like to shield their sen children from difficult situations, in my view there is a balance to be had but there is no good just letting them this the world would just flex around them when that is just not the case.

They need to be nurtured and have thwir needs met so they can learn.

Depends on how severely their autism effects them - if they be able to work, run house etc or if they will need on gojng significant support.

My kids will have to make their way as their asd wont stop this however its my job as their parent to mke sure they have the tools and skills to manage their autism in different situations in the real world, which we do talk about. Like taking breaks in noisy situations, making sure they have their noise cancelling earbuds, their glasses for if things re too bright. Them learning how to adapt to situations to make themselves as comfortable as possible within reasons in everyday settings

Learning to manage their mental health if overwhelmed etc

They aren't adults in school though, they are children.

I don’t know what the future holds for DS. But I do know what having attended two good supportive schools with a watertight ehcp has given him the best chance of being the best him he can be as an adult.

Having young people unsupported in education is highly unlikely to lead to good outcomes long term.

DS1 is ASD, not diagnosed until mid 20s when life unravelled for him. He went to a supportive, small prep and whilst I always suspected ASD, the school suited him and coped with his idiosyncrasies. As an teenager the wheels started to fall off and his mental health started to dip. He is now in his 30s with BPD/ASD. Adult life isn't easy, he is terrible in relationships, work, hes brilliant until he's not.
Realistically, workplaces employ to do a job, they aren't therapeutic centres, it is contractual, they pay you to do the job, you 'sell' your skills and time. If you can't do that without 'support ' they will find someone who can. Harsh but realistic.

So, unless kids are also taught skills to function without continuing support they will struggle.

I voted YABU because (as a non-autistic person) I don't think we should be making schools less inclusive, I think we should be making workplaces more inclusive.

I have a number of autistic people within my team. Yes, their communication style is a bit different sometimes, but they bring different strengths which others don't have.

As a society, we need to learn how to make the most of everyone's talents. Teaching kids to mask and conform while struggling silently cannot be the answer.

Life will be even harder without qualifications, supporting autistic children to reach their full potential is crucial.

My autistic kids were missed and they got nothing at school, all were late diagnosed in their teens following serious mental illness. If they had been better supported prior to this I am convinced the awful struggles they’ve had could have been avoided.

I absolutely agree that having the support in place is beneficial but I think we’ve lost sight that the young adults struggling today are the children of yesterday that were supported and accepted, it seems to come to an abrupt end when they are no longer children and they are not prepared for that, just seeing the comfort in my 8yo from all the support and understanding of her struggles reminds me of my 25yo who had that comfort but is now struggling in the work place and feels completely out of his depth at work and tries so hard to fit in and they think he doesn’t know they just ridicule him.

Perhaps instead of asking about making school harder for children we should be looking at what reasonable adjustments can be made in workplaces to help people who are neurodiverse

Exactly this, the same as for every other disability. Would you tell somebody with a physical disability struggling at work that life should have been made harder for them at school?

Instead of being tougher on SEN kids we need to reform workplaces to be easier places to work. It would benefit all of us (not just autistic people) to have more flexible and accepting places to work.

I don't agree with the cruel to be kind approach, let's just be better to everyone.

I can see both sides. I work in a primary school where we bend over backwards to meet the needs of sen children. They are always a priority. However for many of them who go onto mainstream secondary, they then struggle with the transition because they don't have staff constantly adapting to them and they can't cope (there isn't always an available adult in secondary to take them out for a walk, kick a ball around, say it's ok to do the work when they feel like it rather than at the set time). So while I can see that maybe the solution is better support is needed to continue with them throughout all their education, I think there also needs to be better coping strategies for not relying on an adult. For some children (not all) I feel it's a bit like the example of not just buying food for people in poverty in other countries but giving them the seeds and equipment to grow their own. Buying them food only feeds them once, giving the skills is then there for life.

The children I worry most about are the lower abilities who aren't sen and get no support. They are the ones lost in the classroom but due to other demands staff just don't always get around to helping them or giving them the full attention they need.

Gosh no, I was undiagnosed and had a horrible experience at school, my point was that as children the support is there and they are accepted but as adults they are not accepted as they are and the expectation is that they will fit in regardless so that acceptance as an individual they are used to pulled them from them as society doesn’t work like that.

I dont think having a less supportive school experience would make the unsupported workplace better though. It would just be two difficult experiences instead of one.

I know we like to link school and work but education has merit in its own right.

No, but equally physically disabled people are usually incredibly resourceful efficient to deal with the situation they find themselves in and do as much as possible for themselves. Some children with SEN are taught to rely on the adults around them and never develop (or are modelled) coping strategies. This doesn't help long term. Look at the youth unemployment rate.

It sounds like your son has awful colleagues, I am sorry.
It is one thing for businesses, who have to make a.profit, to have high performance expectations but adults should never be ridiculing a colleague for any reason, much less additional needs.

Autistic children are hugely resourceful and efficient day in and day out.Autism is battled with continuously and often ignored. They get in reality very little from schools.

That's the fault of the arseholes he works with, not of his positive school experience.

It's sad your oldest isn't in a workplace where adjustments aren't - or can't - be made for him and he doesn't feel accepted.

I have far more reasonable adjustments, kindness, and acceptance of me both individually and around my disabilities than I ever had in school. My DS1 and DD1 (both autistic young adults) both have more acceptance at work than they ever had at school.

It can take longer to find those suitable workplaces, and for quite a few it's still sadly a significant fight to get there, but I think for many of us they do exist. I don't think we're setting our kid up to fail to set that standard for them. If anything, they need the language to be able to discuss accommodations once they're in the workplace.

Some autistic children get shitlaods from schools, way over and above what they really should need to access mainstream education. 1:1 support ends up leading to less independence not more in most cases. There is so much more acceptance in school than the wider world. Like PPs describe, kids are heavily supported through primary, and when that experience can't be replicated at secondary, parents complain like mad. "why can't Bill have a named adult he can go to anytime of the day?"..... "because there literally isn't one". Few businesses would contemplate employing someone who needed a 1:1 with them all day every day.

People expect the world from school. The reality is one human in charge of 32 other humans all day every day. There's a limit to what that one human can do. No one ever stops to consider the overwhelm, cognitive load, epic numbers of micro decisions that teachers need to make minute in and out of every day. Never mind if the teacher is autistic....!

That does sound like quite poor sen provision though? My sons provision has always focused on him trying to do as much as possible himself but he is at special school.

(There will be children with send that will always be reliant on an adult, some living in residential care or supported living and others needing less support and thats ok)

No, I don't think we should roll the clock back to less support. Shitting on kids now because they will face arseholes in work is not a policy I would support. I don't believe my school trauma makes me a better individual either. Check out "a different spectrum: on social media for a man who needs to take his cuddly amd ear defenders to work. He is a.bag content checker for an airline amd finds his autistic talents for pattern recognition and love of repitition.